DIVISION OF ADMINISTRATIVE HEARINGS DEPARTMENT OF ADMINISTRATION, STATE OF FLORIDA SUGAR CANE GROWERS COOPERATIVE OF ) FLORIDA, a Florida Agricultural ) Cooperative Marketing Association, ) CASE NOS. 92-3038 ROTH FARMS, INC., and ) 92-3039 WEDGWORTH FARMS, INC., ) 92-3040 ) and ) ) FLORIDA SUGAR CANE LEAGUE, INC.; ) UNITED STATES SUGAR CORPORATION; ) ) and )________________________ ) FLORIDA FRUIT AND VEGETABLE ) DEPOSITION ASSOCIATION, LEWIS POPE FARMS, ) W.E. SCHLECHTER & SONS, INC., ) OF and HUNDLEY FARMS, INC., ) )DR. RICHARD T. Di GIULIO Petitioners, )________________________ ) vs. ) ) SOUTH FLORIDA WATER MANAGEMENT ) DISTRICT, an Agency of the State ) of Florida, ) ) Respondent, ) ) and ) ) MICCOSUKEE TRIBE OF INDIANS OF ) FLORIDA, the UNITED STATES OF ) AMERICA, and FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF ) ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION, The ) FLORIDA WILDLIFE FEDERATION, The ) FLORIDA AUDUBON SOCIETY, and The ) SIERRA CLUB, ) Intervenors. ) ___________________________________) AT DURHAM, NORTH CAROLINA APRIL 1, 1994 REPORTED BY: CAROLYN Y. HALL & ASSOCIATES DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 2 APPEARANCES: SUGARCANE GROWERS COOPERATIVE OF FLORIDA, ROTH FARMS, INC. AND WEDGWORTH FARMS, INC.: MR. GARY P. SAMS HOPPING, BOYD, GREEN & SAMS 123 SOUTH CALHOUN STREET TALLAHASSEE, FLORIDA 32314 TELEPHONE: (904) 222-7500 FOR RESPONDENT-INTERVENOR: MS. LISA B. HOGAN ASSISTANT U.S. ATTORNEY SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF FLORIDA 99 NORTHEAST 4TH STREET THIRD FLOOR MIAMI, FLORIDA 33132 TELEPHONE: (305) 536-5266 ALSO PRESENT: DR. RONALD JONES DR. ELIZABETH HENRY DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 3 T A B L E O F C O N T E N T S E X A M I N A T I O N I N D E X DEPONENT - DR. RICHARD T. Di GIULIO - 4/1/94 EXAMINATION: PAGES EXAMINATION BY MS. HOGAN 4-207 ------------------------------------------------------- E X H I B I T S I N D E X NUMBER DESCRIPTION MARKED (EXHIBITS NUMBER 1 - 19 WERE MARKED DURING THE TAKING OF THE DEPOSITION OF DR. RICHARD Di GIULIO, APRIL 1, 1994.) ------------------------------------------------------- SIGNATURE PAGE FOR DEPONENT 208 CERTIFICATION OF COURT REPORTER 209 DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 4 STIPULATIONS ON MOTION OF COUNSEL FOR THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF FLORIDA, THE DEPOSITION OF DR. RICHARD T. Di GIULIO MAY BE TAKEN BEGINNING AT OR AROUND 9:00 A.M. ON APRIL 1, 1994, AT THE HILTON HOTEL, 3800 HILLSBOROUGH ROAD, THE WALKER SUITE, DURHAM, NORTH CAROLINA, AND WAS REPORTED BY CAROLYN Y. HALL & ASSOCIATES. THE SIGNATURE OF THE WITNESS TO THE TRANSCRIPT OF HIS TESTIMONY IS HEREBY REQUIRED. - - - - - - - - - - - WHEREUPON, RICHARD T. Di GIULIO, Ph.D., HAVING FIRST BEEN DULY SWORN, WAS EXAMINED AND TESTIFIED AS FOLLOWS: EXAMINATION BY MS. HOGAN: Q. GOOD MORNING. A. GOOD MORNING. Q. MY NAME IS LISA HOGAN, AND I REPRESENT THE UNITED STATES IN THESE PROCEEDINGS. I'M GOING TO ASK YOU A SERIES OF QUESTIONS IN ORDER TO ASCERTAIN WHAT YOUR OPINIONS AND TESTIMONY WILL BE AT TRIAL. A. OKAY. Q. I'LL ASK YOU A SERIES OF QUESTIONS. IF YOU DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 5 DON'T UNDERSTAND MY QUESTION, LET ME KNOW. IF YOU ANSWER, THEN I'LL ASSUME THAT YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT I'VE ASKED OF YOU. A. OKAY. Q. OKAY? CAN YOU STATE YOUR FULL NAME FOR THE RECORD? A. RICHARD THOMAS Di GIULIO. Q. OKAY. AND CAN YOU GIVE US YOUR PRESENT PLACE OF EMPLOYMENT AND YOUR BUSINESS ADDRESS? A. I'M CURRENTLY ASSOCIATE PROFESSOR IN THE SCHOOL OF THE ENVIRONMENT AT DUKE UNIVERSITY IN DURHAM. WHAT WAS THE OTHER? Q. THE ADDRESS. A. THE ADDRESS. SCHOOL OF THE ENVIRONMENT, DUKE UNIVERSITY, DURHAM, NORTH CAROLINA, 27708-0328. Q. OKAY. HOW LONG HAVE YOU BEEN EMPLOYED AS AN ASSOCIATE PROFESSOR? A. ABOUT ELEVEN AND A HALF YEARS. Q. OKAY. AND WHAT ARE YOUR DUTIES? A. TO TEACH IN THE AREA OF ENVIRONMENTAL TOXICOLOGY; TO DIRECT THE ENVIRONMENTAL TOXICOLOGY CHEMISTRY AND RISK ASSESSMENT PROGRAM IN THE SCHOOL OF THE ENVIRONMENT; AND TO PERFORM RESEARCH RELATED TO FATE AND EFFECTS OF POLLUTANTS IN ECOSYSTEMS. Q. OKAY. HOW WOULD YOU DESCRIBE YOUR AREA OF DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 6 EXPERTISE AT PRESENT? A. MY AREA OF EXPERTISE IS BROADLY IN THE AREA OF POLLUTANT FATE AND EFFECTS, PARTICULARLY IN AQUATIC SYSTEMS. I HAVE BROAD INTERESTS IN TRACE METALS AS WELL AS ORGANIC POLLUTANTS, ISSUES OF BIOACCUMULATION, METABOLISM MECHANISMS OF TOXICITY, AGAIN, IN AQUATIC ORGANISMS. Q. OKAY. YOU SAID YOU HAVE BROAD INTEREST IN THE FATE OF TRACE METALS? A. YES. Q. WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? A. FACTORS AFFECTING FATE. IN OTHER WORDS, WHAT COMPONENTS OF AN ECOSYSTEM POLLUTANTS END UP IN, WHICH WILL THEN INFLUENCE COMPONENTS OF AN ECOSYSTEM, SAY, AT RISK. Q. OKAY. HAVE YOU EVER TESTIFIED AT TRIAL BEFORE? A. NO. Q. HAVE YOU EVER BEEN DEPOSED BEFORE? A. NO. Q. OKAY. YOU WERE SERVED WITH A NOTICE OF TAKING DEPOSITION DUCES TECUM IN CONNECTION WITH YOUR DEPOSITION TODAY. A. OKAY. Q. I'M GOING TO HAND YOU THIS DOCUMENT AND ASK--- DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 7 A. OKAY. Q. ---IF THAT WAS YOUR NOTICE, IF YOU RECEIVED IT. A. YEAH, I BELIEVE SO. Q. ALL RIGHT. MS. HOGAN: WE'RE GOING TO MARK THAT AS THE FIRST EXHIBIT TO YOUR DEPOSITION. (THEREUPON, THE DOCUMENT REFERRED TO BELOW WAS MARKED AS DEFENDANT'S EXHIBIT NUMBER 1 - DR. Di GIULIO DEPOSITION - FOR IDENTIFICATION.) Q. (BY MS. HOGAN) DID YOU REVIEW THIS NOTICE OF TAKING DEPOSITION WHEN YOU RECEIVED IT? A. YES. Q. OKAY. THEN YOU'LL RECALL THAT ATTACHED TO IT ON PAGE 6 IS A LIST OF DOCUMENTS TO BE PRODUCED--- A. UH-HUH (YES). Q. ---IN CONNECTION WITH YOUR DEPOSITION TODAY. A. RIGHT. Q. I'D LIKE YOU TO GO THROUGH THE LIST. AND PLEASE READ EACH ONE OF THE--- A. OKAY. A COPY--- Q. ---THE SECTIONS TO YOURSELF. A. OH, I'M SORRY. Q. AND TELL ME WHETHER YOU PRODUCED IT OR NOT. DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 8 HAVE YOU PRODUCED THE ITEMS LISTED IN NUMBER 1? A. YES. Q. HAVE YOU PRODUCED ALL OF THE ITEMS LISTED IN NUMBER 2? A. YES. Q. HAVE YOU PRODUCED ALL OF THE ITEMS LISTED IN NUMBER 3? A. YES. Q. HAVE YOU PRODUCED ALL OF THE ITEMS LISTED IN NUMBER 4? A. YES. Q. HAVE YOU PRODUCED ALL OF THE ITEMS LISTED IN NUMBER 5? A. YES. Q. HAVE YOU PRODUCED ALL OF THE ITEMS LISTED IN NUMBER 6? A. YES. Q. HAVE YOU PRODUCED ALL THE ITEMS THAT ARE LISTED IN NUMBER 7? A. YES. Q. HAVE YOU PRODUCED ALL THE ITEMS LISTED IN NUMBER 8? A. YES. Q. HAVE YOU PRODUCED ALL THE ITEMS LISTED IN NUMBER 9? DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 9 A. YES. Q. HAVE YOU PRODUCED ALL THE ITEMS LISTED IN NUMBER 10? A. YES. Q. NUMBER 11? A. YES. Q. THOSE LISTED IN NUMBER 12? A. YES. Q. 13? A. YES. (THEREUPON, WITNESS REVIEWS DOCUMENT.) A. YES. Q. THOSE LISTED IN ITEM 14? A. YES. Q. DID YOU REVIEW ALL THE ITEMS BEFORE THEY WERE PRODUCED? DID YOU GO THROUGH YOUR FILES AND PULL THE DOCUMENT? MR. SAMS: LET ME, IF I MAY, INSERT. ACTUALLY, WHAT WE DID WAS, THE WITNESS GAVE US A LIST OF DOCUMENTS HE HAD IN HIS FILES, AND WE PULLED THE COPIES FROM OUR FILES BECAUSE HE DIDN'T HAVE THE TIME AT THE POINT THAT WAS BEING DONE TO ACTUALLY HAVE THE COPIES MADE. SO, HE ACTUALLY TOLD US WHAT HE HAD. WITNESS: I PROVIDED THEM. MR. SAMS: AND WE PRESENTED THAT -- THOSE DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 10 DOCUMENTS FROM OUR FILES. MS. HOGAN: SO YOU HAD A COPY OF ALL THE DOCUMENTS THAT HE POSSESSED THAT WOULD BE RESPONSIVE TO THIS REQUEST? MR. SAMS: VIRTUALLY ALL. WE, SUBSEQUENTLY, THIS WEEK DISCUSSED WITH HIM A COUPLE OR THREE OTHER ITEMS, INCLUDING SOME DOCUMENTS ON WHICH HE HAD MADE NOTES OF FUNDING -- UNFUNDED PROPOSAL FOR WORK AND AN ARTICLE THAT WAS EIGHT OR NINE YEARS OLD. AND WE ACQUIRED COPIES OF THOSE FROM HIM, INCLUDING THE COPIES OF DOCUMENTS WITH HIS HANDWRITTEN NOTES AND FURNISHED THOSE TO YOU A COUPLE DAYS AGO. MS. HOGAN: ALL RIGHT. Q. (BY MS. HOGAN) WHAT NUMBER ARE WE ON? A. 15, I THINK. Q. ALL RIGHT. HAVE YOU PRODUCED ALL THE ITEMS RESPONSIVE TO ITEM 15? A. YES. Q. HAVE YOU PRODUCED ALL THE ITEMS RESPONSIVE TO ITEM 16? A. YES. Q. THOSE RESPONSIVE TO 17? A. YES. Q. TO 18? DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 