STATE OF FLORIDA
DIVISION OF ADMINISTRATIVE HEARINGS
SUGAR CANE GROWERS COOPERATIVE )
OF FLORIDA, a Florida )
Agricultural Cooperative )
Marketing Association, ROTH )
FARMS, INC., AND WEDGWORTH )
FARMS, INC., )
)
and )
)
FLORIDA SUGAR CANE LEAGUE, INC.;)
UNITED STATES SUGAR CORPORATION;)
and NEW HOPE SOUTH, INC., ) CASE NOS. 92-3038
) 92-3039
and ) 92-3040
)
FLORIDA FRUIT AND VEGETABLE )
ASSOCIATION, LEWIS POPE FARMS, )
W.E. SCHLECHTER & SONS, INC., )
and HUNDLEY FARMS, INC., )
)
Petitioners, )
)
vs. )
)
SOUTH FLORIDA WATER MANAGEMENT )
DISTRICT, an Agency of the State)
of Florida, )
)
Respondent, )
)
and )
)
MICCOSUKEE TRIBE OF INDIANS OF )
FLORIDA, the UNITED STATES OF )
AMERICA, and FLORIDA DEPARTMENT )
OF ENVIRONMENTAL REGULATION, )
and the FLORIDA WILDLIFE )
FEDERATION, )
)
Intervenors. )
________________________________)
DEPOSITION OF RUSSELL B. RADER, PH.D.
DEPOSITION OF RUSSELL B. RADER, PH.D.
250 Australian Avenue South
Clearlake Center
Suite 1403
West Palm Beach, Florida
November 5, 1992
9:23 A.M.
A P P E A R A N C E S:
FOR PETITIONERS FLORIDA SUGAR CANE LEAGUE, INC.;
UNITED STATES SUGAR CORPORATION; and NEW HOPE
SOUTH, INC.:
PEEPLES, EARL & BLANK
BY: WILLIAM L. HYDE, ESQ.
One Biscayne Tower
Suite 3636
Two South Biscayne Boulevard
Miami, Florida 33131
(305) 358-3000
FOR RESPONDENT-INTERVENOR THE UNITED STATES OF
AMERICA:
UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE
VICKI O'MEARA,
ACTING ASSISTANT ATTORNEY GENERAL
AND
LINDA COLLINS HERTZ,
ACTING UNITED STATES ATTORNEY
BY: SUZAN HILL PONZOLI,
ASSISTANT UNITED STATES ATTORNEY
Southern District of Florida
155 South Miami Avenue
Suite 627
Miami, Florida 33130-1693
(305) 536-4425
A P P E A R A N C E S (continued):
FOR THE WITNESS, DUKE UNIVERSITY, AND THE DUKE
WETLAND CENTER:
GUNSTER, YOAKLEY & STEWART, P.A.
BY: DAVID P. ACKERMAN, ESQ.
Phillips Point
Suite 500 East
777 South Flagler Drive
P.O. Box 4587
West Palm Beach, Florida 33402-4587
(407) 650-0541
ALSO PRESENT:
RONALD D. JONES, PH.D.
MARK MAFFEI, PH.D.
HERBERT J. GRIMSHAW, PH.D.
1 The deposition of RUSSELL B. RADER, PH.D., a
2 witness of lawful age, taken for the purpose of discovery
3 and for use as evidence in the above-styled cause,
4 pending in the Division of Administrative Hearings, State
5 of Florida, pursuant to Notice, before Pamela S. Wilson,
6 Notary Public in and for the State of Florida at Large,
7 at the time and place aforesaid.
8 * * * * * * *
9 I N D E X
10 WITNESS DIRECT
11 RUSSELL B. RADER, PH.D.
(By Ms. Ponzoli) 7
12
13
14 E X H I B I T S
15 RADER EXHIBIT FOR IDENTIFICATION
1(1-7) Deposition Notice 9
16 2(1-4) Witness's CV 21
3(1-9) "The Effects of Nutrient Enrichment
17 on Algae and Macroinvertebrates
in the Everglades: A Review" 24
18 4(1-43) "The Effects of Nutrient Enrichment
on Algae and Macroinvertebrates
19 in the Everglades: A Review" 24
5(1-30) "The Effects of Eutrophication
20 on Algae and Macroinvertebrates
in the Everglades" 24
21 6(1-3) Correspondence between the witness
and Dr. de la Cruz in 4-92
22 7(1-2) Letter dated February 6 24
8(1-41) "The Effects of Nutrient Enrichment
23 on Algae and Macroinvertebrates
in the Everglades: A Review" 24
24 9(1-54) "The Effects of Nutrient Enrichment
on Algae and Macroinvertebrates
25 in the Everglades: A Review" 24
10 Letter dated May 14, 1992 24
1 E X H I B I T S
2 RADER EXHIBIT FOR IDENTIFICATION
11(1-11) Correspondence re: "The Effects of
3 Eutrophication . . ." 24
12(1-10) "Guide to Electronic Manuscript
4 Preparation" 24
13(1-65) Unpublished paper entitled "Changes
5 in Invertebrates and Small Fish
Along a Nutrient Enrichment Gradient
6 in the Everglades" 24
14(1-7) Paper entitled "The Effects of
7 Agricultural Run-off on Small Fish
and Macroinvertebrates in the
8 Everglades" 24
15(1-7) Initial copy of Exhibit No. 14 24
9 16 Abstract entitled "SWS '92" 24
17 Abstract entitled "Intecol '92" 24
10 18 Abstract Form 24
19(1-68) Quarterly report folder 24
11 20(1-39) Site notes and site coordinates 49
21(1-3) Invertebrate samples 49
12 22(1-10) Core data and miscellaneous notes 49
23(1-38) Inventory of samples 49
13 24(1-75) Documents entitled "Preliminary
Analyses" 49
14 25(1-174) Documents entitled "Preliminary" 49
26(1-113) Documents entitled "2nd Step -
15 Gradient Study" 49
27(1-17) Summary of data 49
16 28(1-57) Final summary and analysis of data 49
29 Calculations (cover only -
17 exhibit later subdivided) 49
30(1-62) Cores data 49
18 31(1-210) Oxygen and pH data 49
32(1-60) Notes on identification of species 49
19 33(1-7) Notes from field book 49
34(1-18) Summary of weekly meetings 49
20 35(1-5) Summaries of experimental designs 49
36(1-2) Map with sites circled 51
21 37(1-63) Percent similarity calculations 62
38(1-18) Rarity index 64
22 39(1-10) Summary data 64
40(1-62) Summary tables 65
23 41(1-16) Summary tables 66
42 Map of Water Conservation
24 Areas 1, 2, and 3 72
43(1-13) Slides primarily on invertebrate
25 data 84
44(1-9) Summary tables 84
1 E X H I B I T S
2 RADER EXHIBIT FOR IDENTIFICATION
45(1-14) Tables and figures 84
3 46(1-10) Figures and tables 84
47(1-13) Slides prepared for presentations 84
4 48(1-14) Slides and outlines prepared
for presentations 84
5 49(1-3) Printout of Disk No. 1 menus 96
50 Printout of Disk No. 2 menus 96
6 51(1-8) Printout of Disk No. 3 menus 96
52(1-2) Printout of Disk No. 4 menus 96
7 53(1-13) Printout of Disk No. 5 menus 96
54(1-9) Printout of Disk No. 6 menus 96
8 55(1-3) Printout of Disk No. 7 menus 96
56(1-17) Printout of Disk No. 8 menus 96
9 57 Miscellaneous slides 115
58 Miscellaneous slides 115
10 59 Miscellaneous slides 115
60 Miscellaneous slides 115
11 61 Miscellaneous and fertilizer slides 115
62 Fertilizer slides 115
12 63 Fertilizer slides 115
64 Talk/data slides 115
13 65 Talk/data slides 115
66 Talk/data slides 115
14 67 Dosing study slides 115
68 Dosing study slides 115
15 69 Dosing study slides 115
70 Dosing study slides 115
16 71 Dosing study slides 115
72 Dosing study slides and blanks 115
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
1 Whereupon:
2 RUSSELL B. RADER, PH.D.,
3 was called as a witness by the Respondent-Intervenor and,
4 having been first duly sworn, was examined and testified
5 as follows:
6 DIRECT EXAMINATION
7 BY MS. PONZOLI:
8 Q Sir, would you state your full name for the
9 record.
10 A Russell B. Rader.
11 Q And your address, Dr. Rader.
12 A Work or at home?
13 Q I think your work address would be --
14 A 16139 Okeechobee Boulevard -- let's see.
15 We're in Loxahatchee, Florida.
16 Q Your phone number there?
17 A 790-0843.
18 Q By whom are you employed, Dr. Rader?
19 A Duke University.
20 Q Dr. Rader, I'm Suzan Hill Ponzoli. I
21 represent the United States in the SWIM challenges. I'll
22 be asking you today, really, to identify the multiple
23 documents that you have produced in response to the
24 Notice Duces Tecum.
25 Have you ever had your deposition taken
7ÿ
1 before, Dr. Rader?
2 A No.
3 Q If you do not understand a question, it's
4 important that you indicate that to me because we will
5 assume that you understood the question when you answer,
6 and I will be happy to try and frame a better question
7 for you if you're having difficulty understanding my
8 question.
9 A Okay.
10 Q You are represented here by one or two
11 counsel.
12 What is it, gentlemen?
13 MR. ACKERMAN: My name is David Ackerman. I
14 represent the witness for the limited purpose of
15 assisting the witness in protecting the
16 confidentiality of certain trade-secrets
17 documents, which we'll talk about in a second,
18 but I also represent Duke University and the Duke
19 Wetland Center.
20 I have no representation of the witness or
21 any of those parties in connection with the
22 merits of this case or the outcome of this case
23 and don't know very much about it at all.
24 MR. HYDE: My purpose in being here is on behalf
25 of the petitioners, Florida Sugar Cane League,
8ÿ
1 U.S. Sugar Corporation, and New Hope South, Inc.
2 Dr. Rader is one of our listed witnesses, and
3 that is obviously the reason why we are here
4 today.
5 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Dr. Rader, have you seen a
6 copy of the Renotice of Taking Deposition Duces Tecum
7 that should have been served on you?
8 A Yes.
9 Q Let me have it marked for identification,
10 and let's go through it together.
11 What we have been doing, gentlemen, in the
12 prior depositions at which I was in attendance,
13 possibly with the exception of Dr. Parks's, is we
14 have been calling them Johnson Exhibit 1, Johnson
15 Exhibit 2 and --
16 MR. HYDE: Fine.
17 MS. PONZOLI: -- this would be Rader Exhibit 1.
18 MR. HYDE: That's fine.
19 MS. PONZOLI: So we will number them in that
20 manner.
21 (Rader Exhibit 1(1-7) was marked
22 for identification by the reporter and is
23 included herewith.)
24 MS. PONZOLI: Mr. Ackerman, do you want to make a
25 statement on the record?
9ÿ
1 MR. ACKERMAN: I just wanted to give the witness
2 an instruction about the documents that he has
3 produced.
4 Our intent is to file some sort of a
5 Motion for Protective Order as to the documents
6 that Dr. Rader has produced to which we would
7 claim the trade-secrets privilege under the
8 Florida Evidence Code. Because Dr. Rader has
9 already produced those documents, they're
10 obviously in the stream of documents in this
11 litigation, but we will be asking the hearing
12 officer to limit their use for purposes of the
13 litigation only and not to allow their use for
14 outside scientific, commercial, or
15 patent-oriented uses.
16 Dr. Rader has not had the opportunity to
17 provide me with a list of those documents but
18 plans to, and I'm going to ask him today, in
19 answering questions about the documents, to let
20 you know when he comes across a document that
21 would fall within that privilege. And we'll take
22 up at a later time the filing of the motion and
23 the briefing on it.
24 The other instruction that I would give
25 him would concern the three pieces of paper which
10ÿ
1 we did not produce yesterday during the
2 deposition of Robert Johnson. Those were two
3 documents. One was a schematic, and the other
4 one was a parts list. I understand Dr. Rader has
5 no personal knowledge about the details of those
6 two documents and could not testify very much
7 about those at all.
8 So to the extent that any specifics of
9 those documents pop into your mind, I'm going to
10 instruct you not to provide that information.
11 Any question that you are asked about those,
12 please provide the lawyers with all of the
13 personal knowledge and information you have about
14 those with the sole and narrow exception of the
15 details contained within the schematic and parts
16 list that Mr. Johnson is concerned about.
17 And lastly, I will say, because I'm going
18 to be leaving, that we've had no involvement in
19 compliance with the subpoena, and if an issue
20 comes up, I'm available to the extent that I can
21 be helpful. Thanks.
22 MS. PONZOLI: Is it accurate, Mr. Ackerman, that
23 the compliance with the subpoena has been handled
24 by Mr. Hyde's firm?
25 MR. ACKERMAN: I would assume so.
11ÿ
1 MS. PONZOLI: You do not know?
2 MR. ACKERMAN: I do not know.
3 MR. HYDE: I can represent that that is indeed
4 the case. I have not had anything to do with
5 Mr. Johnson's documents that Mr. Ackerman
6 referred to a few moments ago, and even if I had
7 seen them, I wouldn't understand them anyway.
8 MS. PONZOLI: Mr. Ackerman, I would just like to
9 put on the record that I can certainly understand
10 Dr. Rader's concern. I assume this is over his
11 raw data and the use of it by someone else for
12 duplication purposes. That is my assumption. I
13 can certainly sympathize with that, but I would
14 like the record to reflect that this particular
15 litigation has evolved in many forms.
16 As we are all well aware, it started in
17 Federal Court and federal scientists have, for
18 years now, been compelled by, in particular,
19 Mr. Hyde's firm to produce their raw data and the
20 results of all their personal research into the
21 public stream of information. And the dominant
22 reason for that production was that it was data
23 generated by public funds and therefore felt to
24 belong to the public.
25 Those scientists felt those same painful
12ÿ
1 experiences of years of hard work being turned
2 into the public domain, but it was done. And I
3 believe, in fairness, this issue is on the other
4 foot, and perhaps it is only fair that the data
5 generated at the public's expense, which it is
6 the EPD which I understand to have funded
7 Dr. Rader's work, would again belong to the
8 public domain.
9 I want this on the record simply because
10 it is a fact that has gone on in the ongoing
11 process of this public debate over the nature of
12 the Everglades and the problems and the
13 resolution. And I guess we'll have to deal with
14 the briefs when they're filed.
15 MR. ACKERMAN: The only thing I would add is that
16 we would certainly entertain any discussions
17 about documents that your side has produced about
18 which the scientists are concerned insofar as
19 arriving at a reciprocal arrangement. I would
20 certainly be willing to pursue discussions like
21 that or any other discussions designed to resolve
22 the issues short of briefing and a hearing
23 officer.
24 MS. PONZOLI: Certainly.
25 MR. ACKERMAN: But I appreciate your position.
13ÿ
1 MR. HYDE: I'd like you to know that Dr. Rader is
2 producing all his documents here today. There is
3 no question here about our depriving the
4 respondents of any access to any of his
5 information or data.
6 Secondly, I don't think that,
7 Ms. Ponzoli's concerns about the data generated
8 by the federal scientists notwithstanding,
9 there's any credible claim that that information
10 or data has been misused for someone else's
11 proprietary purposes or commercial advantage, and
12 there's certainly no intent that that ever occur.
13 We are seeking -- or I think what Duke
14 Wetland Center and Dr. Rader are seeking is that
15 their information not be provided to some
16 commercial or professional advantage.
17 MS. PONZOLI: I really have to tell you that I've
18 been around this block with my own scientists so
19 many times that I pretty much understand the
20 issues that are at stake here.
21 MR. HYDE: Well, it's all part of the publish or
22 perish process of academia --
23 MS. PONZOLI: Right.
24 MR. HYDE: -- not solely --
25 MS. PONZOLI: It's not so much a commercial
14ÿ
1 advantage as a professional use of it, and I
2 think we're just going to have to see if we can
3 resolve it among ourselves. I do believe there
4 are some of my scientists that feel they have
5 suffered that impediment, in fact, but let me see
6 how they feel.
7 And if there is protection that can be
8 offered to them in exchange for the research
9 generated under the Environmental Protection
10 District or the Everglades Protection District --
11 MR. HYDE: Yes.
12 MS. PONZOLI: -- and if that's possible, that
13 would certainly be desirable.