11 A. YES. Q. TO 19? A. YES. Q. TO 20? A. YES. Q. IS IT YOUR UNDERSTANDING THAT OF THE LIST THAT YOU GAVE COUNSEL, ALL THE DOCUMENTS THAT YOU GAVE TO COUNSEL WERE PRODUCED? A. YES. Q. AND HOW DO YOU KNOW THAT? A. WELL, THEY -- THEY ASKED ME FOR A LIST OF ALL THE MATERIALS I HAD READ IN FORMULATING MY OPINIONS AND IN COMMENTING ON THE PTR REPORT AND SO FORTH, AND DELIVERED THAT TO THEIR OFFICE. AND I GUESS -- I ASSUME THAT THEY DID DELIVER THOSE TO YOU. Q. OKAY. DID YOU REVIEW THAT LIST YOURSELF? A. I COMPOSED THAT LIST. Q. THE LIST THAT YOU'RE READING, I MEAN, EXHIBIT ONE. A. DID I HAVE--- Q. UH-HUH (YES). A. YES. Q. DID YOU SEE THAT? A. YES. Q. YOU REVIEWED THAT? DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 12 A. RIGHT. Q. OKAY. A. I GOT THIS DIRECTLY. Q. OKAY. ARE WE ON ITEM 20? A. 21, I THINK. Q. ALL RIGHT. HAVE YOU PRODUCED ALL THE ITEMS LISTED IN ITEM 21? A. YES. Q. AND THOSE LISTED IN 22? A. YES. Q. THE ITEMS LISTED IN 23? A. YES. Q. THE ITEMS LISTED IN 24? A. YES. Q. THOSE IN 25? A. YES. Q. THOSE IN 26? A. YES. Q. THE ITEMS LISTED IN 27? A. YES. Q. 28? A. YES. Q. THOSE LISTED IN 29? A. YES. Q. THE ITEMS THAT ARE LISTED IN NUMBER 30? DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 13 A. YES. Q. THOSE LISTED IN 31? A. YES. Q. AS WELL AS THOSE IN 32? A. YES. Q. ALL DOCUMENTS LISTED IN 33? A. YES. Q. IN 34? A. YES. Q. 35? A. YES. Q. 36? A. YES. Q. 37? A. YES. Q. 38? A. YES. Q. AND 39? A. YES. Q. YOU UNDERSTAND THAT YOU'VE BEEN DESIGNATED AS AN EXPERT WITNESS IN THESE PROCEEDINGS? A. YES. Q. OKAY. AND ARE YOU FAMILIAR WITH WHAT AREAS AND ISSUES YOU'LL BE RENDERING OPINIONS ON? A. YES. DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 14 Q. OKAY. WHAT ARE THOSE AREAS? A. THOSE AREAS ARE ISSUES CONCERNING MERCURY BIOACCUMULATION, SPECIFICALLY, POTENTIAL INTERACTIONS BETWEEN NUTRIENTS AND MERCURY BIOACCUMULATION; RELATIONSHIPS BETWEEN NUTRIENTS AND MERCURY METHYLATION. Q. ANY OTHER AREAS? A. I GUESS, SPECIFICALLY, POTENTIAL RELATIONSHIPS BETWEEN PROPOSED STORMWATER TREATMENT AREAS AND MERCURY DYNAMICS. Q. WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY MERCURY DYNAMICS? A. TRANSPORT AND FATE OF MERCURY IN THE AQUATIC WETLAND ECOSYSTEMS. Q. ANY OTHER AREAS? A. THAT'S -- I THINK THAT COVERS IT. Q. OKAY. COUNSEL FOR THE CO-OP HAS PROVIDED US WITH A SUPPLEMENTAL DESIGNATION OF EXPERT-IN-FACT WITNESSES, AND YOU ARE LISTED AS A SUPPLEMENTAL EXPERT WITNESS. AND ACCORDING TO THE DESIGNATION THE SUBJECT MATTER OF YOUR EXPECTED TESTIMONY WILL BE AQUATIC TOXOLOGY, FATE AND TRANSPORT OF CONTAMINANTS IN THE ENVIRONMENT; IS THAT YOUR UNDERSTANDING? A. YES. Q. THE SUBSTANCE OF THE FACTS AND OPINIONS WILL BE THE INTERPRETATION OF RESULTS OF MERCURY AND RELATED DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 15 SAMPLING WITHIN THE EAA AND EPA AND POTENTIAL EFFECTS OF THE PROPOSED SWIM PLAN ON MERCURY CONTAMINATION IN THE PROPOSED STA'S IN THE EPA. IS THAT YOUR UNDERSTANDING, AS WELL? A. YES. Q. ARE THERE ANY ADDITIONAL AREAS WHICH YOU'LL BE TESTIFYING TO--- A. NO. Q. ---THAT YOU'RE AWARE OF? A. NO. Q. OKAY. HAND YOU A COPY OF THAT AND ASK IF YOU'VE RECEIVED THAT, AS WELL. A. YES. Q. OKAY. MS. HOGAN: WE'LL MARK THAT AS THE NEXT EXHIBIT TO YOUR DEPOSITION. (THEREUPON, THE DOCUMENT REFERRED TO BELOW WAS MARKED AS DEFENDANT'S EXHIBIT NUMBER 2 - DR. Di GIULIO DEPOSITION - FOR IDENTIFICATION.) Q. (BY MS. HOGAN) CAN YOU SUMMARIZE FOR US THE SUBSTANCE OF YOUR OPINIONS AS TO THE CONSTRUCTION OF THE STA'S AND THEIR EFFECT ON METHYLMERCURY PRODUCTION? A. INSOMUCH AS MY UNDERSTANDING THAT THE STA'S ARE LIKELY TO ENHANCE ACCUMULATION OF ORGANIC MATERIAL DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 16 AND NUTRIENTS AND ENHANCE REDUCING CONDITIONS AND ANAEROBIC CONDITIONS THAT THERE IS THE POSSIBILITY THAT METHYLATION COULD BE INCREASED IN THOSE STA'S. Q. OKAY. AND WHY IS THAT? A. BECAUSE PREVIOUS STUDIES TEND TO INDICATE IT'S -- PREVIOUS STUDIES INDICATE THAT CONDITIONS FAVORING EUTROPHICATION, FAVORING INCREASED INPUTS OF BIOAVAILABLE NUTRIENTS, ORGANIC CARBON AND -- WHICH TEND ALSO TO ENHANCE THE LIKELIHOOD OF ANAEROBIC CONDITIONS -- SEEM TO STIMULATE ACTIVITY OF MICROBIAL POPULATIONS THAT ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR THE METHYLATION OF MERCURY. Q. WHAT NUTRIENTS DO YOU ANTICIPATE BEING ADDED TO THE STA'S? A. PHOSPHORUS, SULFATE, VARIOUS IONS, MAGNESIUM, CALCIUM, CARBONATE, NITROGEN. Q. OKAY. CAN YOU SUMMARIZE THE SUBSTANCE OF YOUR OPINIONS AS TO THE CONSTRUCTION OF STA'S AND THEIR EFFECT ON METHYLMERCURY BIOACCUMULATION? A. MY SENSE IS THAT THOSE SAME CONDITIONS AT -- ASSOCIATED WITH EUTROPHICATION WILL TEND TO REDUCE BIOACCUMULATION IN FISH AND OTHER AQUATIC ORGANISMS. Q. THAT THEY'LL REDUCE BIOACCUMULATION? A. YES. Q. AND WHY IS THAT? DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 17 A. BECAUSE -- WELL, AGAIN, A LOT OF IT'S JUST BASED ON WORLDWIDE STUDIES THAT SHOW A STRONG INVERSE CONNECTION BETWEEN TROPHIC STATUS AND MERCURY ACCUMULATIONS IN BIOTA. THAT IS THAT -- EVERYTHING'S BEING EQUAL IN TERMS OF MERCURY INPUTS AND SO FORTH -- THAT OLIGOTROPHIC SYSTEMS INVARIABLY SHOW HIGHER CONCENTRATIONS OF MERCURY IN AQUATIC ORGANISMS RELATIVE TO EUTROPHIC SYSTEMS. Q. OKAY. CAN YOU SUMMARIZE THE SUBSTANCE OF YOUR OPINIONS AS TO PHOSPHORUS' -- THE EFFECT OF PHOSPHORUS ON METHYLMERCURY PRODUCTION? A. WELL, I DON'T -- I DON'T -- THE EFFECT OF PHOSPHORUS ON METHYLMERCURY PRODUCTION? Q. UH-HUH (YES). A. I TEND TO THINK THAT -- THAT PHOSPHORUS WOULD TEND TO STIMULATE METHYLMERCURY PRODUCTION AGAIN IN -- BY -- AS A LIMITING NUTRIENT AFFECTING MICROBIAL ACTIVITY. Q. OKAY. WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN NUTRIENT INPUT TO THE STA'S AND THE CONSERVATION AREAS AS RELATED TO MERCURY? A. WOULD -- WOULD YOU REPEAT THAT? Q. UH-HUH (YES). WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN NUTRIENT INPUT TO THE STA'S AND THE CONSERVATION AREAS AS IT RELATES TO MERCURY? DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 18 A. WHAT IS THE DIFFERENT--- MR. SAMS: I'LL OBJECT TO THE FORM OF THE QUESTION. DO YOU MEAN NUTRIENT INPUT TO THE STA'S VERSUS NUTRIENT INPUT TO THE WATER CONSERVATION AREAS? MS. HOGAN: UH-HUH (YES). INPUT TO THE WATER CONSERVATION AREAS AND THE EFFECT THAT IT WOULD HAVE ON MERCURY. A. WHAT DO I THINK WOULD BE THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN NUTRIENT INPUTS INTO THE STA'S VERSUS THE WATER CONSERVATION AREAS--- Q. UH-HUH (YES). A. ---AFTER THAT WATER'S GONE THROUGH THE STA'S? IS THAT THE POINT? ARE YOU ASKING WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE? AS I UNDERSTAND IT, THE WATER -- WATER WOULD GO THROUGH THE STA'S AFTER THEIR CONSTRUCTION AND THEN ENTER THE WCA'S. IS THAT CORRECT? Q. OKAY. UH-HUH (YES). A. IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE ASKING? Q. YEAH, I'LL ASK THAT, AS WELL, OKAY? A. WELL, WITH -- WITH MY MODEL WITH MY UNDERSTANDING THAT THE STA'S WOULD BASICALLY BE BUILT, SAY, UPSTREAM, IF YOU WILL--- Q. UH-HUH (YES). A. ---OF THE WCA'S, NUTRIENTS ENTERING THE WCA'S DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 19 AFTER GOING THROUGH THE STA'S WOULD BE LOWER THAN THAT ENTERING THE STA'S. Q. OKAY. WHAT IS YOUR OPINION AS TO THE EFFECT OF NUTRIENT INPUT INTO THE WATER CONSERVATION AREAS? MR. SAMS: OBJECT TO THE FORM OF THE QUESTION. WITNESS: I'M SORRY. WOULD YOU REPEAT THAT AGAIN? MS. HOGAN: YES. Q. (BY MS. HOGAN) WHAT IS YOUR OPINION AS TO THE EFFECT OF NUTRIENT INPUT INTO THE WATER CONSERVATION AREAS ON MERCURY? A. ON MERCURY? Q. UH-HUH (YES). MR. SAMS: OBJECT AGAIN TO FORM. A. SEE, LET ME GET THIS RIGHT. WHAT -- WHAT IS MY OPINION OF THE EFFECT OF NUTRIENTS ON MERCURY IN THE--- Q. WATER CONSERVATION AREAS. A. ---IN THE W--- Q. YOU GAVE ME A--- A. I MEAN IT -- IT'S, YOU KNOW -- AGAIN, I -- I THINK TO -- TO MAKE ANY SENSE OF THAT YOU HAVE TO COMPARE RELATIVE AMOUNTS OF NUTRIENT INPUTS. MY FEELING IS THAT, IF THOSE NUTRIENT INPUTS ARE VERY LOW, DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 20 LOW ENOUGH TO PUSH A SYSTEM TO BECOME MORE OLIGOTROPHIC, THAT ISOLATED EFFECT WILL ENHANCE MERCURY BIOACCUMULATION IN FISH AND OTHER AQUATIC ANIMALS. Q. ALL RIGHT. DO YOU EXPECT ACCUMULATION OF NUTRIENTS IN THE STA'S TO BE DIFFERENT FROM THE EFFECTS IN THE WATER CONSERVATION AREAS? A. DO I -- SAY THAT AGAIN; SAY THAT AGAIN. Q. ALL RIGHT. DO YOU EXPECT THE ACCUMULATION OF NUTRIENTS IN THE STA'S--- A. ACCUMULATION OF NUTRIENTS. Q. UH-HUH (YES). WITHIN THE STA'S, ALL RIGHT, DO YOU EXPECT THAT ACCUMULATION TO BE DIFFERENT THAN THE EFFECTS OF THOSE NUTRIENTS IN THE WATER CONSERVATION AREAS? A. I DON'T KNOW. IT SEEMS LIKE THAT'S MIXING. I WANT TO MAKE SURE I HAVE THIS ABSOLUTELY CLEAR. SAY IT -- SAY IT AGAIN. Q. OKAY. DO YOU EXPECT THE ACCUMULATION OF NUTRIENTS--- A. ACCUMULATION OF NUTRIENTS, OKAY. Q. ---WITHIN THE STA'S--- A. OKAY. Q. ---TO HAVE DIFFERENT EFFECTS THAN THEY WOULD HAVE IN THE WATER CONSERVATION AREAS? A. I -- I'M TRYING TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO -- I -- I DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 21 GUESS -- I'M ASSUMING THAT THERE'S GOING TO BE QUITE A DIFFERENCE IN THE ACCUMULATION OF THE NUTRIENTS, AND THAT WILL CERTAINLY HAVE AN EFFECT. NOW, A GIVEN INPUT OF NUTRIENTS INTO ONE OR THE OTHER WILL HAVE A SIMILAR EFFECT. BUT THAT'S WHAT I -- I MEAN, IN OTHER WORDS, I -- MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT THERE WOULD BE A DIFFERENT PATTERN OF ACCUMULATION. AND THAT'S THE IMPORTANT THING AFFECTING MERCURY, NOT THAT A NUTRIENT -- JUST, YOU KNOW, THAT -- THAT -- THERE'S SOME INHERENT DIFFERENCE IN THAT, IF YOU PUT NUTRIENTS HERE VERSUS NUTRIENTS HERE, THERE'S A BIG DIFFERENCE, NO. Q. WHY IS THERE A DIFFERENT PATTERN? A. WELL, AGAIN, I'M ASSUMING THAT THE STA'S ARE GOING TO SERVE THEIR -- WHAT I UNDERSTAND TO BE THEIR DESIGN FUNCTION IN TRAPPING NUTRIENTS, MAINTAINING NUTRIENTS LARGELY WITHIN THE STA'S AND, THEREFORE, REDUCING OUTPUTS OF NUTRIENTS INTO THE DOWNSTREAM WCA'S. Q. WHAT IF YOU ASSUME THAT THERE ARE NO STA'S? A. IF THERE WERE NO STA'S, WELL, THEN THERE -- THEN -- THEN THERE'D BE MORE NUTRIENTS ENTERING THE WCA'S THAN WOULD OCCUR WITH THE STA'S. Q. ALL RIGHT. A. AND THAT WOULD, IN -- IN ESSENCE, RENDER THOSE WCA'S RELATIVELY MORE EUTROPHIC AND, THEREFORE, DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 22 RELATIVELY -- AND, THEREFORE, DRIVE RELATIVELY LESS BIOACCUMULATION IN FISH AND AQUATIC ANIMALS OF MERCURY. Q. OKAY. ARE YOU FAMILIAR WITH THE TERM "RESERVOIR EFFECT"? A. YES. Q. OKAY. WHAT IS YOUR -- CAN YOU -- EXCUSE ME. CAN YOU SUMMARIZE THE SUBSTANCE OF YOUR OPINION AS TO THE RESERVOIR EFFECT IN NORTHERN AREAS? A. IN NORTHERN AREAS? Q. UH-HUH (YES). WHAT IS THE CAUSE OF THE RESERVOIR EFFECT, IN YOUR OPINION? A. I DON'T THINK IT'S ENTIRELY KNOWN, BUT MY SENSE IS THAT, WHEN YOU TAKE A TERRESTRIAL AREA THAT JUST HAS -- WITH NO -- NO POINT SOURCES OR, YOU KNOW, MAJOR IMPACTING SOURCES OF MERCURY -- IN OTHER WORDS, JUST REFLECTING ATMOSPHERIC DEPOSITION, NATURAL SOIL ACCUMULATIONS AND SO FORTH -- AND THEN FLOOD THAT SYSTEM, THAT YOU WOULD EXPECT THAT YOU WOULD HIGHLY STIMULATE CONDITIONS FOR MERCURY METHYLATION AND SO FORTH, AGAIN, BY A BIG IMPACT -- A BIG INPUT OF NUTRIENTS AND ORGANIC MATTER, DECAYING VEGETATION AND SO FORTH. THAT WOULD THEN STIMULATE MICROBIAL ACTIVITY. Q. OKAY. WHAT IS YOUR OPINION AS TO HOW THE RESERVOIR EFFECT WOULD RELATE TO THE STA'S? DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 23 A. I DON'T HAVE A REAL CLEAR PICTURE IN MY MIND OF WHAT THE STA'S LOOK LIKE AT PRESENT. BUT ASSUMING THAT ESSENTIALLY THEY'RE TERRESTRIAL SYSTEMS THAT HAVE BEEN UNFLOODED AND ARE NOW FLOODED, THAT A RESERVOIR EFFECT COULD WELL OCCUR. Q. OKAY. I'M GOING TO HAND YOU ANOTHER DOCUMENT AND ASK IF YOU CAN IDENTIFY IT FOR THE RECORD. A. THIS IS MY CURRICULUM VITAE, DATED JANUARY 1994. MS. HOGAN: WE'LL MARK THAT AS THE NEXT EXHIBIT TO YOUR DEPOSITION. (THEREUPON, THE DOCUMENT REFERRED TO BELOW WAS MARKED AS DEFENDANT'S EXHIBIT NUMBER 3 - DR. Di GIULIO DEPOSITION - FOR IDENTIFICATION.) Q. (BY MS. HOGAN) HAVE YOU HAD ANY INVOLVEMENT IN THE SCIENTIFIC ANALYSIS OF MERCURY AND MERCURY COMPOUNDS? A. YES. I HAD A STUDY IN AROUND '83, '84, IN THERE, TO INVESTIGATE MERCURY CONCENTRATIONS IN PEAT AND PEATLANDS OF EASTERN NORTH CAROLINA AND ACCUMULATIONS IN CANAL SEDIMENTS, DRAINING THOSE PEATLANDS, AND IN THE ESTUARINE BIVALVE RANGIA CUNEATA AS SORT OF A BIOMONITOR OF MERCURY IN THOSE SYSTEMS. Q. AND WHAT DID THAT STUDY ENTAIL? DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 24 A. WELL, THE STUDY WAS MOTIVATED BY CONCERNS THAT CONVERSION -- WELL, A PROPOSED PEAT TO METHANOL FACILITY WAS GOING TO ENHANCE OR DRIVE THE SUCCESSIVE REMOVAL OF LAYERS OF PEAT FROM A BROAD AREA IN EASTERN NORTH CAROLINA REFERRED TO AS WHITETAIL FARMS. AND THEN THAT WOULD EXPOSE EXCESSIVE LAYERS OF PEAT TO OXIDIZING CONDITIONS THAT WOULD THEN POTENTIALLY ENHANCE MOVEMENT OF MERCURY OUT OF THOSE PEAT AND INTO RECEIVING AQUATIC SYSTEMS. AND SO, ANYWAY, THAT -- THAT'S -- THAT WAS THE RATIONALE FOR FUNDING THAT STUDY. Q. AND WHAT DID YOUR STUDY FIND? A. WELL, IN ESSENCE, THE STUDY FOUND THAT THE CONCENTRATIONS OF MERCURY IN THOSE NORTH CAROLINA PEATLANDS WAS VERY LOW, ABOUT AS LOW AS WE COULD FIND AMONG PEATLAND SYSTEMS. AND THAT IN CURRENT CANALS DRAINING THOSE SYSTEMS CONCENTRATIONS OF MERCURY IN CANAL SEDIMENTS -- CANAL SEDIMENTS AND IN THE BIVALVES WERE VERY LOW. AND ALSO RELATED TO THAT STUDY A CHEMIST AT -- THEN, AT THE DUKE MARINE LAB, A CO-PI ON THAT PROJECT, WAS STUDYING WATER CONCENTRATIONS AND SIMILARLY FOUND VERY LOW CONCENTRATIONS THAT WERE CONSISTENT WITH REPORTS AVAILABLE AT THAT TIME OF ESSENTIALLY PRISTINE SYSTEMS. IN ESSENCE, THERE WAS -- THERE WAS NO PARTICULAR DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 25 SUPPORT FOR THE HYPOTHESIS THAT THOSE PEATLANDS WERE GENERATING ELEVATED MERCURY IN THE DOWN -- IN THE RECEIVING AQUATIC SYSTEMS. Q. ALL RIGHT. A. BUT IT COULD HAVE BEEN -- YOU KNOW, IT WAS -- IT WAS JUST A VERY -- THERE WAS VERY LITTLE MERCURY IN THAT ENTIRE SYSTEM. Q. OKAY. WHEN YOU SAY THAT THE MERCURY CONCENTRATION LEVELS WERE LOW, WHAT DO YOU MEAN QUANTITATIVELY? A. WELL, AS I RECALL, THE MERCURY IN THAT PEAT WAS -- WAS -- I'D HAVE TO LOOK AT THAT PAPER. THAT'S -- THAT WAS PROPOSED IN '84. BUT IT WAS ABOUT .1 PARTS PER BILLION. THE -- IN THE -- IN THE CANALS IT WAS ABOUT .0 -- I WANT TO THINK ABOUT .02, AS, LIKE, ABOUT A TENTH OR LESS OF THAT. THE CONCENTRATIONS IN THE BIVALVES, I BELIEVE, WERE, AT THE VERY TOP, ABOUT TWENTY-FIVE OR THIRTY PARTS PER BILLION. WE COULDN'T DETECT METHYLMERCURY, BUT OUR TECHNIQUES WERE REAL LIMITED. OUR DETECTION LEVEL WAS ABOUT TWENTY-FIVE PPB'S IN THE -- IN THE BIVALVES. SO THAT -- IT WASN'T SURPRISING IF TOTAL MERCURY WAS ON THAT SAME ORDER, THAT WE COULDN'T DETECT IT, YOU KNOW. Q. OKAY. WHO FUNDED YOUR STUDY? A. THE UNIVERSITY OF NORTH CAROLINA WATER DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 26 RESOURCE RESEARCH INSTITUTE. Q. OKAY. AND HOW LONG DID YOUR STUDY TAKE TO COMPLETE? A. IT WAS -- IT WAS FUNDED FOR ONE YEAR. I THINK THE ENTIRE STUDY WAS, LIKE -- IT TOOK US ABOUT EIGHTEEN MONTHS. Q. AND WHAT METHODOLOGY DID YOU USE WITH YOUR STUDY? A. WE USED CLASSIC COLD VAPOR TECHNIQUES TO MEASURE TOTAL MERCURY IN THE PEAT SEDIMENT AND CLAM. AS I RECALL, WE USED A ORGANIC SOLVENT EXTRACTION FOR ESTIMATING METHYLMERCURY. AND THEN THAT WAS STILL RUN ON -- THAT WAS ALL DONE BY ATOMIC ABSORPTION SPECTROSCOPY. Q. OKAY. WHAT WAS THE TOTAL COST OF THE STUDY? A. TWENTY-FIVE THOUSAND DOLLARS ($25,000.00). Q. OKAY. DID YOU COLLECT THE SAMPLES YOURSELF? A. I HELPED -- IT COMPOSED THE -- COMPRISED THE MASTER'S THESIS OF A STUDENT WHO DID THE BULK OF THE SAMPLING. BUT THE TWO PI'S, MYSELF AND DAVID EVANS ALONG WITH THE STUDENT ALSO DID APPRECIABLE FIELDWORK IN COLLECTING SAMPLES. Q. OKAY. AND WHAT WAS DONE WITH THE RESULTS OF YOUR STUDY? A. THEY WERE PUBLISHED. THERE WAS A REPORT GIVEN DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 27 TO THE UNC WRRI IN THE PARK THAT MY STUDENT AND I DID -- PUBLISHED THAT COMPONENT IN WATER AND AIR AND SOIL POLLUTION. AND DAVID EVANS, WHO DID THE WATER ANALYSES, I DON'T BELIEVE, EVER GOT AROUND TO PUBLISHING HIS PART IN THE OPEN LITERATURE. Q. YOU SAID THE RATIONALE BEHIND THE STUDY WAS TO DETERMINE WHETHER THE MOVEMENT OF THE SEDIMENT WOULD INCREASE THE MERCURY WITHIN THE SYSTEM? A. WELL, THE REPORT WAS STIMULATED BY SOME REPORTS OF HIGH CONCENTRATIONS OF MERCURY IN CANAL WATERS. AND, SO, THAT