14 MR. ACKERMAN: I agree with that.
15 MR. HYDE: It would be desirable to come up with
16 an agreement that would take care of all of those
17 problems --
18 MS. PONZOLI: Okay.
19 MR. HYDE: -- so we don't have to deal with this
20 in the future.
21 MS. PONZOLI: There's no intention to cause that.
22 MR. ACKERMAN: Thank you for your time.
23 MS. PONZOLI: I would like to -- I think it will
24 just be easier, Mr. Ackerman, if you wait one
25 second.
15ÿ
1 Q Dr. Rader, do you have any knowledge of the
2 three pages that were withheld as, quote, trade secrets
3 by Mr. Johnson yesterday?
4 A Knowledge of them?
5 Q Yes.
6 A As in whether they exist or not?
7 Q What do you know about them? Why don't you
8 tell me that.
9 A I have -- I don't think I've even seen them.
10 Q You simply know that there are such pages
11 that are in dispute?
12 A That's all I know.
13 Q And you do not know what they look like or
14 what's on the three pages?
15 A No idea, no -- well, other than they're
16 electronic diagrams pertaining to the dosing study.
17 That's the full extent of my understanding.
18 MS. PONZOLI: That's fine.
19 MR. ACKERMAN: Okay. Thanks.
20 (Whereupon Mr. Ackerman left the deposition
21 proceedings.)
22 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Dr. Rader, I would ask you
23 to look at the Rader Exhibit No. 1. I would like to go
24 through this. Is it your understanding, Dr. Rader, that
25 you have produced all documents in response to this
16ÿ
1 Notice Duces Tecum?
2 A Yes.
3 Q As I explained to you prior to the
4 deposition starting, because you have some number of
5 computer disks that were produced to my office, I guess,
6 the day before -- yes. I'm not sure if it's yesterday,
7 day before yesterday. And because the slides are several
8 hundred slides --
9 A I don't think it's that many. But 50.
10 Q Oh, you only have about 50 slides?
11 A I think so.
12 Q Well, your 50 slides were produced yesterday
13 in addition to the hard copy of raw data and certain
14 articles that exist here. The intention for the
15 beginning of your deposition is that it would really be a
16 document identification, that you will identify these
17 documents in response to the different requests and
18 identify which data belongs to which categories so that
19 we may sit and go through your documents in some rational
20 fashion before questioning you substantively, which will
21 in all probability occur in December.
22 A I have a question about the slides. I have
23 copies of the disks, but those are my original slides.
24 Q Right.
25 A When would I be receiving those?
17ÿ
1 MR. HYDE: They're going to be, just for
2 purposes -- we didn't discuss those. They're to
3 be delivered here this morning by Federal Express
4 courier. I don't know what time Federal Express
5 gets to this office, but it's supposed to be
6 sometime this morning.
7 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Just so you are aware, in
8 the process by which the parties exchange documents,
9 neither party ever takes possession of the other party's
10 documents.
11 A Uh-huh.
12 Q They are sent to a commercial copier who, at
13 the instruction of both your attorney's and my office,
14 will make duplicate copies of them. That was done with
15 your slides. I have a set of slides that should be
16 arriving here prior to your set this morning, and we will
17 probably talk from my duplicate set. But at no time did
18 I ever have possession of your original documents.
19 A Okay. I was just wondering when I get them
20 back.
21 Q Yes. All right. I would like -- and I know
22 this may be difficult for you, Dr. Rader, but it's very
23 important to us, and I think in a while it will be
24 important to you, when we do your substantive deposition,
25 that you make sure that everything that you did produce
18ÿ
1 has somehow been copied here and that we have possession
2 of. If you believe there's a gap, I don't think Mr. Hyde
3 will have any problem in providing that gap, refilling it
4 so that we have a full set of your documents.
5 A Well --
6 Q I am concerned that, because of the multiple
7 productions, it would be hard to be sure that we have it
8 all.
9 A You know, I went to my files and, to the
10 best of my knowledge, gave you everything that I had that
11 pertained to the Everglades.
12 Q Right.
13 A I don't memorize each and every one. I
14 don't have it cataloged in my brain. As you can see,
15 it's a lot of material; so if something is missing here,
16 all I can say is, to the best of my knowledge, I gave it
17 to you and whether something got lost or not, can I go
18 through and --
19 Q That's what I'm asking.
20 A If you're asking me to make sure if
21 everything's there that I gave you, I don't know.
22 Q I'm asking you to make an effort.
23 A Okay.
24 Q It may be there's a dominant piece of
25 publication, and as we go to through the four to six
19ÿ
1 inches of hard copy, you'll realize and say, "Mr. Hyde,
2 Ms. Ponzoli" --
3 A I can do that.
4 Q -- "my publication is not here."
5 And Mr. Hyde will turn it over to me. Or if
6 there is a critical set of your data that you know exists
7 that you believe you turned over to someone to turn over
8 to us, and somehow, in the translation, we don't find it
9 today, we need to fill that gap. That's what I'm asking.
10 I'm not asking that every sheet be accounted for because
11 I realize that may be very difficult for you.
12 A Okay.
13 Q That's what I'm asking.
14 A Your question makes we want to run home and
15 make sure I gave you everything. I hope I got it all.
16 Q We have not lost anything, but it's because
17 we do the things in the same manner that nothing gets
18 lost. All right.
19 The documents to be produced -- let's start
20 first with a copy of your CV or similar document. If we
21 could pull that from the pile, and let's mark it for
22 identification, and we'll just keep moving. I won't
23 question you on it at this time.
24 A Okay. I didn't see it in this stack, my CV.
25 Was it in here?
20ÿ
1 Q Why don't you just hand me one.
2 A I'm pretty sure I didn't see it here. Let
3 me look one more time. Here you go.
4 MS. PONZOLI: Let's mark this for identification.
5 (Rader Exhibit 2(1-4) was marked
6 for identification by the reporter and is
7 included herewith.)
8 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Dr. Rader, is this a
9 current copy of your curriculum vitae, or resume,
10 whatever you prefer to call it?
11 A Yes. There might be actually some more
12 recent updates, but yeah, uh-huh.
13 Q What would you update on it?
14 A This paper on the "Determinants of
15 Decomposition in a Southeastern Coastal Plain, Blackwater
16 Stream," we received back. It's no longer in review.
17 That's the only thing.
18 Q That one would not be in review?
19 A Right.
20 Q Is there anything else that's listed for
21 review that's now been received for publication?
22 A No.
23 Q Have you submitted anything in addition to
24 anything that's on this list?
25 A No.
21ÿ
1 Q We need to put these in a pile, if you'll
2 give me this one. All right. No. 2 is "A list of all
3 technical, professional, or scientific publications,
4 reports, monographs, articles, monographs, thesis, or
5 similar documents in which you are identified as author
6 or co-author related to Everglades research."
7 A Are they all here is the question.
8 Q Did you produce a list, or did you just
9 produce copies of them?
10 A Copies.
11 Q So we go to a copy of each Everglades
12 publication. That includes drafts, edited copies,
13 reviewers' comments, and the final versions under No. 3.
14 You paid attention to that --
15 A Uh-huh.
16 Q -- did you not?
17 I would like us to look through and make
18 sure we have, to the best of your knowledge, all of those
19 documents.
20 A This one is in publication, or it's already
21 been published.
22 Q We'll get them together, and then we will
23 mark them for identification. It would probably be best
24 if you just pull them first.
25 MR. HYDE: Ms. Ponzoli, I don't know how we'll
22ÿ
1 handle this. A number of documents would fall
2 under several of the categories that you've
3 listed.
4 MS. PONZOLI: That's fine.
5 MR. HYDE: Do you intend to go through each of
6 those categories each time?
7 MS. PONZOLI: No. Once he's said, I've produced
8 everything previously -- my request became fairly
9 redundant after a while. I wanted everything he
10 did on the Everglades, and I asked for it a
11 number of different ways.
12 THE WITNESS: The quarterly reports. Looks like
13 a paper I'm currently working on.
14 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: What you should probably
15 do, Dr. Rader, instead of commenting on each of these is
16 pull them aside, and then I'll have her mark them for
17 identification. I'm afraid I'm going to forget as you
18 give me these comments because we'll have to mark them
19 separately.
20 A Okay. Okay. These two. They've included
21 abstracts. Did you not?
22 Q Yes, we did.
23 A Let's see. It goes with this one, I
24 believe. I'm not sure.
25 Q With that one?
23ÿ
1 A With that stack, yeah.
2 Q Is that it?
3 A That's it from that stack, yeah.
4 Q Dr. Rader, do you believe that these
5 represent all of your written work on the Everglades?
6 A I believe so, yes.
7 Q All right.
8 A You've got that one, that one, and that one
9 (indicating).
10 Q Let's mark them for identification. What I
11 may want to do is go through the annual reports and make
12 sure your writing in the annual reports is reflected in
13 these reports or, if these are additional articles maybe
14 on the same topic but still --
15 A Uh-huh.
16 Q -- your publications, let's mark these all
17 and then begin to talk about them.
18 Off the record.
19 (Discussion off the record.)
20 (Rader Exhibits 3(1-9), 4(1-43), 5(1-30),
21 6(1-3), 7(1-2), 8(1-41), 9(1-54), 10, 11(1-11),
22 12(1-10), 13(1-65), 14(1-7), 15(1-7), 16, 17, 18,
23 and 19(1-68), were marked for identification by the
24 reporter and are included herewith.)
25 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Dr. Rader, I'm going to
24ÿ
1 hand you Rader Exhibit No. 3. Can you identify this for
2 us, please.
3 A Yeah. That's the final copy of this
4 particular publication sent for "Wetlands."
5 Q Would you read the name of it into the
6 record, please.
7 A "The Effects of Nutrient Enrichment on Algae
8 and Macroinvertebrates in the Everglades: A Review."
9 Q I'm going to hand you Rader Exhibit No. 4.
10 Can you identify that, Dr. Rader?
11 A This is a review of this same paper by the
12 first reviewer that -- that -- and also, as I see, this
13 same review was made by de la Cruz on this same paper,
14 this same copy of this paper. So there's reviewer
15 No. 1's comments, and what were in red were de la Cruz's
16 comments, which was a third reviewer on this particular
17 paper.
18 Q Who was the first reviewer, Dr. Rader?
19 A They're anonymous.
20 Q So you have no idea who your first reviewer
21 was?
22 A Let's see. One of the reviewers signed his
23 name. I don't know if he was the first or the second.
24 James Kushlan and de la Cruz identified themselves. The
25 other reviewer, I don't know. He's anonymous.
25ÿ
1 Q So you don't know if this was the anonymous
2 reviewer or the Kushlan?
3 A I don't remember.
4 Q I'm going to hand you Rader Exhibit No. 5.
5 A This is the second reviewer's comments.
6 Q So this is either Kush --
7 A This would be either Kushlan or the
8 anonymous reviewer's comments. I can look at it and tell
9 you probably.
10 Q Okay.
11 A Do you want me to do that?
12 Q Okay. That would be fine.
13 A Let me see if I remember it well enough. I
14 think I remember who -- yeah. This is the anonymous
15 reviewer's, was reviewer No. 2. James Kushlan was
16 reviewer No. 1, and de la Cruz also was, I guess, the
17 third reviewer.
18 Q I'm going to hand you Rader Exhibit No. 6,
19 Dr. Rader. Can you identify that?
20 A These were Dr. de la Cruz's comments on this
21 paper to the editor, Doug Wilcox -- no. Excuse me -- to
22 me. These are his -- this is a notice from him to me,
23 saying that he's handling, as a third reviewer, this
24 manuscript.
25 Q Dr. Rader, Rader Exhibit No. 7?
26ÿ
1 A These are my remarks to Dr. Wilcox on the
2 revision of this manuscript -- excuse me.
3 Q I'm handing you Rader Exhibit 8, and can you
4 identify that?
5 A It's the penultimate copy made of that; so a
6 copy of this paper, after it has -- the reviewer's
7 comments have been made or changed on it.
8 Q And that would be essentially the same as
9 Rader Exhibit No. 3?
10 A Which one was No. 3?
11 Q "The Effects of Nutrient Enrichment . . ."
12 Yes.
13 A There might be some minor changes but
14 essentially the same, yes.
15 Q Is Rader Exhibit 9 the same --
16 A The same as 8.
17 Q -- to your recollection?
18 It's just another duplicate copy?
19 A Yeah.
20 Q Rader Exhibit 10, can you identify that?
21 A Yeah. This is the acceptance letter after
22 the reviews by Doug Wilcox to myself.
23 Q Raider Exhibit No. 11, can you identify
24 that?
25 A This is his first letter. Maybe we better
27ÿ
1 separate some of these. This is his first letter.
2 Q "This" being -- you'd better identify it
3 into the record. The one that has the Rader Exhibit 11
4 stamp actually on it is the first letter?
5 A Right, and that's Dr. Wilcox's first letter
6 to me --
7 Q Right.
8 A -- that accompanied the first reviewers'
9 comments, one and two.
10 Q But this is a composite exhibit. It
11 contains more documents.
12 A And they're different; so maybe they ought
13 to be separate --
14 Q Well, maybe they should.
15 A -- because this is my cover letter that
16 accompanied the paper at the time of submission.
17 Q That is a letter dated to Dr. Wilcox dated
18 9-13-91, typed in "Russell B. Rader." Is that accurate,
19 Dr. Rader?
20 A Right.
21 MR. HYDE: Are you going to separately identify
22 those as exhibits or just leave them as part of a
23 composite?
24 MS. PONZOLI: I'm inclined -- if they're all
25 related to that document, since we've already
28ÿ
1 numbered and we've numbered sequentially after
2 that, to make a composite exhibit and identify
3 that there are however many documents under Rader
4 Exhibit 11 identified as -- whatever Dr. Rader --
5 MR. HYDE: You can list them as 11-A, -B, -C, -D.
6 MS. PONZOLI: Off the record.
7 (Discussion off the record.)
8 MS. PONZOLI: Back on the record.
9 We've decided to use the court reporter's
10 system of 11-1, 11-2, et cetera, 11-1 being the
11 Wilcox letter, 11-2 being the --
12 MR. HYDE: Could you tell me what the date was on
13 that?
14 MS. PONZOLI: December 5, 1991. 11-2 was
15 Dr. Rader's letter to Dr. Wilcox of 9-13-91.
16 Q 11-3, Dr. Rader, could you identify that for
17 us, please.
18 A This is a letter from the editor, just
19 recognizing that he has received my manuscript and that
20 it will be reviewed.
21 Q 11-4, Dr. Rader, can you identify that,
22 please.
23 A This is a cover sheet for the first
24 reviewer's comments.
25 Q 11-5, Dr. Rader, can you identify that?
29ÿ
1 A This goes with the cover sheet. It's just
2 those reviewer's typewritten comments.
3 Q Would you identify 11-6.
4 A It's the second page of the same.
5 Q And is 11-7 the final page of it?
6 A Yes.
7 Q I'm taking meticulous a new height.
8 11-8?
9 A This is the comments of the second reviewer.
10 Q 11-9, Dr. Rader, can you identify that?
11 A Yes. This is the one page that accompanies
12 the second reviewer's comments. This is the second page
13 of the same.
14 Q 11-10 is the second page of 11-9?
15 A Of that, right.
16 Q Then is 11-11 the third page of that same
17 document?
18 A Yes, uh-huh.
19 Q Dr. Rader, can you identify Rader No. 12?
20 A All of these pages are simply instructions
21 to the author for publishing in that particular journal.
22 Q Can you identify Rader No. 13, Dr. Rader?
23 A All right. This is a paper that I am
24 currently working on that has not been submitted for
25 publication. This, along with the reviewer's comments on
30ÿ
1 the paper, based on what David Ackerman was discussing
2 earlier, I'd like to identify as protective or hopefully
3 under some sort of protective privilege, I guess.
4 Q Rader No. 13 is a document you are currently
5 working on for publication?
6 A Yes.
7 Q So that would be the reason you would wish
8 to retain that?
9 A Right. That has not been submitted.
10 Q The review comments of the prior
11 publication, which would have been "The Effects of
12 Nutrient Enrichment on Algae and Macroinvertebrates in
13 the Everglades: A Review" --
14 A Uh-huh.
15 Q I can understand the interest in this
16 document, but on the prior reviews, can you explain to me
17 what protective interest you believe you have in the
18 reviews of it?