GENERATED A LOT OF CONCERN FOR THE FISHERIES IN THE PAMLICO-ALBEMARLE AREA OF NORTH CAROLINA. Q. UH-HUH (YES). A. THE HYPOTHESIS ESSENTIALLY WAS THAT THE HARVESTING OF THOSE PEAT WOULD EXPOSE THE UNDERLYING LAYER. LET'S SAY, WHEN THEY WERE GOING TO DO THIS PEAT TO METHANOL THING, THE IDEA WAS THEY'D GO IN AND, A FEW INCHES AT A TIME, SCRAPE OFF THE SURFACE LAYER OF PEAT; TAKE THAT TO A PLANT FOR CONVERSION TO METHANOL. AND, AS YOU DID THAT, OF COURSE, YOU'D HAVE TO, ONE, DRAIN THE PEATLAND TO SCRAPE IT; AND THEN, WHEN YOU SCRAPED OFF THE LAYER, BOTH OF THOSE IMPACTS WOULD ESSENTIALLY ENHANCE OXIDATION CONDITIONS. YOU KNOW, BASICALLY THE -- THE HYPOTHESIS WAS THAT YOU WOULD PROBABLY DRIVE A SYSTEM FROM RELATIVELY DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 28 ANAEROBIC REDUCING CONDITIONS THAT WOULD TEND TO REDUCE TRANSPORT OF MERCURY TO A MORE OXIDIZING AEROBIC SITUATION THAT WOULD ENHANCE THE ABILITY OF SUBSEQUENT RAINFALL AND SO FORTH TO WASH PEAT -- MERCURY INTO RECEIVING SYSTEMS. Q. OKAY. AS A RESULT OF YOUR STUDY AND YOUR STUDIES FINDINGS DID THEY DECIDE TO GO AHEAD WITH THE HARVESTING? A. NO. THE -- THE WHOLE PROJECT, THE WHOLE PROPOSED PEAT TO METHANOL PLANT NEVER WENT THROUGH BECAUSE, AS I UNDERSTAND, CHANGING ECONOMIC CONDITIONS -- IN OTHER WORDS, ALL THIS GOT GOING FOLLOWING THE ARAB OIL EMBARGO. AND THERE WAS A STRONG INTEREST IN ALTERNATIVES TO GASOLINE AND SO FORTH. AFTER CONCERN ABOUT THE ARAB OIL EMBARGO SUBSIDED, SOME ECONOMIC INCENTIVE DECLINED. AND, MOREOVER, ON TOP OF THAT, THERE WERE OTHER BROAD ENVIRONMENTAL CONCERNS ABOUT THE WHOLE EFFECT ON THAT SYSTEM THAT WERE COMPLETELY INDEPENDENT OF MERCURY. Q. UH-HUH (YES). A. AND THOSE TWO THINGS, FROM MY UNDERSTANDING, ULTIMATELY WERE THE DEATH KNOLL OF THAT WHOLE PROJECT. Q. OKAY. WHAT OTHER EXPERIENCE HAVE YOU HAD WITH THE ANALYSIS OF MERCURY AND MERCURY COMPOUNDS? A. IN TERMS OF DIRECT ANALYSIS, THAT'S BEEN IT. DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 29 Q. OKAY. ON YOUR RESUME ON PAGE 7 UNDER "M.S. THESES," IT SAYS, "ELIZABETH RYAN--- A. UH-HUH (YES). Q. ---1985, DISTRIBUTION OF MERCURY IN PEAT, SEDIMENT AND BIOTA." IS THAT--- A. THAT'S THE THESIS THAT--- Q. ---THE THESIS THAT YOU -- OKAY. A. ---EMANATED FROM THAT WRRI STUDY, YES. Q. THIS C.B. PACE AND R.T. Di GIULIO--- A. YES. Q. ---LEAD CONCENTRATIONS IN SOIL--- A. UH-HUH (YES). Q. ---SEDIMENT AND CLAM SAMPLES--- A. UH-HUH (YES). Q. ---IS THAT ALSO FROM THE SAME STUDY? A. YEAH, WE MORE OR LESS--- Q. THAT'S ON PAGE 12--- A. ---WE WEREN'T FUNDED TO DO THAT. BUT I HAD A MASTER OF ENVIRONMENTAL MANAGEMENT STUDENT AT THE TIME, CHARLES PACE, WHO WAS VERY INTERESTED IN THE OVERALL PROJECT. AND SINCE, YOU KNOW, A LOT OF THE EFFORT IN THAT STUDY WAS GETTING THESE SAMPLES, WE HAD TONS OF SAMPLES. HE HAD BASICALLY FOLLOWED UPON ELIZABETH AND MEASURED LEAD -- MORE OR LESS DID A VERY SIMILAR STUDY LOOKING AT LEAD CONCENTRATIONS IN THOSE SAME SAMPLES DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 30 AND ALSO LOOKING AT LEAD FRACTIONATION. THAT IS, THE RELATIVE ASSOCIATION OF LEAD WITH HUMIC FOLIC ACIDS VERSUS ION EXCHANGE. IN OTHER WORDS, INDICES OF RELATIVE MOBILITY OF LEAD. Q. OKAY. A. BUT THAT WOULD -- WE JUST PIGGYBACKED THAT, IN ESSENCE. WE WEREN'T REQUIRED BY THE FUNDING AGENCY TO DO THAT. Q. IT MENTIONS HERE UNDER REPORTS, Di GIULIO AND RICHARDSON, 1989, THE EFFECTS OF ATMOSPHERIC DEPOSITION ON RED SPRUCE. A. UH-HUH (YES). Q. WHAT -- WHAT IS YOUR BACKGROUND WITH THE INVESTIGATION OF ATMOSPHERIC DEPOSITION? A. WHAT PAGE ARE YOU ON, SO I'LL BE--- Q. 13. A. 13? Q. UH-HUH (YES), THE VERY LAST ENTRY UNDER "REPORTS." A. OH, I SEE. CURT AND I, WE GOT A GRANT -- AND I CAN'T REMEMBER EXACTLY WHEN IT STARTED, PROBABLY AROUND '86, '87, SOMEWHERE IN THERE -- TO STUDY THE IMPACTS OF OZONE ON RED SPRUCE. I -- ONE OF MY INTERESTS HAS BEEN OXIDATIVE STRESS AND SO FORTH. SO, I'D BEEN STUDYING FOR SOME TIME FREE RADICAL PROCESSES DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 31 IN AQUATIC ANIMALS. AND THEN THROUGH THE NAPAP PROGRAM AND SO FORTH THERE WAS GREAT INTEREST IN IMPACTS OF ACID RAIN ASSOCIATED OXIDANTS, LIKE N.O.X., S.O.X. IN OZONE ON FOREST VEGETATION. AND, SO, THE BIOCHEMICAL APPROACHES THAT I HAD DEVELOPED FOR LOOKING AT OXIDATIVE STRESS IN AQUATIC ORGANISMS WERE READILY APPROPRIATE -- YOU KNOW, PROVIDED A REAL INTERESTING WAY TO TRY TO LOOK AT THESE ATMOSPHERIC OXIDANTS ON TREES. THE BIOCHEMISTRY IS QUITE RELATED. SO, WE WROTE A PROPOSAL TO THE U.S. FOREST SERVICE AND DID, BASICALLY, A STUDY AT THE BOYCE-THOMPSON INSTITUTE AT CORNELL UNIVERSITY, WHERE WE -- IN COLLABORATION WITH THEIR PEOPLE -- EXPOSED RED SPRUCE TO OZONE. AND CURT BASICALLY DID THE PHYSIOLOGICAL MEASUREMENTS ON PHOTOSYNTHESIS, GAS EXCHANGE AND SO FORTH. AND MY GROUP DID THE BIOCHEMICAL MEASURES ON OXIDATIVE STRESS AND ANTI-OXIDANT RESPONSES. Q. IS THAT THE ONLY STUDY OR INVESTIGATION THAT YOU'VE DONE RELATING TO ATMOSPHERIC DEPOSITION? A. YES. I THINK SO, YEAH. Q. OKAY. A. WELL, LET ME THINK. AND WE DID -- WE DID A -- WE DID A LITTLE BIT, BASICALLY, OF WORK FOR CURT. HE GOT -- HE GOT MONEY TO DO -- NOT THE BIOCHEMICAL PART, DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 32 BUT HE GOT MONEY TO DO SOME OF THE PHYSIOLOGICAL EFFECTS IN A SIMILAR -- BASICALLY UNDER THE SAME GENERAL NAPAP ACID PRECIPITATION PROGRAM TO STUDY EFFECTS OF OZONE ON THE LOBLOLLY PINE, AND WHICH HE DID AT THE DUKE FOREST SITE. AND, SO, MY LAB CONTRIBUTED TO SOME BIOCHEMICAL ANALYSES. AGAIN, THEY WERE JUST PIGGYBACKED. THEY -- WE JUST DID IT FOR THE FUN OF IT BECAUSE WE WERE INTERESTED IN DOING IT. Q. HAVE YOU BEEN ASKED TO EXPRESS AN OPINION IN THIS CASE REGARDING ACID -- I MEAN ATMOSPHERIC DEPOSITION--- A. NO. Q. ---AS IT RELATES TO THE EVERGLADES? A. NO. Q. OKAY. ON PAGE 14 UNDER -- WELL, JUST ABOVE OTHER PUBLICATIONS THERE'S AN ENTRY--- A. RIGHT. Q. ---FOR D.W. EVANS--- A. RIGHT. Q. ---Di GIULIO AND RYAN REGARDING MERCURY AND PEAT--- A. YEAH. Q. ---IN ITS DRAINAGE WATERS IN EASTERN NORTH CAROLINA. A. UH-HUH (YES). DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 33 Q. IS THAT THE REPORT THAT YOU WERE REFERRING TO--- A. RIGHT. Q. ---PREVIOUSLY? OKAY. HOW DO YOU KNOW HOW THE MERCURY CONCENTRATIONS THAT YOU FOUND IN NORTH CAROLINA PEATLAND WILL COMPARE WITH THE MERCURY CONCENTRATIONS FOUND IN THE FLORIDA EVERGLADES? A. YOU KNOW, I'VE NEVER REALLY CAREFULLY GONE DOWN AND COMPARED THE TWO. I -- AND I SHOULD, BUT MY RECOLLECTION -- AND I GUESS I HAVEN'T SEEN A WHOLE LOT OF PEAT DATA FOR FLORIDA. MY SENSE IS THAT -- IN FACT, I THINK, WHEN I WROTE THE PAPER, THERE WAS A LITTLE BIT OF FLORIDA DATA. MY GENERAL SENSE WAS THAT THE PEAT -- THE MERCURY CONCENTRATIONS IN PEAT IN NORTH CAROLINA WERE GENERALLY LOWER THAN THOSE OBSERVED IN FLORIDA. BUT THAT'S A VAGUE MEMORY AND I WOULD -- I'D HAVE TO GO BACK AND MORE CAREFULLY CHECK THAT. THE OTHER THING WE FOUND, TOO, IN THE STUDY WAS THAT THERE'S THIS ENORMOUS -- VERY STRONG ASSOCIATION IN THE CANAL SEDIMENTS AND THE PEAT BETWEEN ORGANIC MATTER CONCENTRATION. AND, SO, IT'S VERY -- WITHOUT THAT INFORMATION YOU HAVE TO BE EXTREMELY CAREFUL IN COMPARING SITES OR, YOU KNOW -- WELL, AT LEAST THAT INFORMATION. Q. ON PAGE 20 UNDER "GRANTS," IT SAYS THE EFFECTS DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 34 OF PEATLAND DRAINAGE ON MERCURY DYNAMICS ON EASTERN -- IN EASTERN NORTH CAROLINA. IS THAT THE GRANT THAT YOU WERE SPEAKING OF BEFORE? A. YES, UH-HUH (YES). Q. FOR THIRTY-FIVE THOUSAND, EIGHT HUNDRED AND FORTY ($35,840.00)? A. RIGHT. I WAS WRONG. I SAID TWENTY-FIVE ($25,000.00) EARLIER BECAUSE IT USED TO BE -- I THOUGHT THE CAP AT WRRI, BUT I THINK BECAUSE -- THAT'S RIGHT. WE WERE -- WE GOT INCREASED MONIES BECAUSE DAVE EVANS WAS MORE OR LESS ADDED AS A CO-PI ON ORIGINAL SUBMISSION. Q. HAS YOUR INVOLVEMENT IN THE ANALYSIS OF MERCURY AND MERCURY COMPOUNDS INCLUDED WATER ANALYSIS OR HAS IT MAINLY BEEN SEDIMENT ANALYSIS? A. WELL, IN THAT REPORT -- IN THAT STUDY, THAT STUDY INCLUDED WATER COLUMN ANALYSES. THE ACTUAL ANALYSES, THOUGH, WERE ALL PERFORMED IN THE LABORATORY OF DR. EVANS AT THE DUKE MARINE LABORATORY. Q. WHAT HAS BEEN THE EXTENT OF YOUR INVOLVEMENT OR ANALYSIS OF MERCURY AND MERCURY COMPOUNDS IN THE SOIL AND SEDIMENTS OF NATURAL LAKES? A. WELL, THAT'S -- THAT STUDY INCLUDED WATER BODIES THAT I -- I DON'T KNOW IF I WOULD CHARACTERIZE THEM AS LAKES, BUT THEY WERE, YOU KNOW, BROAD, SLOW DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 35 RIVERS. I DON'T KNOW. IT -- IT'S -- IT'S A HARD CALL. BUT I -- I GUESS I CAN'T SAY THAT THOSE STUDIES INCLUDED LAKE -- QUOTE, UNQUOTE -- LAKES. Q. HAVE YOU HAD ANY INVOLVEMENT OR ANALYSIS OF MERCURY AND MERCURY COMPOUNDS IN THE SOIL AND SEDIMENTS OF WETLANDS? A. YES. THIS STUDY IN THE NORTH CAROLINA PEATLANDS WERE -- THE PEATLANDS IN THAT AREA INCLUDE WHAT WE WOULD -- ARE, YOU KNOW, POCOSIN WETLANDS. Q. OKAY. ARE THEY EUTROPHIC OR ALL OLUTROPHIC [sic] WETLANDS? OLIGOTROPHIC, I'M SORRY. A. I'M -- I'M RELUCTANT TO SAY. WE DIDN'T DO ANY OTHER WATER CHEMISTRIES IN TERMS OF CHLOROPHYLL OR PHOSPHORUS OR ANYTHING ELSE THAT WOULD DIRECTLY ADDRESS TROPHIC STATUS. MY SENSE WAS THAT THERE -- THEY -- THEY WERE PRODUCT -- TYPICALLY PRODUCTIVE WETLAND SYSTEMS. BUT I WOULD BE RELUCTANT TO CLASSIFY THEM AS OLIGOTROPHIC OR EUTROPHIC, BECAUSE WE MADE NO MEASURES THAT DIRECTLY ASSESSED THAT. Q. OKAY. HAVE YOU PUBLISHED ANY WORKS REGARDING THE EFFECTS OF PHOSPHORUS ON THE METHYLATION PROCESS? A. NO. Q. HAVE YOU PUBLISHED ANY WORK CONCERNING THE CAUSES OF METHYLMERCURY PRODUCTION IN EUTROPHIC WETLANDS OR OLIGOTROPHIC WETLANDS? DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 36 A. WELL, IN THAT STUDY WE DID ASSAY FOR METHYLMERCURY. AND IN THE DISCUSSION WE ALLUDED TO POTENTIAL, YOU KNOW, BIOTIC AND ABIOTIC SOURCES OF METHYLATION ACTIVITY, BUT WE DIDN'T SPECIFICALLY ADDRESS IT EXPERIMENTALLY. Q. OKAY. CAN YOU JUST GIVE ME A GENERAL DEFINITION OF WHAT BIOACCUMULATION MEANS? A. BIOACCUMULATION REFERS TO THE ACCUMULATION OF A MATERIAL BY A BIOLOGICAL ORGANISM. Q. DO YOU UNDERSTAND THE MECHANISMS, CHEMICAL, BIOLOGICAL AND PHYSICAL, THAT ARE INVOLVED IN MERCURY BIOACCUMULATION AND BIOTA? A. I DON'T THINK ANYONE COMPLETELY UNDERSTANDS THAT. I UNDERSTAND A REASONABLE DEGREE OF THAT AS IT'S UNDERSTOOD IN THE GENERAL LITERATURE AND FROM MY EXPERIENCE AS AN AQUATIC TOXICOLOGIST. Q. WHAT'S YOUR GENERAL UNDERSTANDING OF THE MECHANISMS THAT ARE INVOLVED? A. IN THE ACCUMULATION OF MERCURY? Q. UH-HUH (YES). A. WELL, IT'S VERY COMPLEX. THERE'S NO SIMPLE MECHANISM. YOU KNOW, IT VARIES TREMENDOUSLY AMONG SPECIES. MY SENSE WOULD BE THAT BENTHIC ORGANISMS ARE PROBABLY ACCUMULATING MERCURY MOST DIRECTLY FROM ASSOCIATION WITH AN INGESTION OF SEDIMENTS THAT THE DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 37 MAJOR FORM OF MERCURY IN THOSE SEDIMENTS IS MERCURIC ION, HG2+. AND IN SUPPORT OF THAT, THE BULK OF THE -- OR CONSISTENT WITH THAT, THE BULK OF MERCURY IN THOSE ORGANISMS TENDS TO BE MERCURIC ION, NOT METHYLMERCURY. IF WE LOOK AT LOWER TROPHIC LEVEL NEKTON OR EVEN LOWER -- INCLUDING LOWER TROPHIC FISH, SAY, AS -- OR LET'S LOOK AT LOWER TROPHIC FISH, THEN ACCUMULATION PATTERNS OR SOURCES OF ACCUMULATION WOULD BE SORT OF A MIXED BAG FOR IONIC METALS, INCLUDING MERCURY, MERCURIC ION, AS WELL AS OTHER, CADMIUM LEAD. IT'S GENERALLY THOUGHT THAT DIRECT GILL UPTAKE IS THE MAJOR ROUTE OF ACCUMULATION. SO, THOSE FISH WOULD PROBABLY BE ACCUMULATING MERCURY BOTH THROUGH DIRECT GILL UPTAKE, WHICH WOULD PROBABLY BE LARGELY MERCURIC ION. BUT THEN THEY WOULD ALSO BE ACCUMULATING MERCURY THROUGH THE FOOD CHAIN, WHICH WOULD PROBABLY INCLUDE BOTH MERCURIC ION AND METHYLMERCURY THAT'S BEEN ACCUMULATED BY LOWER TROPHIC LEVELS, PLANKTON, PHYTOPLANKTON, ZOOPLANKTON. AND THAT SEEMED TO BE CONSISTENT WITH THE LITERATURE IN THAT THESE LOWER TROPHIC -- VERY EARLY TROPHIC LEVELS HAVE A MIXTURE OF MERCURIC ION AND METHYLMERCURY. METHYLMERCURY, THOUGH, IS MUCH MORE READILY RETAINED WITHIN AN ORGANISM. IT'S MUCH MORE DIFFICULT FOR AN ANIMAL TO DEPURATE MERCURIC ION -- I MEAN DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 38 METHYLMERCURY VERSUS MERCURIC ION. AND THAT, IN PART, ACCOUNTS FOR THE RELATIVELY GREATER CONTRIBUTION OF METHYLMERCURY AS YOU MOVE UP A FOOD CHAIN. SUCH THAT BY THE TIME YOU GET TO HIGHER TROPHIC LEVELS, THINGS LIKE LARGEMOUTH BASS AND SO FORTH, THE MAJOR ROUTE OF BIOACCUMULATION IS THROUGH THE FOOD CHAIN AND IT IS PREDOMINATELY METHYLMERCURY. Q. CAN YOU DESCRIBE BIOMAGNIFICATION AS IT RELATES TO MERCURY? A. WELL, BIOMAGNIFICATION, IN GENERAL, JUST REFERS TO THE OBSERVATION FOR CERTAIN CHEMICALS THAT AS YOU MOVE UP A FOOD CHAIN THERE ARE GREATER WHOLE BODY CONCENTRATIONS OF A PARTICULAR POLLUTANT. METHYLMERCURY IS WIDELY ACCEPTED TO BE ONE OF THE UNUSUAL CHEMICALS THAT DISPLAYS BIOMAGNIFICATION. MOST CONTAMINANTS DON'T. BUT METHYLMERCURY DOES SHOW CLASSIC BIOMAGNIFICATION AND IT SEEMS TO BE THROUGH CLASSIC TROPHIC TRANSFERS. Q. OKAY. ARE YOU AWARE OF ANY EUTROPHIC WETLANDS WHICH ARE EXPERIENCING INCREASED RATES OF METHYLMERCURY PRODUCTION? A. I GUESS I'M NOT AWARE OF A SPECIFIC -- I'M UNAWARE OF PEOPLE WHO'VE GONE AND TRIED TO DIRECTLY ASSESS THAT AS YOU TOOK A SYSTEM AND MADE IT MORE EUTROPHIC, THAT SPECIFIC SYSTEM WOULD ENHANCE DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 39 METHYLATION. THE EVIDENCE THAT EUTROPHICATION ENHANCES METHYLATION IS BASED LARGELY ON JUST COMPARING DIFFERENT SYSTEMS, AND FROM LABORATORY STUDIES EMPLOYING NUTRIENT ENRICHMENT AND SO FORTH. Q. ALL RIGHT. SO, ARE YOU AWARE OF ANY EUTROPHIC WETLANDS WHICH ARE EXPERIENCING INCREASED RATES OF METHYLMERCURY PRODUCTION? A. WELL, THE PROBLEM, YOU SEE -- INCREASED OVER WHAT? I MEAN THERE'S A LOT OF EUTROPHIC WETLANDS DEMONSTRATING METHYLATION. BUT TO SAY "INCREASED METHYLATION" IMPLIES THAT WE HAD PRIOR KNOWLEDGE THAT THEY -- WHEN THEY WERE LESS EUTROPHIC, THEY WERE PRODUCING LESS METHYLMERCURY. AND I'M UNAWARE OF STUDIES WHO FOLLOWED A SPECIFIC TIME -- WHO'S FOLLOWED A SPECIFIC SYSTEM AS IT WENT FROM RELATIVE OLIGOTROPHY TO MORE EUTROPHY AND, REALLY, DIRECTLY TEST OF THAT. SO, NO, I'M NOT AWARE IN THAT STRICT A CONTEXT. Q. OKAY. ARE YOU AWARE OF ANY EUTROPHIC WETLANDS WHICH ARE EXPERIENCING INCREASED BIOACCUMULATION OF METHYLMERCURY IN BIOTA? A. WOULD YOU REPEAT THAT? Q. UH-HUH (YES). ARE YOU AWARE OF ANY EUTROPHIC WETLANDS WHICH ARE EXPERIENCING INCREASED BIOACCUMULATION OF METHYLMERCURY IN BIOTA? A. NO. DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 40 Q. ARE YOU AWARE OF ANY OLIGOTROPHIC WETLANDS WHICH ARE EXPERIENCING INCREASED MERCURY METHYLATION? A. WELL, AGAIN, AND RELATED TO THE OTHER ONE, BY -- AS YOU STATED THE QUESTION, YOU'RE IMPLYING THAT THERE WAS PRIOR UNDERSTANDING OF BIOACCUMULATION, AND THEN SOMETHING CHANGED THE SYSTEM AND THEN THEY WERE ABLE TO GO -- AND I'M NOT -- THAT'S JUST NOT DONE. OR I MEAN IT'S JUST -- IT'S -- I'M UNAWARE OF PEOPLE DOING THAT. CLEARLY, THOUGH, A NUMBER OF PEOPLE HAVE COMPARED AQUATIC SYSTEMS OF DIFFERENT TROPHIC STATUS AND COMPARED MERCURY ACCUMULATION ACROSS THOSE SYSTEMS, INCLUDING FLORIDA AND INCLUDING NORTHERN U.S. AND CANADA AND SWEDEN AND SO FORTH, AND I'VE CONSISTENTLY SHOWN A PATTERN IN WHICH OLIGOTROPHIC SYSTEMS SHOW GREATER BIOACCUMULATION, PARTICULARLY IN HIGHER TROPHIC LEVELS OF MERCURY VERSUS THE SAME SPECIES IN MORE EUTROPHIC SYSTEMS. Q. ARE YOU AWARE OF ANY OLIGOTROPHIC WETLANDS WHICH ARE EXPERIENCING INCREASED BIOACCUMULATION OF METHYLMERCURY IN BIOTA? A. WELL, EVERGLADES NATIONAL PARK AREA APPEARS TO BE SUCH A SYSTEM THAT IS RELATIVELY OLIGOTROPHIC, AND SHOWS GREATER ACCUMULATIONS OF METHYLMERCURY IN FISH VERSUS MORE EUTROPHIC AQUATIC SYSTEMS IN FLORIDA. DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 41 Q. IS IT HIGHER THAN IT WAS HISTORICALLY? A. I THINK THAT'S A VERY IMPORTANT QUESTION. I DON'T -- I'M UNAWARE OF ANY DATA AVAILABLE TO ADDRESS A HISTORICAL TREND THERE. Q. THEN HOW DO YOU COME TO YOUR CONCLUSION THAT IT'S EXPERIENCING INCREASED--- A. I MEAN -- WELL--- Q. ---RATES OF BIOACCUMULATION? A. I TRIED TO MAKE IT CLEAR THAT, AGAIN, SINCE NO ONE CAN GO IN AND STUDY -- NO ONE -- IT'S VERY, VERY DIFFICULT TO -- UNLESS YOU EXPERIMENTALLY MANIPULATED AN AQUATIC SYSTEM OR MAYBE DID IT WITH THESE STA'S, IT'S VERY DIFFICULT TO GET THAT KIND OF CHANGE OVER TIME WITH CHANGE IN TROPHIC STATUS. SO, TECHNICALLY, YOU'RE RIGHT. YOU CAN'T SAY THAT THERE WAS A HISTORICAL BASIS FOR THAT CONCLUSION. BUT THAT, AGAIN, OUR BEST DATA SOURCE IS FROM COMPARATIVE SORTS OF STUDIES THAT INDICATE OLIGOTROPHIC