19 MR. HYDE: I don't think he asserted any
20 protective --
21 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: I understand you said the
22 reviews you also wish to keep in a confidential or more
23 confidential circle. Am I wrong?
24 A No. Yeah. That would be -- if that's
25 possible, that's what I would like to do, yes.
31ÿ
1 Q I'm asking you why. I don't understand the
2 reviews. This article, "The Effects of Nutrient
3 Enrichment on Algae and Macroinvertebrates in the
4 Everglades: A Review" is already out on the street, so
5 to speak.
6 A The article is out --
7 Q The article is out.
8 A -- but the reviewers' comments are private
9 matters.
10 They're done anonymously between reviewers
11 and the -- as I'm sure you understand, and the author.
12 So in terms of confidentiality and privateness, I would
13 just as soon that they not become accessible to anyone
14 that thinks, gee, I wonder what this reviewer thought of
15 that.
16 Q So it's not a proprietary or commercial or
17 professional interest. It's really more a privacy issue
18 in your mind?
19 A Yes, uh-huh. I assume that is legitimate.
20 Maybe not. Huh?
21 Q I'd like to ask you to identify Rader
22 Exhibit No. 14.
23 A Yes. This was sent for publication in
24 "Wetlands," a special issue of that, and it corresponds
25 with The Society of Wetlands Scientists meetings that
32ÿ
1 were held this year; so that proceedings of those
2 meetings are being published. That is my contribution to
3 that.
4 Q Is this an extension of "The Effects of
5 Nutrient Enrichment on Algae and Macroinvertebrates in
6 the Everglades: A Review"?
7 A No.
8 Q Is it a separate --
9 A Separate.
10 Q Rader Exhibit Number 15, can you identify
11 this?
12 A This is the initial copy, my writing of that
13 last document, the one that corresponds with The Society
14 of Wetlands Scientists meetings, the publications of
15 those proceedings; so this is just an earlier rendition
16 of that.
17 Q So Rader 15 is an earlier rendition of
18 Rader 14?
19 A Right.
20 Q And you would consider Rader 14 your final
21 product?
22 A Yes.
23 Q Can you identify Rader 16?
24 A This is an abstract sent to The Society of
25 Wetlands Scientists, just describing my talk, the topic
33ÿ
1 or focus of my talk, for that particular meeting.
2 Q Rader No. 17?
3 A This is the same, just an abstract
4 describing the findings of my research and what I'm going
5 to talk about at the Intecol meetings, international
6 wetland meetings.
7 Q Rader No. 18?
8 A This is the same, an abstract submitted to
9 the Society of Limnology and Oceanography for a talk --
10 or actually a poster session that I presented there in
11 '91.
12 Q Rader No. 19 is a composite exhibit.
13 Dr. Rader, I'd like you to identify the composite exhibit
14 for us.
15 A Yeah. I think we have a couple things mixed
16 up here.
17 Q Are there some documents, other than what
18 appears to be quarterly reports, mixed in with that
19 document?
20 A Yes, there is, yes.
21 Q Why don't we clean it up and make a clean
22 composite exhibit of quarterly and/or monthly reports,
23 assuming you believe those belong together, and then
24 separate out those documents that you believe are
25 inappropriate for that pile.
34ÿ
1 MR. HYDE: Off the record.
2 (Discussion off the record.)
3 THE WITNESS: These are all quarterly-report
4 documents.
5 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Rader Exhibit No. 19 is a
6 composite of quarterly reports. Dr. Rader, when did --
7 to the best of your knowledge, when did the Duke Wetland
8 Center begin publishing quarterly reports? Do you know?
9 A Oh, I don't remember right offhand.
10 Q All right. If we were missing what appeared
11 to be -- and I believe there are some missing from
12 here -- quarterly reports, where would be the easiest
13 place for us to obtain those missing quarterly reports?
14 A I think probably Dr. Richardson's office at
15 Duke would be the easiest way.
16 MR. HYDE: I'll just note for the record that
17 Dr. Rader has not been employed by the Duke
18 Wetland Center from the inception of its studies
19 of the Everglades system.
20 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: I have one more question on
21 this composite Exhibit No. 19 for the present, Dr. Rader.
22 There is a monthly report dated September 15, 1992. Can
23 you explain to me the difference between the quarterly
24 reports and the monthly report?
25 A I think that that's -- that we don't make
35ÿ
1 monthly reports. And so I think that's just a -- not
2 necessarily a typed error, but I think they meant to
3 indicate the month that that quarterly report was due.
4 So I would chalk it up -- this being a cover letter, I
5 didn't write this. So I would just chalk it up to
6 whoever wrote it.
7 Q It's a clerical error, in your view?
8 A Yeah, right.
9 Q I believe -- is this an additional document
10 sitting in front of you --
11 A Uh-huh.
12 Q -- that we have not marked?
13 Does it fit into a very separate category?
14 A Yes.
15 Q Let's hold onto that until we get to that
16 area. We have now, I believe, gone through at least
17 what I understand to be the copies of your response to 2
18 and 3, the technical, professional, scientific
19 publications et cetera, including drafts, reviewers'
20 comments and final versions.
21 Do you recall any others that you have done
22 on the Everglades?
23 A I think this might be -- is this yours
24 maybe? I'm just looking at that and wondering.
25 Q The introduction -- have we included the
36ÿ
1 introduction among the documents?
2 A Is that a copy of that over here is what I'm
3 wondering. May I --
4 Q Sure.
5 A -- look at that real quick?
6 Yeah. A copy that is over there.
7 Q Yes, the introduction is here. Do we also
8 have the decomposition experimental design, or does that
9 fit into a different category?
10 A Again, your categories and categories in my
11 head are two different issues.
12 Q Right.
13 A But this is not for publication. It's not a
14 report or anything.
15 Q All right. The decomposition experimental
16 design would fit under a different category under my
17 Subpoena Duces Tecum, you believe?
18 A I believe so, yes. What page is this?
19 Q I'm on page 6.
20 A We're at No. 3?
21 Q So we're trying to finalize No. 3. So we
22 think we have all your publications on the Everglades,
23 including comments, et cetera, abstracts. Do you think
24 we've reviewed everything?
25 A Yes, yes.
37ÿ
1 Q Just to be sure, let us go through the --
2 A Well, they're annual reports.
3 Q -- the annual reports.
4 You were hired by the Duke Wetland Center
5 when?
6 A I think on record it would be August -- July
7 or August of 1990. I'm not a hundred percent sure what
8 month exactly.
9 Q All right. If we were to go through the
10 annual report August, 1991, you were listed as a
11 coprincipal investigator, and, Dr. Rader, you are listed
12 as having contributed along with Dr. Richardson to
13 Chapter 5, Fauna. Is that accurate?
14 A That is true.
15 Q Are there any other drafts of that
16 contribution?
17 A The drafts of that are the drafts that
18 relate to the review article that has been published in
19 "Wetlands"; so that chapter was modified, changed,
20 whatever needed to be done to put it in publishable form.
21 So that -- actually, the subsequent drafts of that paper
22 are the preliminary drafts to the reviewed article that
23 was published in "Wetlands."
24 Q Can you identify by exhibit numbers -- my
25 memory is not helping me here -- can you identify by
38ÿ
1 exhibit numbers which ones belong with Chapter 5,
2 entitled "Fauna"?
3 A (Indicating.)
4 Q That would be Rader Exhibit No. 3. Is that
5 what you're indicating?
6 A May I see it for just a second?
7 Q Sure, sure.
8 A I need to jog my memory here a little bit.
9 Okay. Parts of this, Chapter 5, were used in the
10 publication of this (indicating).
11 Q Rader Exhibit No. 3 --
12 A No. 3, yes.
13 Q -- right?
14 A Parts of it.
15 Q What other exhibits would relate to that
16 Chapter 5 that were among the exhibits we've already
17 identified? Are you able to just flip through the
18 exhibits and tell me which ones, just quickly, relate to
19 it?
20 A There's a relationship between Chapter 5
21 and --
22 Q Yes, sir.
23 A -- for example, Exhibit 4, Exhibit 5,
24 Exhibit 8, Exhibit 9, Exhibit --
25 Q You skipped one.
39ÿ
1 A Did I? That wasn't on purpose. 10 and 11,
2 probably not 12. So there's some relationship there
3 between Chapter 5 and that paper.
4 Q Are you listed in that 1991 annual report as
5 having authored other chapters or coauthored other
6 chapters?
7 A Yes.
8 Q Are you the principal writer of Chapter 5?
9 A Uh-huh, yes, I am.
10 Q Did Dr. Richardson edit or just review
11 Chapter 5, or is that predominantly your work?
12 A No. He did review it, as I recall, uh-huh.
13 Q But you authored it?
14 A Right.
15 Q What other chapters are you an author on?
16 A Chapter 6.
17 Q What was your participation in Chapter 6?
18 A The same as Chapter 5. I authored it.
19 Dr. Richardson reviewed it.
20 Q Are there any other chapters in the annual
21 report for 1991 that you authored?
22 A Chapter 8.
23 Q And your participation in 8 was what?
24 A The same. I authored it. Dr. Richardson
25 reviewed it.
40ÿ
1 Q Right. And Chapter 9, is that the same, or
2 is that someone else?
3 A That's someone else.
4 Q So you have three --
5 A Uh-huh.
6 Q -- that you participated in.
7 Are there any -- there are no other drafts
8 of those that exist?
9 A Let me just clarify one thing.
10 Q All right, yes.
11 A Chapter 8 also is related to this particular
12 paper, the "Wetlands" article.
13 Q Rader Exhibit No. 3 and those exhibits --
14 A Right.
15 Q -- related to it --
16 A Yeah, yeah.
17 Q -- in the same way as before?
18 A Right.
19 Q But there are no drafts of these particular
20 annual reports?
21 A No, none that I still have.
22 Q All right. I'd like to move to annual
23 report --
24 MR. HYDE: Did we mark that as an exhibit, for
25 the record, or was that just a discussion about
41ÿ
1 its relationship?
2 MS. PONZOLI: This one?
3 MR. HYDE: Yes.
4 MS. PONZOLI: Well, Mr. Hyde, I --
5 MR. HYDE: I just wanted to know for clarification.
6 MS. PONZOLI: I am content to put in copies of
7 the Duke Wetland Center annual reports August,
8 1991, and October, 1992, but they're so
9 voluminous. It's going to cost us a fortune.
10 MR. HYDE: That's okay.
11 MS. PONZOLI: Everyone has copies of them, and I
12 don't think there's any dispute, when we go to
13 trial, that this is an annual report 1991 and
14 this is an annual report 1992. I can't imagine
15 it would be a matter in dispute.
16 MR. HYDE: It isn't.
17 MS. PONZOLI: I don't honestly care to introduce
18 them.
19 Q Do you have reviews of the other chapters,
20 Dr. Rader, in addition -- we talked about the reviews
21 throughout of Chapter 5 -- or were associated with
22 Chapter 5. Were there similar documents on Chapter 6 or
23 Chapter 8?
24 MR. HYDE: May I ask for a clarification. You
25 mean reviewers' comments?
42ÿ
1 MS. PONZOLI: Right, or reviews of those
2 chapters, either one.
3 THE WITNESS: Yeah. You mean -- no. That's --
4 all I have is that. What I had originally was
5 probably -- if I had hard copies, were probably
6 thrown away.
7 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: And you didn't retain them
8 on disks or anything?
9 A No, not that I can remember.
10 Q Is there a policy of not retaining some of
11 those documents, Dr. Rader?
12 A None that I know of, no, no.
13 Q Moving to the annual report of the Duke
14 Wetland Center for October, 1992 -- I'll hand you a clean
15 copy, Dr. Rader, to assist you -- I'd like to identify
16 those chapters that you helped to author, and I'd like
17 you to tell me your participation in those particular
18 chapters.
19 A Chapter 5.
20 Q Were you the principal author on Chapter 5?
21 A Yes.
22 Q And are the same reviews that exist in
23 relation to Rader Exhibit No. 3 related to Chapter 5 and
24 the annual report?
25 A I don't understand.
43ÿ
1 Q Are there any reviews of Chapter 5 or any --
2 MR. HYDE: I'm still unsure about what we're
3 talking about in context of the reviews. Do you
4 mean anonymous reviewers' comments?
5 MS. PONZOLI: No. They don't even have to be
6 anonymous? They can be --
7 Q Did Dr. Craft write a review of Chapter 5,
8 and you somewhere have such a document, or you had such a
9 document at one time?
10 A Oh, no. Maybe it would help if I
11 explained --
12 Q Go ahead.
13 A -- a little bit of how this did work.
14 If I sent up a chapter --
15 Q Right.
16 A -- then we would probably make corrections
17 over the telephone, and Curt would call and say, what
18 about that sentence?
19 What do you think? Okay. Yeah. We can do
20 that. The correction was made and sent back up, and I
21 try not to hold onto -- you know, it would stack up to be
22 a mile high, and it would fill up my folder.
23 Q Sure.
24 A So I don't hang on to all that stuff. So if
25 it's a publication, that's a different matter. As you
44ÿ
1 can see, I hang onto those, the reviewers' comments on
2 publications.
3 Q So the annual reports do not go through the
4 same level of review that a publication would go through.
5 Is that fair?
6 A No, it does not.
7 Q Are the annual reports reviewed by outside
8 reviewers, outside the team of investigators who are
9 listed as authors?
10 A Not that I know of.
11 Q Do the team of authors review each -- the
12 principal investigators -- I apologize. Let's say the
13 coprincipal investigators -- do you review each others'
14 chapters or articles?
15 A We can.
16 Q Did you for the 1991, August '91, annual
17 report? Did you review any of the other chapters?
18 A '91?
19 Q Yes, sir.
20 A No, not that I recall.
21 Q Did you review any of the other chapters for
22 the annual report for 1992?
23 A Huh-uh, no, I didn't.
24 Q Have you read all of these various chapters
25 in '91 and '92?
45ÿ
1 A '91, yes; '92, no.
2 Q If I understand my reading of the table of
3 contents, in your answer, Chapter 5 is the only chapter
4 to which you contributed in the annual report 1992. Is
5 that accurate?
6 A Yes.
7 Q You are likewise listed as a coprincipal
8 investigator on the annual report appendices to the
9 September, 1991, report. I would like for you to
10 identify for me, Dr. Rader -- it lists appendices that, I
11 believe, each contain data. I would like you to
12 identify -- I'll hand you the table of contents -- those
13 appendices which reflect your data.
14 A Just to make sure -- so that would be
15 appendix 5-1, 5-2, 6-1, 6-2, 6-3, 6-4.
16 Q 5-1, -2, 6-1, -2, -3, and -4?
17 A Uh-huh.
18 Q Okay.
19 A Yes.
20 Q Did you collect some of the data for any of
21 the other appendices in this Volume II to the '91 report?
22 A Let me look at them a little closer, then.
23 Yes.
24 Q Which ones did you collect data for?
25 A I did for the water chemistry data.
46ÿ
1 Q Which is appendix?
2 A Appendix 1-1, looks like. Some data there.
3 That's it.
4 Q Thank you.
5 MR. HYDE: That's Volume II for 1992?
6 MS. PONZOLI: No. That's Volume II for 1991.
7 MR. HYDE: Okay.
8 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Is there going to be a
9 Volume II for 1992, Dr. Rader?
10 A An appendix volume?
11 Q Yes, sir.
12 A Yes, there is.
13 Q But it's not out in publication yet?
14 A I don't know. I don't know where that's at.
15 MS. PONZOLI: Jim, do you know?
16 DR. GRIMSHAW: I have no idea.
17 THE WITNESS: '92, as you know, the annual report
18 has just come out -- what? -- two, three weeks
19 ago. So I don't think the appendix is out.
20 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Do you have any idea how
21 soon it would come out?
22 A No.
23 Q Do you have any idea how long they normally
24 lag behind the annual report?
25 A No, not really. They do that at Duke.
47ÿ
1 Q So now we really have gone through all your
2 publications on the Everglades --
3 A I think so.
4 Q -- to the best of your recollection?
5 A Yep, yep, yep.
6 Q Okay. The next category of documents is,
7 "All documents relating to research done in conjunction
8 with or under the direction of Dr. C.J. Richardson and/or
9 the Duke Wetlands Center." I wasn't going to forget
10 anything, Dr. Rader. I mean, I covered it ten different
11 ways.