SYSTEMS, INCLUDING THE EVERGLADES NATIONAL PARK AREA, TEND TO EXHIBIT GREATER CONCENTRATIONS OF MERCURY IN BIOTA. Q. WHAT STUDIES ARE YOU REFERRING TO? A. THE -- I GUESS THE MAIN ONE THAT I'VE EXAMINED WAS THE E MAP DATA SET. Q. AND IT SHOWED WHAT? A. IT SHOWED THAT -- WELL, I GUESS THERE'S A DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 42 COUPLE. THAT ONE INDICATED RELATIVELY GREATER CONCENTRATIONS OF MERCURY IN FISH IN EVERGLADES NATIONAL PARK AREA VERSUS WATER SYSTEMS CLOSER TO THE EAA, IN THAT GENERAL AREA, WITH A REVERSE TREND OBSERVED IN A NUMBER OF INDICES OR MEASURES THAT ARE GENERALLY ASSOCIATED WITH TROPHIC STATUS, INCLUDING PHOSPHORUS, CARBON, SULFATE CONDUCTIVITY. Q. WHAT'S THE BASIC DIFFERENCE BETWEEN AN OLIGOTROPHIC AND A EUTROPHIC WATER SYSTEM? A. ON A RELATIVE SCALE, OLIGOTROPHIC SYSTEMS EXHIBIT LOWER CONCENTRATIONS OF NUTRIENTS, LOWER PHOTOSYNTHETIC ACTIVITIES, LOWER PRIMARY AND SECONDARY PRODUCTION. ASSOCIATED WITH THAT, THEY TYPICALLY HAVE LOWER CONCENTRATIONS OF PARTICULATE MATTER, GREATER CLARITY, LESS BIOMASS PER SURFACE AREA OR VOLUME OF WATER. Q. OKAY. WHAT'S THE GENERAL MORPHOLOGY OF THE LAKES OR RIVERS THAT YOU'VE STUDIED? A. WELL, IN AS MERCURIES? MR. SAMS: OBJECTION TO THE FORM. Q. IN THE -- UH-HUH (YES). IN NORTH CAROLINA. A. IN -- WELL--- Q. WELL, IN--- A. ---IN THE MERCURY WORK? Q. YEAH. DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 43 A. NOT, NOT OTHER WORKS. WE ESSENTIALLY LOOKED AT TWO MAJOR DIFFERENT TYPES OF WATER SYSTEMS. ONE WERE MAN-MADE CANAL SYSTEMS THAT WERE SERVING, REALLY, TO HELP CONTROL WATER LEVELS IN THOSE PEATLANDS, SO, AS A DRAINAGE SYSTEM THROUGH THE PEATLANDS. THEN, WE WERE ALSO STUDYING THE PUNGO RIVER, WHICH IS A MAJOR NATURAL RIVER SYSTEM IN EASTERN NORTH CAROLINA, THROUGH THAT AREA, IN WHICH THIS CANAL WATER EMPTIES. IN THAT RIVER WE WERE LOOKING IN THE UPPER REACHES OF IT IN THE PEATLANDS AREA. IT WAS STILL THROUGHOUT PRETTY MUCH A -- SORT OF A BLACK WATER RIVER, HIGH IN HUMICS AND FULVICS. BUT IN ITS UPPER REACHES IT WAS FAIRLY SMALL, AS I RECALL, MAYBE A HUNDRED METERS ACROSS OR EVEN LESS. AND WE FOLLOWED IT DOWN TO NEAR THE MOUTH OF THE -- I BELIEVE IT'S THE ALBEMARLE SOUND, WHERE IT BECOMES VERY MUCH AN ESTUARINE BROAD RIVER. Q. OKAY. WHAT ARE SOME OTHER MORPHOLOGICAL CHARACTERISTICS OF THE PUNGO RIVER? A. IN TERMS -- YOU MEAN BESIDES ITS -- WELL, LIKE, IN SPECIFICALLY WHAT? Q. LIKE, HOW DEEP IS IT? A. IT -- IN THE UPPER REACHES, AS I RECALL, IT WAS -- IT WOULD RUN -- I MEAN, OF COURSE, IT'S ON A CROSS-SECTION. IT MIGHT IN THE SUMMERTIME, WHEN WE WERE LOOKING AT IT, FAIRLY LOW FLOW, IT MIGHT HAVE A DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 44 MAXIMUM DEPTH OF FIVE OR SIX FEET. FURTHER DOWN, AS I RECALL, IT MIGHT HAVE BEEN TWENTY-FIVE FEET OR SO. IT'S GENERALLY RATHER -- RELATIVELY SHALLOW. Q. OKAY. WHAT KINDS OF FISH ARE IN THERE? A. WE DIDN'T -- WE DIDN'T DO ANY WORK WITH FISH. IT'S -- IN THE UPPER REACHES, PEOPLE DO BASS FISHING, SO FORTH. IT'S PROBABLY PRETTY TYPICAL OF A LOT OF FRESHWATER NORTH CAROLINA RIVERS, AS I UNDERSTAND, THAT HAS REGIONAL POPULATIONS OF BASS, CATFISH, VARIOUS SPECIES OF SUNFISHES, CRAPPIE, YOU KNOW. SO, IT'S A PRETTY POPULAR SPORT FISHING AREA. AND THEN AS IT MOVES TOWARDS THE COAST IT BECOMES -- TO THE SOUND, AS I UNDERSTAND IT, YOU CAN CATCH GRAY TROUT AND MORE TYPICAL ESTUARINE SPECIES. AND THAT'S WHY WE SPECIFICALLY TARGETED RANGIA CUNEATA, WHICH IS A COMMON CLAM THROUGHOUT THE GULF AND LOWER ATLANTIC COAST THAT EXHIBITS A HUGE RANGE OF SALINITY TOLERANCE FROM FRESH TO ALMOST PURE SALT. AND THAT WAS WHEN -- IN OTHER WORDS, WE COULD READILY CATCH THAT CLAM THROUGHOUT THOSE REACHES OF THE PUNGO. Q. WHAT TYPE OF SOIL OR SEDIMENT DOES IT HAVE? A. WELL, ALL WE REALLY MEASURED WAS ORGANIC MATTER CONTENT, WHICH VARIED TREMENDOUSLY IN THE UPPER REACHES. I'M TRYING TO REMEMBER THE -- SEEMS TO ME ORGANIC CARBON, OR, AT LEAST, LOSS ON IGNITION AS A DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 45 MEASURE OF THAT, WAS MAYBE UP TO TWELVE OR FIFTEEN PERCENT. IT WAS A VERY, YOU KNOW, CLASSIC MUCK SEDIMENT AND, YOU KNOW, REFLECTED THE INPUTS OF THOSE PEATLAND AREAS THAT WERE DRAINING INTO IT. AND, OF COURSE, THE PEATLAND WAS FAR -- AS I RECALL, THE PEATLAND -- THE PEAT ITSELF WAS FORTY, FIFTY PERCENT OR SO ORGANIC MATTER. AND THEN IN THE PUNGO THERE'S MORE OR LESS A GRADIENT. AND THAT'S WHAT WE LOOKED AT, SPECIFICALLY, AT FRACTIONATION OF MERCURY IN THOSE SEDIMENTS GOING FROM THE HIGH ORGANIC MATTER CONTENT MUCK SEDIMENTS DOWN TO THE MOUTH, WHICH BECAME FAR SANDIER AND, AS I RECALL, HAD ORGANIC MATTER CONCENTRATIONS IN THE, YOU KNOW, ONE, TWO PERCENT RANGE, SOMETHING LIKE THAT. Q. OKAY. YOU SAID YOU WOULD CONSIDER IT TO BE SIMILAR TO A WETLAND SYSTEM? A. WELL, THE PEATLAND -- THE POCOSINS THAT WERE INCLUDED IN THE STUDY ARE CONSIDERED A CLASS -- A TYPE OF WETLAND SYSTEM. SO WE'RE ACTUALLY DOING -- OBVIOUSLY, WE COULDN'T DO RANGIA STUDIES THERE, BUT WE COLLECTED MUCK PEAT SOILS IN THE POCOSIN AREA THAT WERE COVERED BY NATURAL VEGETATION, IN FACT, IN LOOKING AT MERCURY FRACTIONATION AND CONCENTRATIONS IN THOSE. SO, YEAH, THOSE POCOSINS ARE A WETLAND TYPE. Q. HOW DO YOU SPELL THAT? DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 46 A. P-O-C-O-S-I-N. Q. WHAT TYPE OF SOIL IS GENERALLY FOUND IN OLIGOTROPHIC WETLANDS? A. I'M NOT REAL SURE. Q. DO YOU KNOW WHAT TYPES OF SOIL -- WHAT TYPE OF SOIL IS FOUND IN EUTROPHIC WETLANDS? A. WELL, I WOULD JUST -- I WOULD TEND TO ASSUME THAT EUTROPHIC WETLAND SOILS WOULD PROBABLY HAVE RELATIVELY HIGHER ORGANIC MATTER CONTENT AND SO FORTH. BUT I GUESS I'VE NEVER SEEN WETLAND SOILS CLASSIFIED THAT WAY IN TERMS OF OLIGOTROPHIC OR EUTROPHIC SOILS. THAT'S SORT OF A DIFFERENT--- Q. PRIOR TO YOUR INVOLVEMENT IN THIS LITIGATION HAVE YOU EVER STUDIED THE FLORIDA EVERGLADES AQUATIC SYSTEM? A. NO. Q. CAN YOU DESCRIBE THE GENERAL CHARACTERISTICS OF MORPHOLOGY OF THE EVERGLADES AQUATIC SYSTEM? A. NOT IN DETAIL. I'VE EXAMINED A NUMBER OF THE MAPS THAT SHOW THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THE EVERGLADES AGRICULTURAL AREA, THE AREAS WHERE THE PROPOSED STA'S WOULD GO IN, THE WATER CONSERVATION AREAS, THE EVERGLADES NATIONAL PARK REGION, THE CANAL SYSTEMS THAT CONNECT THE TWO. I -- I'VE BEEN DOWN IN THAT AREA JUST AS A TOURIST AND I'VE A GENERAL SENSE OF HOW SOME OF DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 47 THAT AREA LOOKS. BUT I DON'T HAVE DETAILED INFORMATION OF THE TYPE YOU ASK. Q. OKAY. WHAT TYPES OF ANIMALS ARE PRESENT? A. IN -- THROUGHOUT THAT REGION? Q. UH-HUH (YES). THROUGHOUT THE EVERGLADES SYSTEM. A. SYSTEM? Q. UH-HUH (YES). A. LOTS. BIRDS, MAMMALS. I MEAN -- I GUESS SOME OF THEM MORE -- THE ONES THAT I -- THROUGH MY READING OF PARTICULAR INTERESTS RELATIVE TO MERCURY WOULD BE SOME OF THE ENDANGERED SPECIES, LIKE THE BLACK PANTHER, THE SNAIL KITE, THE WOOD IBIS. IN TERMS OF AQUATIC -- OF FISH, IT SEEMS TO EXHIBIT PRETTY TYPICAL ASSEMBLAGES OF FRESHWATER FISHES SEEN IN SOUTHERN SYSTEMS; A LOT OF CENTRARCHIDS SUCH AS LARGEMOUTH BASS AND OTHER SUNFISHES, BOWFIN, VARIOUS GARS. I'M TRYING TO THINK. OF COURSE IT'S -- THERE'S ALLIGATORS IN THE REGION; HAS A KIND OF A -- FROM MY GENERAL INTEREST IN ORNITHOLOGY, IT HAS A REAL DIVERSE AVA FAUNA OF TEMPERATE BIRDS, AS WELL AS SOME MORE TROPICAL SPECIES LIKE FLAMINGOES, IBIS AND SO FORTH, KITES. Q. OKAY. WHAT TYPES OF PLANTS AND VEGETATION ARE PRESENT? A. WELL, JUST THROUGH MY READINGS I -- I DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 48 UNDERSTAND THAT IN THE WETLAND SYSTEMS THE DOMINANT PLAN IS SAWGRASS; THERE'S SOME CATTAIL; AND, OBVIOUSLY, THERE'S SOME CONCERN OF INCREASING -- INCREASES IN CATTAIL VERSUS SAWGRASS IN CERTAIN AREAS. I KNOW THERE'S ALSO BALD CYPRESS SYSTEMS IN THE GENERAL AREA, CLASSICS, CYPRESS, TUPELO SWAMPS. BUT AS I UNDERSTAND IT, THE MARSH -- CERTAINLY THE DOMINANT MARSH PLANT TENDS TO BE SAWGRASS WITH LESSER AMOUNTS OF CATTAIL. Q. OKAY. IS IT YOUR BELIEF THAT THERE'S A MERCURY PROBLEM IN THE FLORIDA EVERGLADE SYSTEM? A. YES. Q. OKAY. IN GENERAL TERMS WHAT DO YOU REGARD AS THE EXISTING MERCURY PROBLEM IN THE EVERGLADES? A. WELL, THERE APPEARS TO BE A NUMBER OF AREAS WITHIN THE EVERGLADE SYSTEM THAT HAVE RELATIVELY HIGH CONCENTRATIONS OF MERCURY IN HIGHER TROPHIC