12 A That's why I just gathered it all up in a
13 box and said, "Here it is."
14 Q I could have sent a Subpoena Duces Tecum and
15 said, "Send everything," but they would have said it
16 wasn't sufficient.
17 MR. HYDE: We might as well start doing that.
18 MS. PONZOLI: I think that's how Dr. Grimshaw
19 feels about the district.
20 MR. HYDE: That's certainly the way Dr. Parks
21 responded.
22 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: You have a number of more
23 documents. I would ask you, Dr. Rader, to look over the
24 list, and if we can identify documents that fit within a
25 specific category, let's go back and put them under --
48ÿ
1 for example, if you have, under No. 12, field notes that
2 we could pull aside and say these are my field notes,
3 then we'll pull those and put them as identified
4 documents or proposals or laboratory notes, and then
5 we'll just go back to the generic Everglades documents
6 that are requested under several categories.
7 A Should I just start with that stack, work
8 through it? That would be easier rather than me working
9 from this category and going to the stack. Maybe I can
10 just start with these documents and say it fits here,
11 fits there.
12 Q Why don't we do that off the record, and
13 then we'll put them in piles so it will be easier for us
14 to deal with and try to make sense of what you've done --
15 A Okay.
16 Q -- which is the real purpose of identifying
17 these documents.
18 A You want to do that now?
19 MS. PONZOLI: Let's go off the record.
20 (Rader Exhibits 20(1-39), 21(1-3),
21 22(1-10), 23(1-38), 24(1-75), 25(1-174),
22 26(1-113), 27(1-17), 28(1-57), 29, 30(1-62),
23 31(1-210), 32(1-60), 33(1-7), 34(1-18), and
24 35(1-5) were marked for identification by the
25 reporter and are included herewith.)
49ÿ
1 (Discussion off the record.)
2 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Dr. Rader, I'm going to
3 hand you Rader Exhibit No. 20. Can you identify this,
4 please.
5 A Yes. It's site notes and some data
6 collected each time we visited the sites on the -- what
7 we call the "gradient study," or the "nutrient-enrichment
8 study." It also includes coordinates for each one of
9 the -- latitudinal, longitudinal coordinates for each
10 site.
11 Q Dr. Rader, I'm going to hand you what has
12 been marked as Johnson Exhibit No. 13 and ask you if
13 these are the sites for the gradient study?
14 A Yes. These are the sites for
15 Jerry Qualls's -- that's not exactly accurate. Yes,
16 these are the sites for the gradient study. I just used
17 part of them; so I did not collect invertebrate data --
18 Q Right.
19 A -- and my data on all the sites -- should I
20 identify those.
21 Q Yes, you should.
22 We should probably take a short little
23 break, and let me Xerox a copy of that so the Johnson
24 Exhibit is not altered, but we'll make it a Rader Exhibit
25 in this deposition.
50ÿ
1 A Okay
2 (Short recess.)
3 (Rader Exhibit 36(1-2) was marked
4 for identification by the reporter and is
5 included herewith.)
6 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Dr. Rader, I've handed you
7 Johnson Exhibit No. 13, which, you indicate, is the
8 gradient study to which you were referring, but you did
9 not use all of these sites for your work. So I would ask
10 you to please circle those locations that you did use on
11 what will now be Rader No. 36.
12 A Okay.
13 Q You have circled from the second dot down on
14 10C six -- the six consecutive sites under 10C and the
15 first two under 10D. Is that accurate?
16 A That is, yes.
17 Q That is where you have done your
18 invertebrate work; is that right?
19 A Right, right. Do you want that to go with
20 these?
21 Q This is the work -- Rader Exhibit No. 20
22 reflects the coordinates and the data that have been
23 collected at these eight sites reflected on Rader No. 36?
24 A Yeah. It's a -- it's not all the data
25 certainly, but it reflects some physical-chemical data
51ÿ
1 that I collected at each site.
2 Q Is the rest of the data among the pieces we
3 have not come to yet?
4 A Yes.
5 Q You had indicated off the record previously
6 that your data for this invertebrate work -- and you'll
7 have to tell me -- the oxygen work also -- I don't
8 know -- broke into roughly preliminary data, second-step
9 data, and third-step data. Is that accurate?
10 A Yes, and maybe it would be good to add a
11 fourth category, a summary category, summarizing the
12 data.
13 Q All right. I would like you to I.D. the
14 data as we go through, whether it fits into one of these
15 four categories.
16 A Okay.
17 Q So Rader Exhibit 20 would fit into which
18 category?
19 A Well, let's see. It fits best, I guess,
20 into final data -- or what was our --
21 Q Summary data, you had said. The last would
22 be summary data.
23 A Yeah. It's -- this isn't really a summary.
24 These are the actual data sheets of the physical-chemical
25 data. Okay?
52ÿ
1 Q Yes.
2 A And the summary of which is found in the
3 appendix in the second annual report by Jerry Qualls.
4 Okay. I collected some of that. You asked if there was
5 any other data that you collected. That is what I was
6 talking about. It's pH and temperature and water depth
7 at the various transects; so it doesn't really fit into
8 the categories we discussed, I'm afraid.
9 Q I just want to clarify something on Rader
10 Exhibit No. 36. Under 10D, under structure 10D --
11 A Yes.
12 Q -- you did not use the first site; is that
13 accurate?
14 You intended to skip that first site; is
15 that accurate?
16 A No. I did use it.
17 Q Well, there appears on Johnson No. 13 to be
18 a dot, a site almost directly on the Hillsboro Canal at
19 10D, and the question exists in my mind: Did you use
20 that first dot or the next one down as a site?
21 A I think that first dot is supposed to
22 indicate a gate.
23 Q All right. That is only a gate. That is
24 not a site used --
25 A No.
53ÿ
1 Q -- for anyone's research, and that's why you
2 skipped it under 10C, also?
3 A Yes. That's just a gate.
4 Q So your initial sites would have been how
5 far down roughly -- do you recall? -- from the gates in
6 kilometers?
7 A Roughly a kilometer and a half, I believe.
8 The reason I say "I believe" is because the sites were
9 chosen prior to my starting on the project.
10 Q So you were using --
11 A The actual sites.
12 Q Doctor whose sites?
13 A I believe Dr. Qualls and Dr. Richardson
14 chose the sites together, probably in conjunction with
15 Dr. Craft -- the three of them.
16 Q Okay. Are those sites --
17 A I'm not sure.
18 Q Are the coordinates actually listed in Rader
19 Exhibit No. 20, where we would find the first site?
20 A They are, yes.
21 Q And they're easy to locate. They're on the
22 first page. It just says "Site 1, and we'll have
23 coordinates?
24 A Yep. Latitude, longitude.
25 Q Okay. Very good. Thank you. Is there any
54ÿ
1 more information contained in Rader composite Exhibit
2 No. 20 that we haven't identified?
3 A Site notes, what it is and some -- some
4 physical-chemical data collected at each site.
5 Q Thank you. I'm going to hand you Rader
6 Exhibit No. 21 and ask you to identify it, please.
7 A These are samples, invertebrate samples,
8 collected in the Hillsboro Canal, right at the C-gate in
9 four habitat types.
10 Q Do these fit into your preliminary category
11 of data?
12 A These categories are throwing me curves now.
13 Q You created them.
14 A Yeah, yeah. They work well with most of the
15 invertebrate data. It's -- it's just data that were
16 collected to supplement the gradient study; so maybe it
17 would be best to call it "supplementary data."
18 Q They're in the Hillsboro Canal; is that
19 accurate?
20 A Yes, right in the Hillsboro Canal.
21 Q Do you know where?
22 A Yes. Right at the -- we could hit the
23 10 gate, 10C gate, with a rock. Right there.
24 Q Within how many meters would you say? Three
25 or four meters or more?
55ÿ
1 A I don't know. It depends on how sore my arm
2 is. About a hundred meters.
3 Q A hundred meters?
4 A Yes.
5 Q East or west?
6 A East and west.
7 Q Maybe two --
8 A So we probably traveled a hundred to
9 two hundred meters east of the gate, a hundred to
10 two hundred meters west of the gate, sampling the various
11 habitat types.
12 Q What different habitat types were there
13 there?
14 A Phragmites beds and then the floating water
15 lettuce or hyacinth, and then the grassy areas that were
16 inundated -- I believe it to be panicum -- was the
17 emergent macrophyte.
18 Q Is that data collection reflected on the
19 sheets?
20 A May 1992.
21 Q Who was with you?
22 A Bob Johnson.
23 Q I'm going to hand you Rader Exhibit No. 22.
24 A These really fall into miscellaneous notes
25 category.
56ÿ
1 Q Of what?
2 A Of sorting procedures used in sorting
3 invertebrates.
4 Q As part of your identification of the --
5 A Process, exactly.
6 Q Right.
7 A As part of the identification process,
8 uh-huh.
9 Q Rader Exhibit No. 23, can you identify that
10 composite exhibit?
11 A Yes. This is the inventory of samples
12 taken, a checklist of what samples were taken when and
13 where and when they were sorted.
14 Q Then this reflects dates? places? sites?
15 A All of that, yes -- replicates.
16 Q Is this second step? Is this in the second
17 or third step of data? It doesn't sound preliminary.
18 A Again, it doesn't really fit that category.
19 Q All right.
20 A All it falls into is the inventory of data
21 samples.
22 Q Rader Exhibit No. 24. It has "Preliminary
23 Analyses" labeled on the top.
24 A Yes. So I was asked to summarize these
25 data, and this was simply preliminary analysis before all
57ÿ
1 sampling data had been completed.
2 Q Right. Is there an indication of when that
3 preliminary analysis was done, in there?
4 A Let me see if I can -- at different times,
5 I'm afraid. Some of it was done in April of this year.
6 Q Right. Were you trying to sort of put these
7 data in different categories? What sort of category are
8 you using to determine which category you put them in?
9 A The categories being whether it's
10 preliminary and whether it's second step, whether it's
11 the final -- simply using whether the identifications
12 made were, to my satisfaction, complete at the time that
13 the data were written down or outlined. For an example,
14 one would go through and sort invertebrates as a first
15 step.
16 Second step, one goes through and starts to
17 identify them. Question marks are indicated on
18 identifications that one is not sure of, and you go
19 through it a second time. You might go through it a
20 third time.
21 You might go through it as many times as it
22 takes until you're sure the identifications you've made
23 are correct and that the identification made at this
24 month and your identifying this organism here this month
25 is the same this month and this month. Are they indeed
58ÿ
1 the same. It's a constant process of checking and
2 rechecking yourself. So it's a continuous process.
3 And you're asking me -- I've divided them
4 arbitrarily into -- first step, preliminary, and so forth
5 is an arbitrary designation of a continuous process.
6 Q Preliminary like being your first cut, the
7 second and third being much more refined cuts --
8 A More refined --
9 Q -- the ones that you're identifying?
10 A Yes, leading up to the summary sheet which
11 I'll show you, which is the one that probably is the
12 final copy, the final cut.
13 Q And you have the most confidence in your
14 summary sheet of any of these; is that accurate?
15 A Yes.
16 Q So have we finished identifying Rader
17 No. 24, or had you identified Rader No. 24? I'm not
18 clear.
19 A Yeah. These are preliminary analyses.
20 These are data analyses. These are analyses of the data
21 calculating diversity, for example in the various sites
22 in April -- I think it's mostly April; so it is not --
23 what I'm saying is that it is not the final analysis.
24 Q Can you identify Rader No. 25, which has
25 "Preliminary" handwritten on it? Is that your
59ÿ
1 handwriting?
2 A Yes, yep. This would constitute a first cut
3 through the data.
4 Q Rader Exhibit No. 26, which has "2nd Step,"
5 is that your handwriting?
6 A Uh-huh.
7 Q It's the same data as No. 25 but now under
8 further analysis?
9 A Right. I was starting to refine it.
10 Q Do you have a high degree of confidence that
11 a second step is pretty accurate? How much refinement
12 goes on after that second step? Are you able to quantify
13 that?
14 A Not really, not quantify it.
15 Q Rader No. 27, what is that?
16 A This is a summary of the data, primarily
17 based on this second step.
18 Q On Rader No. 26?
19 A For the most part. For example -- well,
20 that's what it is.
21 Q "Well, for example," what?
22 A Well, for example, the chironomids have not
23 been identified to species level yet.
24 Q You'll have to spell that for her. It will
25 save her a lot of time if you'll do that right now.
60ÿ
1 A C-h-i-r-o-n-o-m-i-d-s .
2 Q Can you identify Rader No. 28?
3 A This is one of the final summaries and
4 analysis of the data.
5 Q The same data we've been looking at
6 through --
7 A Different -- yeah.
8 Q How do you mean "different"?
9 A There's many ways of looking at the data.
10 Q This is a different way of looking at the
11 same collection that you've done --
12 A Exactly.
13 Q -- in 24, 25, et cetera?
14 A Yes, and this is getting close to a final
15 one.
16 Q All right. Rader No. 29, can you identify
17 that?
18 A Yep.
19 A There is the -- this is the -- these are
20 various calculations of the data. For example, if you --
21 I don't know if you want to separate these out or not,
22 but the point to all that is just to calculate what is
23 called "percent similarity" between the sites.
24 Q I would like to subdivide, then, Rader
25 No. 29 to the point where you have indicated the first
61ÿ
1 half of that composite exhibit and band that together as
2 the first half of a composite exhibit and then band
3 together -- does the second half all fit together in a
4 similar fashion?
5 A Uh-huh.
6 Q And would you identify the second half,
7 also. This does not go to the beginning. What you have
8 identified does not go to the very beginning?
9 A This is different from that (indicating).
10 Q We've got to figure out a way to talk about
11 it. Shall we pull this out and make a separate exhibit?
12 A I would.
13 Q Let's go off the record and mark it
14 separately.
15 (Rader Exhibit 37(1-63) was marked
16 for identification by the reporter and is
17 included herewith.)
18 (Discussion off the record.)
19 MS. PONZOLI: Let's go back on the record.
20 Rader No. 27, Mr. Hyde, your question was
21 is that the summary of the data?
22 MR. HYDE: Yes.
23 MS. PONZOLI: Is that what you had said?
24 MR. HYDE: I thought we were on 29.
25 MS. PONZOLI: We were on 29. We were on
62ÿ
1 composite 29, but there was a subpart of
2 composite 29 which Dr. Rader now identifies as
3 really having a separate rationale, and he
4 suggests that to understand the data, it would be
5 well to separate it out.
6 Q Is that accurate --
7 MR. HYDE: All right.
8 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: -- Dr. Rader?
9 A Yes.
10 Q So Rader No. 37, if you'll just tell us one
11 more time, is what?
12 A Is percent similarity calculations between
13 sites.
14 MR. HYDE: The way you threw me off -- you said
15 "27" instead of "37."
16 MS. PONZOLI: Oh, I'm sorry. Is that what I
17 said? The record will reflect Rader 37.
18 Q Dr. Rader, we're still now with
19 Rader Exhibit No. 29, composite exhibit. Did you
20 indicate there was another subpart of Rader 29
21 that should be separated out?
22 A Yes. This is rarity calculations,
23 calculating the rarity index.
24 MS. PONZOLI: All right. Rader No. 38 will be
25 the rarity index.
63ÿ
1 (Rader Exhibit 38(1-18) was marked
2 for identification by the reporter and is
3 included herewith.)
4 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Do we have another subset
5 of 29?
6 A Yeah. I think it would be good to separate
7 it too. It's a summary of the data sent to us by
8 Jerry Qualls on water quality along the gradient at those
9 sites that I used.
10 MS. PONZOLI: That will be Rader Exhibit No. 39.
11 (Rader Exhibit 39(1-10) was marked
12 for identification by the reporter and is
13 included herewith.)
14 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Do we have another subset?
15 I feel my life getting more complicated.
16 A Yeah. I think, seeing as we started along,
17 it would be easier, you know --
18 Q Right.
19 A -- for one seeking to understand it.
20 This is a summary tables of these data.
21 MS. PONZOLI: So Rader No. 40 will be the summary
22 tables of the data we've been discussing.
23 Q Now, this is not Dr. Qualls's data? This is
24 your invertebrate data?
25 A Exactly.
64ÿ
1 MR. HYDE: To make the record clear, which
2 exhibits are we talking about Exhibit 40
3 referring to?