ORGANISMS, PROBABLY MOST -- BEST EXHIBITED BY LARGEMOUTH BASS THAT, IN A NUMBER OF LOCATIONS, THOSE CONCENTRATIONS EXCEED THE FDA LIMITS, WHICH, I BELIEVE, NOW ARE ONE PART PER MILLION. THERE'S ALSO -- WHICH HAS AN IMPORTANT -- PROBABLY A MORE IMPORTANT HUMAN HEALTH POTENTIAL IMPACT, ALTHOUGH IT MAY -- IT MAY AS WELL -- MAY POTENTIALLY BE A HARBINGER OF IMPACTS ON THOSE POPULATIONS. AND PROBABLY MORE IMPORTANTLY, THOUGH, SERVES AS A GENERAL CONCERN THAT MERCURY CONCENTRATIONS DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 49 ARE IN THE REALM TO EVOKE BOTH HUMAN HEALTH AND ECOSYSTEM CONCERNS, THE LATTER BEING MUCH MORE DIFFICULT TO GET AT. BUT WITH -- CERTAINLY WITH REPORTS OF HIGH CONCENTRATIONS IN ENDANGERED SPECIES, LIKE THE PANTHER, SUGGESTS A POTENTIAL FOR ECOLOGICAL IMPACTS, AS WELL AS THE CLEAR HUMAN HEALTH IMPACTS. Q. IS THE MERCURY PROBLEM IN THE EVERGLADES MANMADE OR A NATURAL CAUSE? A. WE DON'T KNOW. MY SENSE, IT'S A -- IT COULD BE A COMBINATION OF THE TWO. WITHOUT THE HISTORICAL INFORMATION, WE JUST DON'T KNOW IF -- IF, PERHAPS, MERCURY IN BASS IN EVERGLADES NATIONAL PARK WERE ALSO -- YOU KNOW, OVER FDA ACTION LIMITS BEFORE THERE WERE PEOPLE THERE TO EAT THEM. THAT'S ENTIRELY POSSIBLE. MY GENERAL SENSE IS THAT THE MAIN VARIABLES DRIVING THESE ELEVATED CONCENTRATIONS ARE ATMOSPHERIC INPUTS OF MERCURY COMBINED WITH PARTICULAR LOCAL IMPACTS THAT ENHANCE BIOACCUMULATION. AND I THINK IT IS CLEAR THAT HUMAN ACTIVITIES HAVE ENHANCED ATMOSPHERIC CONCENTRATIONS AND ATMOSPHERIC DEPOSITION OF MERCURY ON A GLOBAL LEVEL. YOU KNOW, THAT'S CLEARLY SEEN IN MARINE WATERS IN CORES IN VERY, VERY REMOTE AREAS. YOU KNOW, IT MAKES MERCURY A VERY COMPLICATED, DIFFICULT ISSUE BECAUSE IT'S PROBABLY LARGELY NOT A POINT SOURCE ISSUE. IT'S A -- THE VOLATILITY OF DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 50 MERCURY AND ITS BIZARRE CHEMISTRY MAKES IT MUCH MORE RECALCITRANT. SO -- AND THEN, ON THE OTHER SIDE I DON'T THINK WE KNOW YET, VERY MUCH, HOW OUR SPECIFIC ACTIVITIES ARE CHANGING. YOU KNOW, GIVEN THAT -- FOR THE MOMENT THAT, SAY, THE SOURCE VARIABLE IS UNCONTROLLABLE OR WHATEVER, WE DON'T HAVE A VERY GOOD UNDERSTANDING ON HOW OUR ACTIVITIES ENHANCE BIOACCUMULATION BY CHANGES IN WHATEVER, REDOX STATUS AND SO FORTH. Q. ARE YOU FAMILIAR WITH THE HYDROLOGY OF THE FLORIDA EVERGLADES SYSTEM? A. TO AN EXTENT. AGAIN, I'VE READ A NUMBER OF THE REPORTS PERTAINING TO THIS. AND, AGAIN, HAVE SEEN MAPS SHOWING DRAINAGE CANALS AND HOW -- THE HUMAN INFLUENCE OF DRAINAGE PATTERNS. AND READ SOMETIME BACK, OUT OF JUST MY OWN INTEREST, IMPACTS OF CORPS OF ENGINEER PROJECTS, VARIOUS HUMAN ACTIVITIES ON NATURAL WATER FLOWS AND HOW -- YOU KNOW, THE ENORMOUS IMPACT, APPARENTLY, OF HUMAN ACTIVITIES ON ALTERING THE HYDROLOGY OF WATERS THAT NORMALLY FLOWED BY SHEET FLOW THROUGH THE EVERGLADES THAT ARE NOW LARGELY DIVERTED BY CANALS AND GOING BACK AND FORTH TO LAKE OKEECHOBEE, BACK AND FORTH TO COASTLINES, TO MIAMI AND SO FORTH. Q. WHAT'S YOUR GENERAL UNDERSTANDING OF THE HYDROLOGY WITHIN THE SYSTEM? DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 51 A. WELL, I GUESS MY GENERAL UNDERSTANDING OF THE HYDROLOGY IS THAT THERE'S, BY AND LARGE, A GENERAL MOVEMENT OF WATER FROM NORTH TO SOUTH FROM LAKE OKEECHOBEE SOUTH THROUGH -- TO THE EVERGLADES NATIONAL PARK; THAT, HISTORICALLY, THAT FLOW HAD BEEN LARGELY BY SHEET FLOW. THAT, IN ESSENCE, WAS THE UNDERPINNING OF THE EVERGLADES AREA. THAT NOW MUCH OF THAT WATER IS DIVERTED INTO CANALS FOR ISSUES OF AGRICULTURE, FLOOD PROTECTION, DRINKING WATER FOR MAJOR URBAN AREAS SUCH AS MIAMI, AND SO FORTH. AND THAT THE NET EFFECT IS THAT THE EVERGLADES, IN GENERAL, AND CERTAINLY THE PARK, MORE SPECIFICALLY, SEES MUCH GREATER -- PROBABLY MORE -- GREATER OSCILLATIONS IN WATER INPUTS AND, PROBABLY, IN GENERAL, LESS WATER THAN PREVIOUSLY. Q. OKAY. WHAT PERCENTAGE OF THE WATER MOVING THROUGH THE EVERGLADES MOVES THROUGH THE CANALS VERSUS SHEET FLOW? A. I DON'T KNOW. MY SENSE IS A MAJORITY. Q. A MAJORITY? A. GOING THROUGH THE CANALS VERSUS SHEET FLOW. Q. OKAY. CAN YOU DESCRIBE GENERALLY FOR ME THE PROCESS OF METHYLATION OF MERCURY? A. I GUESS AT THIS POINT IN TIME IT'S GENERALLY THOUGHT THAT IT'S PROBABLY LARGELY MICROBIAL ACTIVITY. ALTHOUGH, PEOPLE STILL DISTINGUISH BETWEEN BIOTIC AND DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 52 ABIOTIC METHYLATION. PROBABLY, THE ABIOTIC SIDE APPEARS TO BE FAR LESS ADDRESSED. BUT THERE IS A LOT OF INTEREST IN THE POTENTIAL FOR ORGANIC MATTER, SUCH AS HUMIC MATERIALS, TO ABIOTICALLY METHYLATE MERCURY, PARTICULARLY, FOR INSTANCE, WITH INTERACTION BETWEEN SUNLIGHT ENERGY AND HUMID MATERIALS. AND THAT COULD DRIVE METHYLATION. BUT STILL, THOUGH, THE BULK OF WORK IN THAT AREA IS FOCUSED ON MICROBIAL ACTIVITIES. AND RECENT STUDIES APPEAR TO INDICATE THAT SULFATE-PRODUCING BACTERIA PROBABLY PLAY A CENTRAL ROLE IN MERCURY METHYLATION AND THAT THE ACTIVITIES OF THESE MICROBES TENDS TO BE GREATEST IN SLIGHTLY ANOXIC CONDITIONS OR NEAR TO THE AEROBIC-ANAEROBIC INTERFACE. THAT'D BE A GENERAL SENSE OF IT. Q. OKAY. WHAT IS, BASICALLY, DEMETHYLATION? A. DEMETHYLATION IS ESSENTIALLY THE REVERSE OF METHYLATION IN WHICH THE -- AND, AGAIN, THIS IS, I BELIEVE, TO HAVE BEEN LARGELY THOUGHT TO BE MICROBIALLY DRIVEN AND, AS I UNDERSTAND IT, PROBABLY ABOUT THE SAME -- MANY OF THE SAME ORGANISMS THAT PERFORM METHYLATION. IN THE DEMETHYLATION PROCESS, USUALLY, UPON FOLLOWING DEMETHYLATION THE MERCURY IS FURTHER REDUCED TO ELEMENTAL MERCURY THAT CAN THEN -- WILL TYPICALLY VOLATIZE INTO THE ATMOSPHERE. AND RELATIVE -- AS I UNDERSTAND IT -- RELATIVE TO METHYLATION, DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 53 DEMETHYLATION SEEMS TO BE SOMEWHAT FAVORED UNDER MORE AEROBIC CONDITIONS. Q. WHAT DO YOU MEAN, "MORE FAVORED UNDER AEROBIC CONDITIONS"? A. WELL, THAT, IF YOU -- IF YOU LOOKED AT RELATIVE RATES OF METHYLATION AND DEMETHYLATION -- AND I THINK -- YOU KNOW, THIS, AGAIN, IS NOT WELL UNDERSTOOD AT ALL UNDERNEATH. THERE'S SOME PRELIMINARY INFORMATION OUT THERE. BUT FROM THAT LITTLE AVAILABLE INFORMATION, WHILE -- AS UNDER MORE ANOXIC CONDITIONS NET METHYLATION IS GOING TO DOMINATE, UNDER MORE AEROBIC CONDITIONS NET DEMETHYLATION IS GOING TO, PROBABLY, MORE DOMINATE. THERE'S JUST SORT OF -- YOU KNOW, AS YOU GO FROM ANAEROBIC TO AEROBIC YOU'RE GOING TO ENHANCE DEMETHYLATION. WHEREAS, AS YOU GO FROM AEROBIC TO ANAEROBIC YOU'RE GOING TO TEND TO ENHANCE METHYLATION. SO, IT'S SORT OF A TRADEOFF. Q. OKAY. ARE THOSE FOREGOING PROCESSES THE SAME IN EVERY AQUATIC ENVIRONMENT? A. I DOUBT IT. I MEAN I'M SURE THERE'S A -- YOU KNOW, THERE'S A LOT OF -- I MEAN I DON'T THINK WE REALLY KNOW. I MEAN WE A LOT OF THIS IS -- I THINK'S JUST REALLY BEEN SCRATCHED. BUT WE DON'T -- I THINK WE HAVE A REAL -- VERY POOR UNDER -- WE DON'T EVEN UNDERSTAND THE WHOLE PROCESS ENTIRELY, MUCH LESS DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 54 UNDERSTAND HOW MUCH IT MIGHT VARY ACROSS DIFFERENT SYSTEMS. BUT, LIKE MOST THINGS IN THE ENVIRONMENT AND IN ECOLOGY, THERE'S PROBABLY NOT ONE SIMPLE PROCESS OCCURRING ACROSS SYSTEMS. Q. OKAY. DO WE -- UNDER THE -- EXCUSE ME. DO WE UNDERSTAND THE BIOACCUMULATION OF METHYLMERCURY IN BIOTA -- DO WE UNDERSTAND THAT PROCESS AS IT IS OCCURRING IN THE EVERGLADES SYSTEM? A. NO, I DON'T THINK WE DO. Q. WHAT MORE WOULD WE NEED TO KNOW? A. WE -- I THINK WE NEED TO KNOW A LOT OF THINGS. WE NEED TO KNOW THE NATURE OF FOOD WEBS THAT DRIVE MERCURY BIOACCUMULATION, YOU KNOW. WE NEED TO KNOW -- WE NEED A LOT MORE INFORMATION ABOUT WHY PARTICULAR AREAS MIGHT EXHIBIT GREATER ACCUMULATIONS IN OTHER SYSTEMS AS IT -- NATURES OF FOOD WEBS. IS IT THINGS LIKE ABSORPTIVE CAPACITY, YOU KNOW, THE RELATIVE IMPORTANCE OF, IN ESSENCE, COMPETITORS, YOU KNOW, PARTICULATE MATTER THAT WILL BIND MERCURY AND SO FORTH, AS SORT OF OPPOSED TO PROCESSES LEADING TO METHYLATION AND WHAT CONTROLS THAT METHYLMERCURY ONCE IT IS METHYLATED. IT'S -- I THINK IT'S EXTREMELY COMPLEX. AND FOR ANYONE TO THINK THAT WE UNDERSTAND THAT, I GUESS I WOULDN'T BELIEVE THEM. Q. OKAY. DO YOU KNOW WHAT THE POSSIBLE SOURCES DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 55 OF MERCURY ARE IN THE EVERGLADES SYSTEM? A. WELL, THE CLEAREST TWO WOULD BE ATMOSPHERIC DEPOSITION AND -- WELL, MAYBE THREE, I GUESS, WOULD