4 MS. PONZOLI: Rader Exhibit No. 40 is his summary
5 data.
6 Q Is that accurate, Dr. Rader?
7 A Yes. Those are summary tables of the data
8 by site and month.
9 (Rader Exhibit 40(1-62) was marked
10 for identification by the reporter and is
11 included herewith.)
12 THE WITNESS: It might be good to include this
13 with that (indicating). This is just -- it's --
14 it's similar. It's just calculating the
15 representation of coleoptera, which are beetles,
16 and so forth.
17 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Why don't we make that a
18 separate exhibit.
19 A Okay.
20 Q That will be Rader Exhibit No. 41. Do we
21 still have a 29?
22 A It beats me. I haven't been keeping track
23 of the numbers.
24 Q I think we lost 29, didn't we, in the
25 process?
65ÿ
1 A Did we break 29 up?
2 Q Did your cover sheet have anything on it
3 that we had?
4 A Oh, sorry.
5 Q But is there anything -- no. We've taken 29
6 and subdivided it totally.
7 I guess I suggest that, just so the record
8 is clear, we'll just include 29 and indicate that
9 it was subdivided totally so that it won't be
10 lost. There won't appear to be a missing
11 exhibit.
12 Would you mark this last one as Rader
13 Exhibit No. 41.
14 (Rader Exhibit 41(1-16) was marked
15 for identification by the reporter and is
16 included herewith.)
17 MS. PONZOLI: We'll take a lunch break now, and
18 come back in half an hour.
19 MR. HYDE: Sure.
20 (Lunch recess.)
21 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Dr. Rader, I'm going to
22 hand you Rader composite Exhibit No. 30 and ask you to
23 identify it.
24 A These are the what I call the "core data,"
25 or data from core samples taken along the enrichment
66ÿ
1 gradient in 2-A, Water Conservation Area 2-A and B. This
2 is the raw data (indicating). This is a summary of that
3 data (indicating), and this is a table summarizing the
4 summary.
5 Q The table summarizing the data is the first
6 document within the composite exhibit?
7 A Right.
8 Q Does Rader composite Exhibit No. 30 include
9 all of the sites found on Johnson Exhibit No. 13 and
10 Rader Exhibit No. 36, all sites along the gradient
11 underneath 10D, 10C, and 10A?
12 A No. Just the ones circled.
13 Q Only the ones where you did your work?
14 A Right.
15 Q All right. I'm going to hand you composite
16 Exhibit No. 31 and ask you to identify that, please.
17 A Let me check it one more time here. This is
18 all the oxygen and pH data. This was oxygen and pH data
19 from the enrichment along the enrichment gradient in
20 Water Conservation Area 2-A.
21 Q That's Rader composite Exhibit No. 31 up to
22 the blue marker, or blue page marker; is that accurate?
23 A That's right. And this is oxygen and pH
24 data comparing an unenriched slough area in 2-B to
25 enriched fertilizer plots within that same slough in 2-B
67ÿ
1 to unenriched sawgrass area in the same vicinity of 2-B,
2 that same slough, and there's also some data of the
3 enriched area, then, on oxygen and pH -- yeah, in the
4 enriched area.
5 Q Where is that last site, the enriched area
6 that had oxygen and pH? Where was that particular site?
7 A There was one site about three-quarters of a
8 mile south of the C-gate. There was another site about a
9 hundred meters directly south of the C-gate.
10 Q All right. Are loran or GPS readings given
11 for those sites in the data?
12 A I'm afraid not.
13 Q How would you locate them, again?
14 A The one that's a hundred meters south of the
15 C-gate, I just remember it. I mean, it's in my head as
16 to where it's at. And the other one, I haven't tried to
17 relocate.
18 Q How would we know which is which when we
19 look at the data?
20 A Which of the two enriched plots?
21 Q Which of the two enriched areas will we
22 tell -- I'm also going to want to be able to locate these
23 unenriched and enriched sites within 2-B. I'm going to
24 want you to locate those for me. You've got potentially
25 eight different sites here that we're talking about,
68ÿ
1 don't you?
2 A No. We have three different sites and one
3 unenriched slough site, and at that enriched slough
4 site -- unenriched slough site, I ventured a few meters
5 out into the sawgrass from that slough, from the margin
6 of that slough. Then within the slough area, I took
7 samples of oxygen, or readings of oxygen and pH.
8 Q Yes.
9 A And in that same slough site, Dr. Craft has
10 some fertilizer experiments ongoing within plots, and I
11 took oxygen readings within those. So I consider that as
12 one site that have two enriched sites that I have used to
13 measure oxygen and pH.
14 Q I'm going to leave you to locate those. I
15 have Johnson Exhibit No. 12. Would you be able to
16 identify on Johnson Exhibit No. 12 where these sites are
17 if I point out to you that Mr. Johnson yesterday
18 indicated sites for the dosing study and sites for what I
19 understand to be -- is it the fertilizer experiment?
20 A Uh-huh.
21 Q And then the hydrology experiment was just a
22 few --
23 A Right.
24 Q -- hundred meters off of C, the C site.
25 What's marked as the C site is the easternmost site --
69ÿ
1 A Uh-huh.
2 Q -- in Water Conservation Area 2-B.
3 Would you be able to locate for me these
4 three sites we're talking about here?
5 A The unenriched site for certain and one of
6 the enriched sites for certain.
7 Q All right.
8 A And the other enriched site is less --
9 probably not terribly close, and inaccurately I could do
10 so.
11 Q All right. Let me get a copy of this just
12 so we'll attach one to your deposition.
13 A Okay.
14 (Discussion off the record.)
15 MS. PONZOLI: Let's go back on the record.
16 Q Dr. Rader, I'm handing you -- I guess it's
17 my personal copy of Johnson Exhibit No. 12 from
18 yesterday, and I'm going to ask you to identify the three
19 sites, to the best of your ability, that you are
20 indicating the data in Rader Exhibit No. 31 contains.
21 A Right here (indicating). This is what we
22 refer to as the slough site --
23 Q And that was --
24 A -- in 2-B.
25 Q And Mr. Johnson had indicated that was
70ÿ
1 site -- would that be A? Can you tell from this?
2 A Yeah, it looks like A. I haven't referred
3 to them as A, B, and C myself. I just call them
4 sawgrass, mixed, and slough site.
5 Q This is the slough site which is the
6 westernmost site in 2-B?
7 A Yes.
8 Q And that would have been your unenriched
9 site?
10 A Right. And then one enriched site at the
11 C-gate and one probably right here.
12 Q You put two x's below the C gate in Water
13 Conservation Area 2-A. The last letter that Mr. Johnson
14 used, I think, was a D. You want to label those E and F,
15 and then we'll be able to keep track of what we've done.
16 A (Witness complies.)
17 Q Are these at the same sites that gradient
18 work was done in?
19 A Not exactly, no.
20 Q Do you want to tell us how they differ, how
21 far off they are from the other 10C sites?
22 A Site E is just right at the C gate, just a
23 hundred meters --
24 Q Okay.
25 A -- past the canal embankment.
71ÿ
1 Q Right.
2 A And F is probably three-quarters of a mile
3 beyond that site --
4 Q Okay.
5 A -- just due south of this, of the C gate.
6 Q Now, when we're looking at the data within
7 Rader composite Exhibit No. 31, how do we know which set
8 of data we're looking at?
9 A Okay. Maybe I can -- would it be helpful to
10 indicate that this section of data are preliminary, the
11 first time I went out to collect oxygen and pH from the
12 plots, the fertilizer plots at the slough site in 2-B?
13 Could we just indicate this point here (indicating).
14 Q You've also paper-clipped them. You could
15 probably more accurately read into the record the Bates
16 numbers on the bottom of the page. Do you see those
17 numbers at the bottom?
18 A Uh-huh. So pages from 1009354 to 1009357
19 are preliminary data, just for a set taken. Okay.
20 (Rader Exhibit 42 was marked
21 for identification by the reporter and is
22 included herewith.)
23 THE WITNESS: It looks like now that these two
24 are preliminary data, from page 1009358 to page
25 1009383, from all of the sites in 2-B -- okay? --
72ÿ
1 from what I call the "slough site" as well as
2 the --
3 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Two enriched sites?
4 A No.
5 Q Okay.
6 A -- as well as the sawgrass and mixed sites.
7 So on this sheet of paper it would be
8 sites -- it looks like A --
9 Q B and C, isn't it?
10 A B and C, yeah. So these are data collected,
11 preliminary data, from all of the plots at each of those
12 locations, the fertilizer site -- water depths, oxygen,
13 pH.
14 Q And you pulled this data yourself?
15 A I what?
16 Q Did you actually collect it?
17 A Collected it, yes. And that's what that is.
18 Then we come to these data (indicating), which are
19 24-hour profiles, which is what I was referring to
20 earlier when I talked about the three sites, two enriched
21 and the slough site. Then we have 24-hour oxygen
22 profiles of data collected over a 24-hour period to
23 document the fluctuation over that time period. That
24 extends from page 1009384 to page 1009483.
25 Q Okay.
73ÿ
1 A This is separate (indicating).
2 Q What is "this," now?
3 A Are we at 31? This is all 31.
4 Q We're still on composite Exhibit 31. Why
5 don't you read the numbers -- that seems to be a rational
6 way to deal with it -- into the record.
7 A From page 1009998 to 1010033, and these are
8 oxygen and pH measurements taken along the enrichment
9 gradient.
10 Q All three or 10C?
11 A 10C for sure. D1 and D2, those that I have
12 circled there.
13 Q Right.
14 A I think that's all.
15 Q The eight sites at which you collected
16 information?
17 A I believe so, yes. I don't think I took
18 them at the other sites. Do you want me to indicate what
19 this is (indicating)?
20 Q Right. Why don't you as part of composite
21 Exhibit No. 31.
22 A 1008534 to 1008535 is just a -- it's
23 nothing. It's -- it's a copy on the inside of a "Rite in
24 the Rain" data collection. I thought it was another
25 table, an oxygen conversion table, but it's not. I'm not
74ÿ
1 sure what this is or why -- why they would copy it.
2 Q Was part of your field notes, maybe a
3 booklet that your field notes were written in?
4 A Yeah, yeah. It was inside cover.
5 Q Why don't you slip it inside the composite
6 exhibit. Put it inside, though, not on top because the
7 number should be on top.
8 A Here?
9 Q That's fine.
10 A Okay.
11 Q So that's everything with Rader composite
12 Exhibit No. 31?
13 A Yep.
14 Q I'm going to hand you Rader composite
15 Exhibit No. 32 and ask you if you can identify that.
16 A These are notes on the identification of
17 species.
18 Q They're just personal laboratory notes you
19 made as you were identifying the species?
20 A Some of them are, and some of them are
21 communication with people that I sent some samples out
22 to.
23 Q All right. I guess it's sort of an odd
24 question stuck in the middle here, but it strikes me that
25 we don't have a lot of correspondence among your
75ÿ
1 documents, Dr. Rader. Is there a particular reason?
2 A None that I can think of.
3 Q You don't correspond in writing very much
4 with Dr. Richardson or --
5 A Oh, usually, if I need to talk with Curt, we
6 do so on the phone, just call.
7 Q Was there ever any indication that this was
8 a preferred method of communication so things were not
9 reduced to writing?
10 A No.
11 Q So you were never given any instructions in
12 this regard?
13 A No. It was just easier.
14 Q Is Dr. Richardson fairly easy to reach by
15 phone on a continual basis?
16 A Oh, I don't know on a continual basis, but I
17 can always leave a message there with people there to
18 return my call.
19 Q You don't have communication by E-mail or
20 anything?
21 A No.
22 Q I think we need to identify this Rader
23 Exhibit No. 42. We talked about it, and we marked it,
24 but we didn't actually identify it. Will you just tell
25 into the record what it is because we've been talking
76ÿ
1 about it. The records needs to reflect what that
2 document is.
3 A It's a map of the water conservation areas
4 1, 2, and 3 in South Florida.
5 Q And on it you have indicated what?
6 A I have circled and indicated sites that were
7 used to collect oxygen and pH data.
8 Q Okay. Thank you. And Rader composite
9 exhibit No. 32, that's all that you have on this
10 particular exhibit?
11 A Yeah, yeah. Notes to myself about
12 identifications communications with people that
13 identified samples for me.
14 Q Okay.
15 (Discussion off the record.)
16 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: I'm going to hand you
17 composite Exhibit Rader No. 33, Dr. Rader, and ask you
18 what it is.
19 A These are the notes, reflects the notes from
20 a field book that I used in the oxygen and pH studies.
21 Q Is the time frame reflected in the field
22 notes?
23 A The time frame being of when samples were
24 collected?
25 Q Right, of when those notes were made.
77ÿ
1 A Yes.
2 Q And locations, the locations about which
3 they were made?
4 A Looks like in most cases, yep.
5 Q All right. I'm going to hand you -- is that
6 everything on composite Exhibit No. 33?
7 A Yep.
8 Q I'm going to hand you Rader composite
9 Exhibit No. 34 and ask you, can you identify that?
10 A Yes. These are summary of weekly meetings
11 that were held for a period of time.
12 Q Weekly meetings among whom?
13 A People that were working at the Loxahatchee
14 branch of the Duke Wetland Center.
15 Q And those people who have included whom?
16 A Oh, Bob Johnson, myself, John Zahina. I
17 think there were a few others that were included in those
18 meetings. Yeah. Stewart it looks like was there.
19 Q Stewart who?
20 A I don't remember Stewart's last name. He
21 was an undergraduate helping us. Jan Vymazal was
22 included in some of these meetings when he was down doing
23 work. I think that looks like it's about it.
24 Q Dr. Vymazal's work -- while we've mentioned
25 him, if we were to look back at Rader Exhibit No. 42, can
78ÿ
1 you indicate to me where Dr. Vymazal's work was done
2 either on that or on Rader Exhibit No. 36?
3 A Not really. That's probably best done by
4 Jan.
5 Q You don't know where he did his work?
6 A I know where he did some of his work. I
7 don't know where he did all of his work, no.
8 Q Tell me where you think he did some of his
9 work.
10 A I think that he's done some of his work in
11 the slough site in 2-B.
12 Q All right. That was A, I believe, we had
13 indicated, wasn't it?
14 A Yes, right.
15 Q And anywhere else that you're aware of?
16 A Well, I think he's done some work at the
17 dosing study site too.
18 Q Which is, I think, D on this map?
19 A Is that D on there?
20 Q If you and I are looking at it, I think at
21 least I will understand that it was D. I think
22 Mr. Johnson wrote it upside down, but I'm not sure.
23 A Yeah, yeah.
24 Q But actually, it's the only mark in 2-A
25 isn't it?
79ÿ
1 A I guess, yeah.
2 Q Okay. Anywhere else? The slough site in
3 2-B and the dosing site in 2-A. Both dosing sites or
4 just one?
5 A Both, uh-huh.
6 Q Both. Anywhere else that you're aware of?
7 A No, not really. Doesn't mean he hasn't
8 worked somewhere else.
9 Q No, no, no. I understand. I know you're
10 just telling me where you are personally aware.
11 A Yes.
12 Q Have you ever gone out with Dr. Vymazal?
13 A Sure.
14 Q Do you go out with him most times if he
15 comes out?
16 A I would say, no, only when our needs
17 overlap, if we both need to be out sampling. He has to
18 take the airboat. If we both need to go out there, we go
19 out together.
20 Q I'm going to hand you Rader Exhibit No. 35
21 and ask you if you can identify that. Did we do 34? Did
22 we identify 34 on the record?
23 MR. HYDE: Yes. Summary of the weekly meetings
24 with Duke Wetland Center staff.
25 THE WITNESS: These are brief summaries of some
80ÿ
1 experimental designs that I sent primarily to
2 Curt, that I wrote and sent up to Curt.
3 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Have they been incorporated
4 in the work that's presently being done?
5 A As they stand, not entirely, no. In other
6 words, there's been changes and modifications made from
7 this initial -- from these initial works.
8 Q Is there a date on that document, Dr. Rader?
9 A This one right here?
10 Q Yes, sir.
11 A No. I do not see one.
12 Q Do you recall the date?
13 A No. It would definitely be this year.
14 Q In '92. Do you think it was in the spring
15 or the summer?
16 A When did I do that? Springtime would be my
17 guess.
18 Q Just generally, what has been incorporated?
19 A Well, we are doing a decomposition study at
20 the dosing site, and it will not necessarily be like
21 this. There are some similarities and some differences.
22 Would you like me to go into more detail?
23 Q Just a little. Will you be the principal
24 investigator on that?
25 A Yes, as I understand it.
81ÿ
1 Q Just generally, what will you be doing
2 because I'll do this in depth later on?
3 A Be looking at the effects of nutrients
4 levels, nutrient phosphorus concentrations in particular
5 on the decomposition rates of common macrophyte species
6 as well as looking at the effects of invertebrates and
7 invertebrate activities on the decomposition rates. So
8 those two factors.
9 Q Do you have a hypothesis for that work?
10 A Yes, a loosely framed hypothesis.
11 Q Could you give me your loosely framed
12 hypothesis?
13 A Nutrient enrichment will enhance the rate of
14 decomposition. Invertebrates will play a minor roll in
15 the decomposition rate of the recalcitrant species, an
16 important roll in the decomposition of the labile
17 macroinvertebate species. The nutrient enrichment will
18 enhance decomposition of macrophyte species in general.
19 Invertebrates will have a negligible impact on
20 recalcitrant or tough species, and they will have an
21 important impact on -- what's another word for
22 "labile"? -- easily decomposable material.
23 Q Is this work geared toward providing
24 information toward STA design?
25 A Indirectly.
82ÿ
1 Q Is the hypothesis one that is a general
2 matter you would assume to be accurate?
3 A Is a general matter? I don't -- what?
4 Q Well, I mean I'm not a scientist. I'm a
5 lawyer obviously, but it would just seem that it would
6 seem to be a commonsense conclusion.
7 A What's that?
8 Q What your hypothesis is.
9 A Oh, no, not at all.
10 Q Not at all?
11 A No.
12 Q Why is that?
13 A Enrichment --
14 (Fire alarm testing interruption.)
15 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Okay. Go ahead.
16 A Enrichment can either enhance or slow the
17 rate of decomposition, depending on the conditions.
18 Q In a subtropical condition would that be
19 true? It could be either one in a subtropical?
20 A Could be, yeah. That's what we'll find out.
21 Q All right. Have we done all the -- no, we
22 haven't done all the documents we had before. We have
23 another pile. Should we mark these off the record and
24 then have you identify them? These were a separate pile,
25 were they not?
83ÿ
1 A Yeah.
2 Q Okay.
3 (Rader Exhibits 43(1-13), 44(1-9), 45(1-14),
4 46(1-10), 47(1-13) and 48(1-14) were marked
5 for identification by the reporter and are
6 included herewith.)
7 MS. PONZOLI: Dr. Rader was indicating some
8 information he thought would be helpful on the
9 record.
10 Q Dr. Rader?
11 A Although the decomposition study done in the
12 dosing experiment is indirectly related to STA's, it's
13 directly related to the effects of enrichment on the
14 Everglades and hence it's relevancy in this whole issue.
15 Q You have a number of studies that are
16 related to nutrient enrichment, do you not? You, the
17 Duke Wetland Center?
18 A Yes.
19 Q In fact, the bulk of your experiments are
20 related to that, are they not?
21 A I would say so, yeah.
22 Q My understanding is the single experiment
23 you have on hydrology is the one done by Dr. Richardson?
24 A He's a leader in that project, yes.
25 Q Who else works with him on that?
84ÿ
1 A Hydrology? Well, we all took part in the
2 construction of the experiment. All of us went out, in
3 other words, to get it started.
4 Q And dug dirt?
5 A Exactly, to dig the dirt. And we all had a
6 good time doing that and -- but from there I'm not sure
7 what roll others of us might place in that. It remains
8 to be seen.
9 Q I asked Mr. Johnson a question yesterday
10 that maybe you can answer for us. Why 30 centimeters
11 down? Why was 30 centimeters -- he indicated that was
12 what was dug down and then either replaced or added on
13 top of et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. What was the
14 significance of 30 centimeters?
15 A I think it was simply -- well, rather than
16 speculate, it would be better just to ask Curt.
17 Q You don't know?
18 A For certain why he chose 30 centimeters as
19 opposed to 31 --
20 Q Well, why the 30-ish.
21 A -- or 38. No.
22 Q But why do you think it was 30-ish?
23 A Simply to go down deep enough to create
24 relatively -- or continuously inundated conditions and
25 to go up high enough to create more dry conditions
85ÿ
1 relative to the ground level.
2 Q Okay. I'd like to ask you if you can
3 identify Rader composite Exhibit No. 43.
4 A Yeah. Just slides that I've had made on the
5 invertebrate data mostly.
6 Q And did you present these slides somewhere,
7 Dr. Rader?
8 A These? These specific slides -- well, if it
9 wasn't these specific slides, then a close rendition
10 thereto. Very similar slides were presented at the
11 Intecol meeting.
12 Q I'll have to ask you to identify Rader
13 composite Exhibit No. 44.
14 A Yeah. These are just figures, summary
15 tables that I made up, summary figures that I haven't
16 really used anywhere. I haven't talked about them or
17 presented them in a talk, or they haven't been published
18 or anything like that.
19 Q But they do reflect your work accurately, as
20 you understand it, at present?
21 A These data, particularly here, this pore
22 water table, surface soils -- surface soils are not my
23 data. They're summaries taken from the annual report of
24 Jerry Qualls's data primarily.
25 Q I would find those same summaries in the
86ÿ
1 annual report?
2 A You should, right.
3 Q These -- you want to indicate page numbers?
4 Q Right. It would be better for the record.
5 A So Jerry's data, from page 1009209 to
6 1009211 are summary of Jerry's data; my data, from
7 1009212 to 1009216.
8 Q Yes. And you believe that accurately
9 reflects your work in a graph form?
10 A Yes.
11 Q All right. Very good. Maybe that's the set
12 of data I'll review. I'd like you to identify, please,
13 Rader composite Exhibit No. 45.
14 A These are more tables and figures that have
15 been used -- some of them haven't been used, and some of
16 them have been used for the Intecol presentation or could
17 have been. Like this table (indicating) I could have
18 used. I've had about eight slides of that table made
19 because of very slight changes and rewording across the
20 top and so forth. So I'm not sure this is the exact one
21 I've used but real close to that.
22 Q Would you indicate for the record the page
23 number?
24 A 1009017.
25 Q You think it's accurate. It's just a
87ÿ
1 refinement of presentations that you would -- one would
2 differ from another?
3 A Right. Some of them are a summary at when
4 the data were not at a final stage or complete stage.
5 This is a good example of what we have here. That's
6 another slide of Jerry's pore water data. It's just with
7 cross hatches this time because it's easier -- makes a
8 better slide.
9 Q I see what you mean.
10 A So there's all sorts of that going on in
11 these.
12 Q So some of these you've just chosen a better
13 visual presentation than another, but for accuracy of
14 data, you don't think one is more accurate than another?
15 A Unless it's an early one, a summary from one
16 made earlier on and gave in terms of discussing this is
17 where we're at this point, this is what we have.
18 Q They aren't always dated, are they?
19 A I'm afraid not.
20 Q I didn't think so. Rader composite Exhibit
21 No. 46, can you identify that?
22 A Yeah. These were figures and tables that I
23 put together for a talk that I thought I was going to be
24 giving to the Water Management Board, the Governor's
25 Board, in April. That was postponed and has not been
88ÿ
1 done. This is just an outline of that talk and the
2 slides I was going to use.
3 Q Do you believe this would still be an
4 accurate reflection of the research you've done, though?
5 A To that point, though, but that is not the
6 final rendition, though. It's accurate up to that point.
7 So that was going to be a statement of qualification I'd
8 have to make during the talk that this is what I have to
9 date.
10 Q Do you believe that -- well, say, in
11 December, when we finish your deposition, if I were to
12 ask you about these pages of composite Exhibit No. 46,
13 that there will be some statements that will change or
14 shift?
15 A As far as written statements in there, I
16 don't think so, no. It's not like the data changed
17 drastically from my summarizing the first five months to
18 my summarizing all six months of data.
19 Q All right. The difference might be that --
20 A Numbers.
21 Q -- you might say short term is this; long
22 term might be something different?
23 A Well, it might be in exact numbers. Like
24 the calculation of diversity at this site is going to
25 change because I've added final month.
89ÿ
1 Q But you don't believe any of your
2 conclusions will change?
3 A Let me look at what the conclusions say.
4 Slight spelling correction.
5 Q Inherent in my question of will your
6 conclusions change is will you add additional
7 conclusions?
8 A Yes, I -- hence I want to read the
9 conclusions to make sure that it's accurate. With one
10 addition they will stand.
11 Q What's the addition going to be?
12 A I would add a No. 3, conclusion No. 3, the
13 words "do not appear to affect diversity and density."
14 The reason I do that, the statement is decreases in
15 oxygen do not appear to affect diversity and density.
16 The reason I want to add that is because it appears that
17 there are decreases in oxygen. It isn't for certain.
18 And the rationale for suggesting that that
19 does not affect the diversity and density of
20 invertebrates is the fact that in areas where it appears
21 that oxygen concentrations are lower than unenriched
22 areas, the numbers of invertebrates and their density is
23 high. That type of scientific information is different
24 from experimental studies brought into the lab, for
25 example, if you know what I'm trying to say there.
90ÿ
1 Q Yes.
2 A It's -- okay. So I would add that brief
3 qualifier; otherwise, it would stand fine.
4 Q Okay.
5 A I did add it.
6 Q Rader composite Exhibit No. 47, can you
7 identify that?
8 A It's more of the same, just slides that I
9 prepared for talks or possible talks that I thought I
10 might be giving.
11 Q The same situation, though? You think it's
12 an accurate reflection of your work, as you understand
13 it? Well, I think what I'm trying to save myself here is
14 going through it and then all of a sudden you come back
15 and say well, that's all just a year out of date. I
16 don't think any of that is true anymore.
17 A So we can save time if I look through it
18 now?
19 Q Yes. I'll know that this is what you mean;
20 so when I ask you questions you're not going to say well,
21 you wasted your time. I don't think any of that anymore.
22 My thinking has evolved a whole long way down the road.
23 A Yep. These conclusions are fine.
24 Q Okay.
25 A Well, for that page.
91ÿ
1 Q Oh, all right. If the page changes, just
2 tell me the number of the page and the changes that you
3 believe you would make.
4 Are those your handwritten notes that you're
5 now looking at as part of the composite exhibit?
6 A Yes. Oh, handwritten notes for a talk.
7 Q Was the talk given?
8 A Yes, I think so. I think it's the -- I
9 think what these are are the first go-through of notes
10 for the talk at The Society of Wetlands Scientists
11 meetings, and these are just slides. So yeah, they can
12 stand as accurate.
13 Q I'll ask you to identify Rader composite
14 Exhibit No. 48.
15 A These just look like, except for that -- oh,
16 this is just a talk given by Dr. Richardson and myself to
17 the Water Management Board in July of '91, and these are
18 an outline of that presentation as well as the sum of the
19 slides given at that time.
20 Q Okay. And did you present as part of that
21 presentation, Dr. Rader?
22 A Yes, I did.
23 Q Okay. It was you and Dr. Richardson?
24 A That's right.
25 Q All right. I think that finishes -- unless
92ÿ
1 you have anything over there separately, I think that
2 finishes all the hard copy that was produced on your
3 behalf.
4 Does that seem accurate to everyone at the
5 table? Does anyone think there's more documents
6 around here?
7 MR. HYDE: Do you want to put this in the stack?
8 MS. PONZOLI: Right. All right.
9 Q We have two more discrete groups of
10 documents, Dr. Rader, that we need to identify into the
11 record, and barring some unforeseen event, that will be
12 it. The next discrete set of documents that we have are
13 back-up disks that are labeled, in someone's handwriting
14 which I did not identify, as gradient transit data, and
15 there are eight. I believe they're Apple disks. These
16 are copies, as I understand it, from your disks.
17 Are you able to look at them, at least look
18 at the labeling on these disks and tell us what these
19 appear to be?
20 A It looks like somebody writing my headings
21 to the disks that were on there.
22 Q And did you provide eight such disks?
23 A I think it was eight, yeah.
24 Q To Mr. Burgess? Whom did you turn them over
25 to actually?
93ÿ
1 A Yeah, Rick Burgess.
2 Q Okay. All right. We have had someone print
3 out hard copy of lists, menus, something on that order.
4 I'm going to ask you to match them up with the disks and
5 see if they appear to you to reflect what you recall
6 being on these. Do you understand what I mean by "menu"
7 or "list"? I'm not the most computer-literate person in
8 the world.
9 A Yeah, I do. You know, this is hard because,
10 you know, in that little space, you can't just adequately
11 describe everything that you have on there. I almost
12 always have to open it up and see what I have in there.
13 Q You're talking about disk No. 1 or any of
14 the disks generically?
15 A Any disk. If we have a computer, I can tell
16 you, but honestly I'm not sure how quickly or even
17 accurately I can match these all up without opening them
18 and looking at them.
19 Q Okay. For purposes of today, why don't we
20 take the printouts that we had made for disks 1 through
21 8, and why don't you tell us -- I assume that these words
22 reflect things that you put into your computer. Do they
23 look familiar, if you were to look at what's printed out?
24 A Yep.
25 Q Let's have you explain to us what those are
94ÿ
1 and maybe at your substantive deposition -- do you have a
2 laptop that you could bring with you?
3 A No, I'm afraid not. I have an IBM laptop, a
4 Zenith Super Sport. I don't have an Apple.
5 Q How did you create these Apple disks?
6 A No. Well, I have a Macintosh SC-30. We
7 have a Macintosh. I couldn't bring it around. It's not
8 a laptop.
9 Q Okay . So you keep everything on your own
10 Apple disks, though?
11 A Yes.
12 Q So what you're telling me is I'm going to
13 have to have them converted in order to do anything
14 useful with them.
15 MR. HYDE: Or get an Apple machine.
16 MS. PONZOLI: Whichever is cheaper.
17 MR. HYDE: I can't think of any other way to do it.
18 THE WITNESS: Yeah.
19 MR. HYDE: You'd have to convert them to IBM or
20 get an Apple machine or access to an Apple
21 machine.
22 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Okay. Well, let's go
23 through the identifications, and I understand the
24 qualification that you are placing on all of this. I'm
25 going to put -- unless Mr. Hyde has some problem, I'm
95ÿ
1 just going to put these hard copies into the record, and
2 I'm going to retain my Apple disks. I see no point in
3 turning them over to the court reporter and having her
4 create still a third and fourth and fifth set of Apple
5 disks. That seems a useless activity to me.
6 MR. HYDE: I have no objection.
7 MS. PONZOLI: All right. Then maybe we should
8 have her mark each of these printouts, and then
9 Dr. Rader can tell us what he can about them.
10 Q She should mark yours, Dr. Rader.
11 A Okay. These are both --
12 Q No. She's just going to mark the hard copy.
13 A Okay.
14 (Rader Exhibits 49(1-3), 50, 51(1-8),
15 52(1-2), 53(1-13), 54(1-9), 55(1-3) and 56(1-17)
16 were marked for identification by the reporter and
17 are included herewith.)
18 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Rader Composite Exhibit
19 No. 49, Dr. Rader, does that appear familiar to you?
20 A Yes.
21 Q Can you identify this disk?
22 A Right. Yes, I can.
23 Q Can you tell us what it is?
24 A Right. What is labeled "C.V." refers to the
25 coefficient of variation. What that refers to is
96ÿ
1 calculations, that coefficient of variation sample,
2 coefficient of variation; so it reflects the degree of
3 variability in the data, the individual replicates at
4 each site for the nutrient enrichment/gradient study.
5 Q And we have the "Size" and the "Kind." What
6 does that mean? I'm sorry. I just -- and then we have
7 the date last modified, the date.
8 A "Size" refers to the amount of memory space
9 being used, and "Kind" refers to the fact that a
10 Microsoft Excel package was used to do these
11 calculations. And then when these records were last
12 updated is indicated on the far right there and the last
13 time I opened them up. Each time you open it up, the
14 computer records it.
15 (Discussion off the record).
16 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Dr. Rader, have you already
17 produced all this data as hard copy among the data we've
18 gone through?
19 A I don't know about the C.V. data. I don't
20 know if I made a hard copy on that or not. I don't
21 recall seeing it there. I might add, you know, you can
22 certainly pull a hard copy off if you'd like, but I
23 haven't used it beyond calculating it since.
24 Q Okay.
25 A At the time I thought I should know what
97ÿ
1 that variation was, and I haven't really made use of it
2 since.
3 Q And I understand that the software package
4 is a commercially available package; is that right?
5 A Yes.
6 Q And you haven't modified it in any
7 particular way for your own use?
8 A No.
9 Q All right. In order to use that disk, is
10 there anything else I need to know?
11 A To get into it?
12 Q Yes.
13 A No. Apple is real easy. You just put it in
14 and turn on the machine and just click on whatever you
15 want to use, just open it up and click on it. Well, you
16 can click on that. Well, you will have to have the
17 Microsoft Excel package to do it.
18 Q Right.
19 A Now, if you have that, it's real easy.
20 Q Did you tell me what is on the second page
21 of this, the sweeps?
22 A No.
23 Q All right.
24 A Those are, for each date, the taxa -- they
25 are taxa tables. So for each taxa at each site for that
98ÿ
1 particular date is indicated their densities or their
2 numbers.
3 Q Was this produced in hard copy?
4 A Yes.
5 Q All of it, you believe?
6 A That's in hard copy, uh-huh.
7 Q You don't happen to know which one, do you?
8 A I'm afraid not right off.
9 Q Did we identify it pretty clearly as we went
10 through it?
11 A Yeah.
12 Q Okay. Rader composite -- or I guess it's a
13 single exhibit, No. 50.
14 A Uh-huh.
15 Q What is that?
16 A These are the data that Jerry sent down and
17 his water chemistry data from the gradient/enrichment
18 study -- or what are we saying? Nutrient/gradient.
19 Q Was this -- this was not produced in hard
20 copy, was it?
21 A No, huh-uh. But there are summary -- I
22 think there are summary tables or rather figures of these
23 data or a part of these data.
24 Q In the appendices to '91?
25 A Yeah, on the '91 appendices. All this is
99ÿ
1 probably there. I don't know for sure, but you might ask
2 Jerry that. But I think they're all there.
3 Q How do you mean these were "sent down"?
4 A Oh, sent from Duke, down from North
5 Carolina.
6 Q On a disk?
7 A Yes, yeah.
8 Q Was there a cover memo that came down with
9 them?
10 A Not that I recall. I just called Jerry and
11 explained what I was doing and asked if he could send
12 down the data, and he said, sure.
13 Q He sent you down the disk. And to what
14 purpose did you put it?
15 A I used it to calculate the -- at the sites I
16 indicated on the map earlier -- D-1, D-2, C-2, -3, -4,
17 -5, -6 -- the concentration of phosphorus in the pore
18 water at the 12.5-centimeter depth.
19 Q Why did you use the 12.5-centimeter depth?
20 A It's because I felt that that depth is the
21 depth where the phosphorus is most likely at equilibrium
22 with surrounding soil concentrations; so the best
23 indicator of enrichment is probably -- let me put it this
24 way. One of the good indicators of enrichment, based on
25 water chemistry data is pore water data, and I felt the
100ÿ
1 12.5-centimeter depth was the better depth than a deeper
2 depth of 60 centimeters or shallower depths.
3 Q Why did you think it would be at equilibrium
4 at that point?
5 A The deeper you go, phosphorus -- recent as
6 in the last several decades or few decades, phosphorus at
7 the -- at the deeper depths probably has not been
8 accumulating, and there was some data that Jerry
9 indicated from his annual report that at the deeper
10 depths those pore water are somewhat not representative
11 of recently deposited phosphorus-type materials.
12 And really for -- Jerry goes into that in
13 his report and really summarizes it better than I am
14 right now. So you should probably look at that for a
15 complete understanding of why that depth is probably
16 better than deeper depths and why the pore water at that
17 depth is more likely at equilibrium with the
18 concentrations of phosphorus in the surrounding peat.
19 Q Does he also explain why it's important that
20 you're looking at recently deposited phosphorus
21 materials, in that explanation?
22 A Oh, yeah. I'm sure he does, yeah. "Recent"
23 is a relative term. Recent -- I used it as in decades
24 not like yesterday.
25 Q Some of this is beginning to sound more like
101ÿ
1 an art than a science.
2 A No. It's science.
3 Q Not a mixture?
4 A Depends on how you define "art" and how you
5 define "science."
6 Q Maybe that's what this is all about.
7 A Oh, I hope not. I hope we're not going to
8 try and do that.
9 Q I don't know. Anything else reflected on
10 Rader Exhibit No. 50?
11 A Nope.
12 Q Okay. Rader Exhibit, composite Exhibit
13 No. 51.
14 A Uh-huh.
15 Q What is this?
16 A Oh, these are the data files that I used to
17 calculate rarity index.
18 Q Are these on hard copy?
19 A Yes.
20 Q That we went through this morning?
21 A Uh-huh.
22 Q And looking through this, do you believe
23 that all of this was produced on hard copy?
24 A It also includes the core data.
25 Q Yes. That's like page 3 back, as we move
102ÿ
1 through this composite exhibit?
2 A Yeah. Basic data, certainly; combined
3 sites, I think so. I'm not sure about whether there's a
4 hard copy of the core data for combined sites. I think
5 there certainly is for the enriched, intermediate,
6 unenriched. We have core figures and tables, summary
7 dates within sites. We also have that. The only
8 question mark, I'm not sure about --
9 Q The combined sites?
10 A The combined sites, yeah.
11 Q The next page. No. There's more core taxa.
12 This thing goes on for quite a while. Core taxa is the
13 next page, and then there's more on combined sites on the
14 next page.
15 A Well, I think what they're doing there is
16 just breaking down --
17 Q Okay.
18 A -- and putting each one of these on a
19 separate page is all.
20 Q Oh, all right. Let me see yours. Somehow
21 mine looks different.
22 A (Witness complies.)
23 Q So everything, with the exception of the
24 combined sites, you believe you produced in hard copy for
25 Rader Exhibit No. 51?
103ÿ
1 A I think so.
2 Q Rader Exhibit No. 52.
3 A Uh-huh.
4 Q What is this?
5 A This is a NABS -- "NABS" refers to North
6 American Benthological Society, and I'm scheduled to lead
7 a session of those meetings next spring on just general
8 ecology of macroinvertebrates in wetlands.
9 Q Was any of this information produced in hard
10 copy?
11 A It's a single announcement. I don't know if
12 it was in there or not.
13 Q The second page?
14 A It's not on the second page here. That
15 particular one isn't.
16 Q Okay. All right. So this is just a
17 single --
18 Q Right.
19 A -- in WordStar.
20 Do you want me to explain what the rest are?
21 Q Right. Yes, please.
22 A This is a review that I did for "National
23 Geographic." They asked me to review a proposal asking
24 for funding for a research colleague in Africa --
25 Q Yes.
104ÿ
1 A -- and asked me if I'd review that proposal.
2 That's what that is.
3 Q I assume that was not produced in hard copy?
4 A No.
5 Q Okay.
6 A This next one is the complete data set, that
7 is to say, all sites, dates, with taxa in the first
8 column, dates, replica numbers, mean.
9 Q And that was produced within this grouping
10 that we've already identified?
11 A Yes, in different forms. But this
12 particular file I don't think I printed out. It would
13 take my machine about an hour or two hours to do it.
14 Q This is your total data set on your disk?
15 A For invertebrates on the gradient study,
16 yes.
17 Q Final.
18 A And these are just more rarity calculations
19 here, calculating the rarity index.
20 Q These were not produced in hard copy?
21 A They are the rarity data. I think they're
22 all there.
23 Q Okay.
24 A I think so.
25 Q Rader Exhibit No. 53.
105ÿ
1 A Right.
2 Q What is this?
3 A The "Cores" is the same as what we've talked
4 about. It's just a backup copy. I had two of those. I
5 put one on one disk and one on another. It's no
6 different from Exhibit No. --
7 Q 52? A complete data set or going back to
8 the cores?
9 A Well, you bring up a good point. It's no
10 different from this on Exhibit No. 51.
11 Q Right.
12 A The complete data set refers to the sweep
13 samples, not the core samples.
14 Q Okay. Let me just see. The cores are the
15 same as 51?
16 A Right.
17 Q Gradient study cores?
18 A Yes.
19 Q Anything else on there?
20 A Oh, there is -- the calculation of diversity
21 is this particular -- that folder calculating diversity
22 there, and this is just figures and tables, all of which
23 I think you have hard copies of here.
24 Q They calculate diversity. Is that also
25 produced here in a final form?
106ÿ
1 A I don't know if I have a hard copy of that
2 one.
3 Q Okay.
4 A I think what I have is a hard copy of an
5 earlier need to calculate diversity before I got
6 everything done. So this is the final one, though, right
7 there.
8 Q Rader Exhibit No. 54.
9 A Okay.
10 Q What is this?
11 A The first one, "Appendix, Site Analysis,"
12 that's the appendix for this year's annual report. The
13 summary tables, you do have a hard copy of that.
14 Q For your work?
15 A For my part, yeah.
16 Q And the hard copy was?
17 A I don't remember what number the document
18 was.
19 Q But it's there?
20 A Yes, it's there. This "Data Sheets" is just
21 data forms --
22 Q Okay.
23 A -- the form used to make the data sheets,
24 rosters of samples taken, and you have hard copies of
25 that.
107ÿ
1 It's the inventory one. "Summary, By Each
2 Site" is just a summary. It's a data set of just a mean
3 annual densities of invertebrates for each site. There's
4 D-1 right there; right below, D-2, right on through D-6.
5 Q Is that printed in hard copy?
6 A I'm not sure. It is in one form. It might
7 not be this exact same one.
8 Q Okay.
9 A Summary by enriched, intermediate,
10 unenriched -- you should have that in hard copy. Okay?
11 Q You know, when we were discussing it, I
12 don't remember the intermediate. I remember it going
13 from enriched to unenriched. Where was the intermediate
14 site?
15 A The enriched sites were just combined. C-1,
16 and D-1, D-2 were found in clearly enriched condition
17 close to Hillsboro Canal. And then sites C-2 and C-3 are
18 intermediately enriched; so they're far enough back into
19 the Everglades or back in Water Conservation Area 2-A
20 that they're an intermediate area between the enriched
21 and unenriched. And the unenriched in C-4, C-5, and C-6.
22 Q Can you mark those for me, please.
23 A Yeah.
24 Q You marked them as enriched, intermediate,
25 and unenriched?
108ÿ
1 A I'll make checks for the enriched and stars
2 for -- I'll put a key up here.
3 Q Okay. All right. I interrupted you. You
4 were telling me you weren't sure that you had produced in
5 hard copy the enriched, intermediate, and unenriched
6 summaries. Is that what you said, or it was by each site
7 you weren't sure?
8 A I wasn't sure about each site. You should
9 have the enriched, intermediate, and unenriched. There
10 should be a hard copy of those, and the combined sites is
11 just all of them put together, just another -- the same
12 thing, just another different form, and I think you have
13 a hard copy of.
14 And the same of that summary dates within
15 sites rather than sites by date. For April here's a
16 summary of all the sites. It's by date and all the sites
17 summarized by a particular date, just a different way of
18 looking at the same thing.
19 Q Is there more information reflected on the
20 following pages?
21 A That's odd. I didn't recognize that taxa --
22 what in the world --
23 Q Are we on the same page? I'm on page 2, but
24 I think you're on a different page. You're at taxa tags?
25 A Yeah, on page 2. We already talked about
109ÿ
1 that one. That's just the appendix.
2 Q All right.
3 A So this is just a breakdown of each one of
4 these is all.
5 Q All right.
6 A This is just data sheets on 3, and I don't
7 know what that is. Do you want to --
8 Q No.
9 A Is that -- fine.
10 Q I want to get to the slides.
11 A Okay.
12 Q Rader composite Exhibit No. 55, what is
13 that?
14 A This is the calculation of percent
15 similarity using what most people call Whittaker's
16 percent similarity index. Then we also calculate the
17 table using Jaccard's percent similarity index, just
18 another index, and comparing each site with the other.
19 Q Are they in hard copy?
20 A Yes, I think we have a hard copy of that.
21 Q Is that everything?
22 A Yeah, I think so, yeah.
23 Q All right. The last Rader exhibit,
24 composite Exhibit No. 56 -- this one is rather thick and
25 seems to have more information than the prior ones.
110ÿ
1 What's on here? If you'll just tell me what's in hard
2 copy and what isn't, it would probably be helpful.
3 A Okay. The charts and graphs are -- I don't
4 think -- no. You do have hard copies of those.
5 Q Do you think I have them on all of these?
6 A I think there's only three. I think under
7 the charts and graphs, it's just community factors A, B
8 and habitat suitability, general slides of factors.
9 Q The next page would indicate more graphs.
10 That's just graphs for --
11 A That's on the diurnal and pH/O2 study.
12 Q Okay.
13 A And that you have hard copy of. That's the
14 oxygen data we were talking about earlier.
15 Q A pretty thick pile of --
16 A Yeah.
17 Q -- information.
18 A Yes. Dosing experiment site locations, just
19 one little -- it's a longitude and latitude for that.
20 You have that. It's on hard copy.
21 Q All right. "Holding files"?
22 A These holding files are files that were
23 created as intermediate files when making a calculation,
24 hence the term "holding files." It's, in other words,
25 just a -- it might be just, for example, a different
111ÿ
1 rendition of the same data sets that we've been talking
2 about that you have copies of --
3 Q Okay.
4 A -- many copies of already.
5 And the invertebrate growth experiment, I
6 don't know if you have a hard copy of that or not, but
7 it's just detailing the invertebrate growth part of the
8 dosing experiment. Okay? So it is -- it falls under
9 this category of proposals, and we have had three of
10 those. And I'm not sure you have a hard copy of this or
11 not.
12 Q Is this one a presently pending proposal?
13 A Yes. That's right, yes.
14 Q Is there a hypothesis associated with it?
15 A Yes, yes.
16 Q What is that?
17 A That nutrient enrichment will enhance the
18 growth rates of specific invertebrate taxa, increase
19 growth rate.
20 Q Do you plan to do work on that?
21 A Yeah. We have plans to do that, uh-huh.
22 Q When will that begin?
23 A As soon as the dosing study is up and
24 operating. We'll probably start it in the springtime.
25 Q Will it be done at the dosing site?
112ÿ
1 A Yes.
2 Q Okay. Anything else on that?
3 A The O2 and pH is along the gradient study.
4 You have hard copies of that.
5 Q Right.
6 A We've talked about that one. The periphyton
7 study, it's just -- let me look at that, make sure
8 here -- hold on a minute. Yeah, periphyton and slide
9 data. Oh, okay. For the dosing study it's just data
10 preparing for the periphyton part of the dosing study and
11 looking at the response of periphyton to various
12 concentrations of phosphorus.
13 Q Was this done at the dosing site?
14 A This will be done at the dosing site.
15 Q This will be done at the dosing site?
16 A Yes, it will be done at the dosing site.
17 Q With Dr. Vymazal?
18 A Well, I designed it. Jan looked at it and
19 made his recommendations.
20 Q Who will conduct this?
21 A I will. Jan will help until he leaves.
22 Q When is he expected to leave?
23 A I think it's this month.
24 Q Okay.
25 A I think by the end of this month.
113ÿ
1 Q He'll be returning to --
2 A Czechoslovakia.
3 Q Anything else on that?
4 A There's the utricularia study, which is just
5 notes to myself more than anything else and some
6 observations made, and it's not even a pending study,
7 just thinking about utricularia and phosphorus and
8 responses thereto.
9 Q Was that produced in hard copy?
10 A I don't think so, no. That one isn't, no.
11 Q How about the uptake test?
12 A The uptake test, I don't think that is in
13 hard copy either. That's just a test that we ran at the
14 end of last year to look at uptake rates of phosphorus,
15 really, not as a separate full-blown experiment but as
16 part of the dosing study to get a feel for how rapidly
17 the phosphorus will be taken up within our dosing
18 channels. Q Did you reach any conclusions in
19 that?
20 A Some very general conclusions, yeah. It
21 takes it up fast, and we're not sure how much it's going
22 to take to saturate the uptake.
23 Q The dosing study examines saturation?
24 A It kind of Jerry's end of it. Rather than
25 speak for him --
114ÿ
1 Q Yes.
2 A -- you might ask Jerry about that.
3 Q Okay.
4 A Whether he specifically intends on doing
5 that, that I don't know.
6 Q Okay. Anything else on that?
7 A No.
8 Q I think we have your slides, Dr. Rader.
9 A Okay.
10 MR. HYDE: Can we take a five-minute break?
11 MS. PONZOLI: Sure.
12 (Short recess.)
13 (Rader Exhibits 57, 58, 59, 60, 61, 62, 63,
14 64, 65, 66, 67, 68, 69, 70, and 71 were marked
15 for identification by the reporter, photocopies of
16 which are included herewith, and Rader Exhibit 72
17 was marked for identification by the reporter and
18 was retained by Counsel.)
19 MS. PONZOLI: Back on the record.
20 Q Dr. Rader we have asked you to arrange your
21 slides in some rational groupings, and you have done so
22 for us. We would like you to take the sheets -- and
23 there's a single box because we ran out of sheets -- and
24 identify for us on each sheet what basically those slides
25 reflect.
115ÿ
1 And if you're speaking of a single slide, I
2 would like you to use an identification method that would
3 call the first column 1, and the first slide would be A,
4 going B, C, D; second row, 2-A, -B, -C, -D, and so on
5 down the sheet. So when you speak of a specific slide,
6 then you would use that designation. We would -- beyond
7 the general descriptions of what the slides are intended
8 to depict, we are most particularly interested in those
9 slides that would reflect your sites of your research.
10 So with that basic instruction, I would just
11 ask you to please begin with Rader composite Exhibit
12 No. 57 and identify this sheet for us, and then we'll
13 just move through them.
14 A Okay. These are just various miscellaneous
15 slides, slides of people I work with, for example.
16 Q They just show --
17 A If you would like me to --
18 Q If you could, just tell us generally what
19 they're depicting.
20 A For example, slide 1-2 just is showing a
21 sieve that was used in the sampling process.
22 MR. HYDE: Did you mean 1-B?
23 THE WITNESS: Didn't I say 1-B?
24 MS. PONZOLI: Yes, 1-B.
25 THE WITNESS: Slide 1-B to slide 2-A, for
116ÿ
1 example, is just a picture of a typical
2 periphyton and nymphaea, components of a typical
3 slough, Everglades slough. Slide 1, 2, 3, 4 --
4 5-B is a picture of the periphyton, which one
5 might refer to them as "periphyton slides," for
6 example.
7 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: This is?
8 A This is more.
9 Q You have to begin with Rader composite
10 Exhibit 58.
11 A Right. This is Exhibit 58 and more
12 miscellaneous slides of colleagues; slides of sieves, for
13 example, used in the sampling process; a core sampler
14 used to take samples; slides from the air.
15 This is Exhibit 59, more miscellaneous
16 slides of the same sort, a few more slides of the
17 calcareous periphyton.
18 More -- Exhibit 60 is more miscellaneous
19 slides, people I work with, same types of thing.
20 And Exhibit 61 are more miscellaneous
21 slides. And then at the bottom, starting with 5-B, are
22 the slides of the fertilizer plot, fertilizer plots.
23 Q Were these taken before it was begun or at
24 its initial stages?
25 A About midway through it.
117ÿ
1 Q Okay.
2 A And those continue on to Exhibit 62, more
3 slides just from the air of the fertilizer plots. And
4 then starting with slide No. 4-A, we have slides taken of
5 inside the plots themselves, individual plots.
6 And Exhibit 63 just continues with more
7 slides inside the plots of the fertilizer study. That
8 finishes the slides used in the fertilizer study.
9 Now we'll come to Exhibit 64. And yep,
10 these are just talk/data slides used in talks as applied
11 to the data.
12 Q Are these similar to the hard copies you
13 have provided among the other documents --
14 A That's right.
15 Q -- we found today?
16 A Yes.
17 Q We would find duplication among these fairly
18 high?
19 A That you would.
20 Exhibit 65 is the same, more talk/data
21 slides.
22 Q To the best of your recollection, Dr. Rader,
23 are all these slides still accurate reflections of your
24 view of your work?
25 A Yeah. There are a few -- again, some of
118ÿ
1 these were made at a point when I was asked to summarize
2 my data before I was completely done analyzing it, having
3 each month accounted for. Therefore, there might be a
4 few conclusions that were derived early on based on that,
5 but the general overall conclusions of the study have
6 really not changed and are solid conclusions.
7 This is Exhibit 66, more talk/data slides.
8 And now we move to dosing study slides, and
9 that's Exhibit 67. And these are slides just shortly
10 after the channels were created, and they're just
11 pictures, preliminary shots of the sites themselves. And
12 we were experimenting a little bit with infrared
13 photography to see if that would help us get a better
14 view of the channels and document changes in the
15 macrophytes over time. That's all these are.
16 Q Okay.
17 A Exhibit 68 is the same thing, slides taken
18 at each one of the channels shortly after it was started.
19 Exhibit 69 is more of the same, and now
20 starting up with slides 1-A and 1-B, we have shifted
21 to -- or stopped using the infrared film and are now just
22 using plain color Ektachrome slides. That was
23 Exhibit 69.
24 Q Were you using real infrared or false?
25 A I'm not even sure what the difference might
119ÿ
1 be between real infrared or false.
2 Q Don't they come out -- doesn't the picture
3 come out in a different reflection? I don't know.
4 Do you know if it does?
5 DR. JONES: Real infrared is using infrared.
6 False infrared is -- what they do is expose all
7 the colors that are there except for the
8 infrared.
9 THE WITNESS: Oh, I'm not sure.
10 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: You don't know which of the
11 two you were using?
12 A No.
13 This is Exhibit 70 and are more shots using
14 a wide-angle lens of the channels, and they're just using
15 Ektachrome, and that's all that is really.
16 Q What went wrong with the infrared or false
17 infrared you were using?
18 A Nothing.
19 Q It just didn't do what you wanted?
20 A It just didn't add any more to it. I doubt
21 we'll go back to using it. We just hoped that it might
22 pick up color contrast better than regular film.
23 Exhibit 70 is just more shots of the dosing channels.
24 Q More recent? Are these more recent shots?
25 A Actually, yes.
120ÿ
1 Q Are these very recent?
2 A These, starting with Exhibit 70 up in 1-A
3 through to 3, 3-C, are, I believe, the most recent shots
4 of the dosing study.
5 Q How recent would they be?
6 A Of the channels, this summer, probably
7 somewhere around June or July.
8 Q Prior to the hurricane?
9 A Yes, true.
10 Q Okay. Did the hurricane disturb the
11 vegetation at the dosing study?
12 A Not really, no. There was very little
13 disturbance to it at all.
14 Q Okay. Just tore out your solar panel?
15 A Yeah, just because they were large broad,
16 way above the water.
17 Q Caught the wind or --
18 A Yeah, they caught the wind.
19 MR. HYDE: They're sails.
20 THE WITNESS: Just big sails up there. Knocked
21 them down.
22 Exhibit 71 --
23 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Right.
24 A -- are just aerial photographs of the dosing
25 study and the -- and the last -- let's see these two
121ÿ
1 slides here.
2 Q 5-A and -B?
3 A 5-A and -B are actually fertilizer plot
4 slides marked "Dosing Study" slides.
5 Q Are there any pictures of your sites,
6 Dr. Rader?
7 A Yes, beside the dosing study slides.
8 Q Those dosing study slides, do those include
9 the sites of your work?
10 A Which work?
11 Q Your invertebrate work.
12 A Oh, the gradient study slides?
13 Q Right.
14 A Those are probably -- I do have pictures of
15 them, and they're probably included in the miscellaneous
16 group.
17 Q Do you think we could go back and pick out
18 at least one that shows the site of your invertebrate
19 work?
20 A We can. We also have these (indicating).
21 Q All right. The last box, Dr. Rader, what
22 number is that?
23 A 72.
24 Q What is that?
25 A More dosing study slides and blanks that
122ÿ
1 just came out.
2 Q We would be interested in seeing the
3 invertebrate sites, if you could look through the
4 miscellaneous for us.
5 A Exhibits 57 through 61.
6 MR. HYDE: We ought to keep these together.
7 MS. PONZOLI: I'll probably have him indicate
8 which sites they are with a pen or something.
9 Perhaps we could put all of his sites in a row
10 since the rest of them are more or less random
11 anyway.
12 MR. HYDE: That's fine.
13 (Discussion off the record.)
14 THE WITNESS: I haven't looked at these slides
15 for a long time.
16 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Yes.
17 A Without having my slides which have the site
18 indicated in the corner, I'm not sure which one is which,
19 but I'm pretty sure that these slides are slides of the
20 sites (indicating).
21 Q Did your slides have actual writing on each
22 of them?
23 A Yes.
24 Q Well, that's a problem. Mine should have
25 had the writing reproduced on them. Do all of your
123ÿ
1 slides have writing on them --
2 A No.
3 Q -- virtually every slide that you have?
4 A No. I would say that -- I don't know what
5 percentage.
6 MS. PONZOLI: All right. I guess, then, what I
7 would ask, Mr. Hyde, is that, when he comes back
8 for his deposition, if you would bring his slides
9 so we could transfer the markings to mine. They
10 should have been reproduced the same. I don't
11 know if the slide people just didn't do it or
12 didn't understand.
13 MR. HYDE: No problem with that. We'll just
14 remember to do that. Okay.
15 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Then you would prefer not
16 to -- like, off the top of your head, can you give me
17 what you think they are, and we'll just confirm when you
18 come back with your actual slides because this in
19 particular is only seven slides. We could match those up
20 pretty easily when you return, if you would tell me
21 now -- let's put them in pockets so we'll know what we're
22 talking about.
23 MR. HYDE: He's referring to Exhibit 60.
24 THE WITNESS: It probably would just be easier to
25 match them up at the time we get them because I
124ÿ
1 haven't looked at them in a long time.
2 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: You don't know which is
3 enriched, which is unenriched by looking at them?
4 A This is from an enriched area here, which is
5 1-C.
6 Q Right.
7 A Let's see. I don't remember if that's C-5,
8 C-6, C-4, C-2. I don't remember --
9 Q All right.
10 A -- off the top of my head.
11 (Discussion off the record.)
12 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Oh, you need to indicate
13 which are your sites for the record.
14 MR. HYDE: 1-A through 2-C reflect your sites; is
15 that right?
16 THE WITNESS: Right, 1-A through 2-C, uh-huh.
17 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: Reflect your sites. And
18 you don't believe any of the other slides -- are those
19 the only slides you have, Dr. Rader?
20 A Yep.
21 Q Is there any particular reason you took so
22 few of your own experiment?
23 A Yeah. When we did this, we did it from a
24 helicopter. We had about 45 minutes per station, and in
25 addition to my collecting all my invertebrate data, I had
125ÿ
1 to collect, most of times that we went, oxygen, pH, water
2 depth at each site. So this is a short time with a lot
3 to do.
4 Q Yes.
5 A And space was a major problem, and trying to
6 carry a camera along is almost impossible. If you wanted
7 to lose a camera, I couldn't think of a better way than
8 to try to haul it up there. So it's just a matter of
9 time and convenience. We zip out and go do it.
10 Q Okay. So I believe -- have we gone over
11 every document that you recall having produced for this
12 Notice Duces Tecum? Does that pretty much cover it, to
13 the best of your recollection?
14 A I think that --
15 Q Covers it?
16 A I think that covers it.
17 Q One of the categories was, "All written
18 instructions from C.J. Richardson or any other supervisor
19 related to Everglades related research." I don't think
20 you've produced anything that I can recall today in that
21 category. You don't have any such documents?
22 A Relating to the research, no.
23 Q Well, do you have any such documents
24 relating to anything else from Dr. Richardson?
25 A Well, we've -- I think we communicated
126ÿ
1 privately, personal matters a few times, matters having
2 to do with personal things.
3 Q But not related to Everglades work?
4 A Not related to Everglades research work, no,
5 not specifically.
6 Q Are you distinguishing between Everglades
7 research and Everglades?
8 A I'm just distinguishing between matters that
9 relate to the research efforts that could be relevant to
10 these proceedings and personal matters --
11 Q Well --
12 A -- or our --
13 Q But how would you determine what's relevant
14 to these proceedings?
15 A Based on how personal, whether it's personal
16 material or not.
17 Q Well, can you give me an example of what is
18 a personal issue?
19 A Oh, I can. What? Like a hypothetical
20 example?
21 Q No. A specific example. I mean, is it a
22 promotion within the Duke Wetland Center or --
23 A Clarification of policy, for example. Might
24 be a --
25 Q I see what you mean. Related to your job
127ÿ
1 for Duke but not necessarily to your research?
2 A Right.
3 Q Anything else?
4 A Nope.
5 Q Have any documents been withheld as
6 privileged?
7 A No. Huh-uh, no.
8 Q Did you review these documents with
9 Mr. Burgess prior to producing them?
10 A Yeah. We sat down and discussed them.
11 Q Okay.
12 MR. HYDE: Just for the record, I was at that
13 same meeting with Mr. Burgess, and we did go
14 through the documents together. And I can
15 represent for the record that we didn't, to my
16 recollection, withhold anything as being
17 privileged or proprietary for Dr. Rader's
18 documents.
19 Q BY MS. PONZOLI: All right. Well,
20 Dr. Rader, as we said at the outset of the day, we will
21 continue your deposition during the two-week period in
22 December that the United States is entitled to take, and
23 I'll work that date out with your counsel --
24 A Okay.
25 Q -- you know, convenient to our schedule,
128ÿ
1 your schedule, and their schedule.
2 And then we will discuss substantively what
3 we have identified today with the documents. I thank you
4 for your patience and courtesy in going through and
5 putting it in order.
6 MR. HYDE: I presume you will have the deposition
7 transcribed?
8 MS. PONZOLI: I'm having it transcribed. What
9 we're going to do with the slides is that we're
10 just going to take Xerox-copy pictures of these
11 slides. I will retain my slides. If someone
12 wishes to line his slides the same way, they're
13 free to come to my office, or I'm happy to send
14 mine out to be duplicated.
15 MR. HYDE: I think there's been enough
16 duplication of slides, whatever.
17 MS. PONZOLI: All right.
18 MR. HYDE: Let me give you some advice here, Russ.
19 MS. PONZOLI: On the record?
20 MR. HYDE: Yes, this is just on the record.
21 You have the privilege of reading your
22 deposition transcript essentially for the purpose
23 of determining whether there have been any errors
24 in the transcription along the lines of clear
25 misstatements or grammatical or typographical
129ÿ
1 errors. It's not an opportunity to insert
2 substantive statements to the testimony. It is
3 my recommendation that you do read the
4 transcript.
5 An errata sheet will be provided with
6 that, and you would note on that errata sheet
7 where you think there may have been an error made
8 in the transcription. Okay?
9 THE WITNESS: Okay.
10 MS. PONZOLI: Okay. Thank you.
11 (Whereupon the deposition was adjourned at
12 3:41 p.m.)
13 * * * * *
14
15
16
17 ____________________________
18 Witness
19 SWORN TO AND SUBSCRIBED BEFORE ME THIS
20 ________ DAY OF ____________________, 1992.
21
22
23
24 _____________________________
Notary Public in and for
25 the State of Florida at Large
130ÿ
1 CERTIFICATE
STATE OF FLORIDA )
2 ) ss.
COUNTY OF BROWARD )
3
4 I, Pamela S. Wilson, a Shorthand Reporter and
5 Notary Public in and for the State of Florida at Large,
6 do hereby certify that I reported the deposition of
7 RUSSELL B. RADER, PH.D., a witness called by the
8 Respondent-Intervenor in the above-styled cause; that the
9 witness was duly sworn by me to tell the whole truth;
10 that the foregoing pages, numbered 1 to 131, inclusive,
11 constitute a true record of the deposition of said
12 witness as stenographically recorded by me; and that this
13 transcript was prepared under my supervision.
14 I further certify that I am not an attorney or
15 counsel of any of the parties, nor a relative or employee
16 of any attorney or counsel connected with the action, nor
17 financially interested in the action.
18 WITNESS my hand and official seal in the City of
19 Fort Lauderdale, County of Broward, State of Florida,
20 this 23rd day of November, 1992.
21
22
23 ________________________________
Pamela S. Wilson
24 Shorthand Reporter
Notary Public, State of Florida at Large
25 My Commission Expires: October 15, 1996
131ÿ