BE -- I WOULD TEND TO THINK ATMOSPHERIC DEPOSITION IS THE MAJOR ONE. IN ADDITION TO THAT, COULD BE SURFACE WATER INPUTS AND, IN ADDITION TO THAT WOULD JUST BE MERCURY THAT'S ASSOCIATED WITH THE SOILS AND SEDIMENTS OF THAT SYSTEM, BOTH AS A NATURAL PART OF THAT SYSTEM, AS WELL AS WHAT'S ACCUMULATED OVER TIME VIA THOSE OTHER SOURCES. Q. OKAY. WHAT IS THE USUAL EFFECT OF FLOODED SOILS ON MERCURY METHYLATION? A. AGAIN, I -- AS I RECALL, THAT'S -- MY SENSE OF THAT'D BE, YOU KNOW, REMINISCENT BASICALLY OF THE FLOODING EFFECT, THAT IF YOU FLOODED THAT AREA, YOU WOULD PROBABLY ENHANCE METHYLATION. Q. AND WHY IS THAT? A. I THINK FOR A LOT OF THE SAME REASONS WHEN WE TALKED ABOUT THE RESERVOIR EFFECT THAT YOU'RE DRIVING THE DECAY OF A LOT OF PLANT MATERIAL AND SO FORTH. SO, YOU'RE JUST INPUTTING A BIG SLUG OF NUTRIENTS AND ENERGY INTO THE SYSTEM. AND THERE ARE ALSO -- SO -- WHICH IS, YOU KNOW, FOSTERING BACTERIAL ACTIVITY, WHICH IS THEN GOING TO -- AND HAS -- AND IS GOING TO UPTAKE A LOT OF THE OXYGEN FOR THAT BIOLOGICAL ACTIVITY. SO, DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 56 YOU'RE GOING TO ENHANCE -- YOU'RE GOING TO PUSH THE SYSTEM TO BECOME SOMEWHAT MORE ANAEROBIC AND THE NET EFFECT OF ALL THAT WOULD BE TO ENHANCE METHYLATION. Q. ARE YOU FAMILIAR WITH THE TERM "HYDROPERIOD"? A. YES, VAGUELY. Q. WHAT IS YOUR UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT THAT MEANS? A. HYDROPERIOD WOULD -- REFERS TO THE TEMPORAL PATTERN OF FLOODING AND SO FORTH OR CHANGES IN THE WATER LEVEL WITHIN A CERTAIN SYSTEM. Q. WHAT EFFECTS DO YOU BELIEVE HYDROPERIOD HAS ON MERCURY METHYLATION AND MERCURY CYCLING IN THE EVERGLADES SYSTEM? A. WOW, I THINK THAT'S REALLY -- I DON'T THINK -- I DON'T THINK WE KNOW THAT. YOU KNOW, THE SIMPLE PREDICTION WOULD PROBABLY BE THAT, IF WE INCREASED -- I THINK IT'S -- THAT'S REALLY COMPLICATED. I MEAN, IF YOU -- IF YOU FLOOD AN AREA -- WE'VE ALREADY TALKED ABOUT THAT -- THAT WOULD BE AN IMPACT OF A HYDROPERIOD. IF WE DESICCATED AN AREA -- I MEAN ALL -- A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE SUGGESTED THAT IF YOU TAKE A NORMALLY FLOODED AREA AND DRY IT OFF, THAT YOU'RE GOING TO, AGAIN, PROBABLY ENHANCE CONDITIONS FOR OXIDATIONS THAT MIGHT ENHANCE SUBSEQUENT MOBILIZATION OF MERCURY BY, SAY, THE NEXT RAINFALL EVENT, SOMETHING LIKE THAT, THE KIND OF HYPOTHESIS OFFERED IN THE NORTH CAROLINA WORK DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 57 THAT WAS MOTIVATED BY STUDIES IN SWEDEN THAT HAD INDICATED THAT TO BE THE CASE. ON THE OTHER HAND, IF WE MAINTAIN FLOODED CONDITIONS FOR LONG PERIODS OF TIME, PERHAPS WE'LL ENHANCE METHYLATION. THERE'S EXTREMELY COMPLICATED INTERPLAY BETWEEN THINGS DRIVING METHYLATION VERSUS THOSE DRIVING BIOACCUMULATION, SO--- Q. HAVE YOU EVER BEEN TO THE FLORIDA EVERGLADES? A. YEAH, AS A VISITOR. CAN'T REMEMBER WHEN, PROBABLY SEVEN OR EIGHT YEARS AGO, JUST AS I RECALL, JUST DROVE AROUND THIS -- WAS IT TAMIAMI ROAD, WENT TO BIG CYPRESS, THAT -- BUT NOT PROFESSIONALLY. Q. WHAT DID YOU DO WHEN YOU WERE IN BIG CYPRESS? A. WENT BIRD WATCHING. I MEAN, AS I RECALL, THERE WAS A BOARDWALK. AND I WALKED AROUND ON THAT AND HAD SOME BINOCULARS AND I'VE ALWAYS BEEN KIND OF A VERY AMATEURISH BIRD WATCHER. Q. HOW LONG WERE YOU OUT THERE? A. SEVERAL HOURS, LIKE, AN AFTERNOON OR AN EVENING, AS I RECALL. Q. WHAT BIRDS DID YOU SEE? A. YOU KNOW, ACTUALLY, NOT A WHOLE LOT. MR. SAMS: YOU NEED TO PRODUCE YOUR FIELD NOTES. A. I THINK I RECALL SEEING SOME PROTHONOTARY DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 58 WARBLERS, AND SOME -- I BELIEVE I SAW SOME SNOW EGRETS AND SOME AMERICAN EGRETS. AND I THINK I SAW LOUISIANA HERON. I CAN'T -- A LOT OF KIND OF -- THAT'S KIND OF MOSTLY WHEN I WAS INTERESTED IN SOME OF THE WADING BIRDS. AND I THINK AT THE TIME OF THE YEAR THERE WERE -- I DON'T REMEMBER SEEING ANY WATER FOWL. BUT I CAN'T REMEMBER VERY CLEARLY AT ALL WHAT I SAW. THAT WAS NINE -- EIGHT YEARS AGO, PROBABLY. Q. DID YOU GO OUT INTO THE MARSH? A. WELL, THE BIG -- THE BOARDWALK, AS I RECALL, WENT THROUGH SOME MARSH, AND THEN IT ALSO WENT INTO THE CYPRESS SWAMP, SO, YEAH. I WAS -- I WASN'T IMMERSED IN THE MUCK MYSELF, BUT I WAS ON THIS LITTLE BOARDWALK THAT WENT, KIND OF, OVER IT. Q. DID YOU GO WITH A GROUP? A. NO. Q. JUST WENT BY YOURSELF? A. YES. Q. HOW'D YOU GET OUT THERE? A. WELL, AS I RECALL, I -- I DROVE TO SOME PLACE WHERE YOU PARKED. AND THEN YOU WALKED BACK A WAYS AND CAME TO THIS BOARDWALK THAT WENT THROUGH THE MARSH AND SWAMP. Q. IS THAT THE ONLY TIME THAT YOU'VE VISITED THE EVERGLADES? DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 59 A. YES. Q. HOW MANY DAYS WERE YOU OUT THERE? A. I WAS IN FLORIDA FOR TWO DAYS. AND I BASICALLY SPENT ONE OF THOSE TWO DAYS DRIVING AROUND -- JUST MOSTLY DRIVING IN THE AREA AND THEN TAKING THAT WALK THROUGH THE BOARDWALK. Q. WHAT TIME OF THE YEAR WERE YOU OUT THERE? A. THAT WAS -- I THINK IT WAS, LIKE, MARCH -- MARCH OR APRIL. IT WAS, LIKE, EARLY SPRING. Q. I'M GOING TO HAND YOU A DOCUMENT, AND ASK IF YOU CAN IDENTIFY IT FOR THE RECORD. A. THIS IS A GRANT PROPOSAL ENTITLED, "MECHANISMS REGULATING MERCURY MOBILIZATION AND TRANSPORT INTO SURFACE WATERS: NATURAL VS. AGRICULTURAL PLANT COMMUNITIES IN SOUTH FLORIDA." MR. SAMS: COUNSEL, BEFORE WE MARK THAT, I NOTICE THAT THE PRIOR -- ONE OF THE PRIOR EXHIBITS AND ALSO THIS EXHIBIT CONTAIN HIGHLIGHTING. I DON'T MIND IF YOU WISH TO USE HIGHLIGHTED COPIES TO SHOW THE WITNESS. BUT, IF WE COULD MAKE THE RECORD REFLECT THAT THE HIGHLIGHTING IS NOT HIS, I WOULD APPRECIATE IT. MS. HOGAN: OKAY. MR. SAMS: I TAKE IT THAT THE HIGHLIGHTING IS NOT HIS; IS THAT CORRECT? DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 60 MS. HOGAN: THAT IS CORRECT. BUT I CAN GIVE HIM A CLEAN COPY INSTEAD. MR. SAMS: ALL RIGHT. MS. HOGAN: I'LL GIVE YOU A CLEAN COPY. OKAY. WE'LL MARK THAT AS THE NEXT EXHIBIT TO YOUR DEPOSITION. (THEREUPON, THE DOCUMENT REFERRED TO BELOW WAS MARKED AS DEFENDANT'S EXHIBIT NUMBER 4 - DR. Di GIULIO DEPOSITION - FOR IDENTIFICATION.) Q. (BY MS. HOGAN) CAN YOU TELL ME ABOUT THIS GRANT APPLICATION? A. YES. THIS IS A GRANT APPLICATION CURT WAS -- CURT RICHARDSON WAS PRINCIPAL INVESTIGATOR ON; I'M A CO-PI ON. AS I RECALL, WE WROTE THIS PROBABLY IN LATE '91; SUBMITTED IT TO USDA, I BELIEVE. RIGHT? IT WAS NOT FUNDED. AND I THINK THE TITLE PRETTY WELL TELLS YOU WHAT IT WAS ABOUT. Q. THE MECHANISMS REGULATING MERCURY MOBILIZATION AND TRANSPORT INTO SURFACE WATERS: NATURAL VERSUS AGRICULTURAL PLANT COMMUNITIES IN FLORIDA -- SOUTH FLORIDA? A. RIGHT. Q. OKAY. YOU'VE SIGNED IT AT THE BOTTOM. A. UH-HUH (YES). DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 61 Q. RICHARD T. Di GIULIO, PI; "PI" MEANING? A. WELL, I THINK IT HAD THE USDA NOMENCLATURE. I HAVE -- INSTEAD OF PI, CO-PI, THEY HAVE PD FOR PROJECT DIRECTOR VERSUS PI FOR PRINCIPAL INVESTIGATOR. I THINK IT'S JUST THEIR NOMENCLATURE FOR WHAT IS MORE TYPICALLY CALLED PI, CO-PI. Q. SO, YOU WOULD BOTH DO THE SAME THING? A. WELL, NO. I MEAN, NO, THAT -- ALL I'M GETTING AT IS THAT DR. RICHARDSON WAS PRINCIPAL INVESTIGATOR; I WAS CO-PRINCIPAL INVESTIGATOR, JUST LIKE ON THE -- MOST GRANTING AGENCIES REQUIRE THAT ONE PERSON BE ULTIMATELY RESPONSIBLE, AND THEY'RE THE PI. BUT THEN WE'D HAVE DIFFERENT COMPONENTS. AND IN THIS CONTEXT I WAS GOING TO LARGELY DO A LOT OF THE WORK ON LOOKING AT BIOACCUMULATION AND SO FORTH. Q. OKAY. IT WAS -- IT'S DATED JANUARY 13, 1992? A. UH-HUH (YES). Q. WHAT WAS THE IMPETUS FOR THE SUBMISSION OF THE GRANT--- A. WELL, CURT WAS IN--- Q. ---APPLICATION? A. ---CURT WAS ALREADY, AT THAT TIME, INVOLVED IN THE EUTROPHIC RESEARCH THAT HE'S CONTINUING WITH. AND WE WERE BOTH AWARE THAT THERE WAS A LOT OF CONCERN ABOUT MERCURY AND SOMETHING WE BOTH HAD AN INTEREST IN. DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 62 I HAD DONE THE PREVIOUS WORK IN NORTH CAROLINA THAT SEEMED TO, YOU KNOW, KIND OF BE HIGHLY RELEVANT TO THIS STUDY. SO, WE THOUGHT IT WOULD BE AN INTERESTING STUDY TO DO AND TO TRY TO COMPARE PATTERNS OF MERCURY MOBILIZATION AND ACCUMULATION IN NATURAL WETLAND COMMUNITIES VERSUS AGRICULTURAL AREAS. AND HE WAS ALREADY, YOU KNOW, BASICALLY WITH HIS PHOSPHORUS STUDIES -- IT WOULD MAKE THE LOGISTICS OF IT MUCH EASIER BECAUSE HE ALREADY HAD SAMPLING STATIONS AND SO FORTH. SO, WE WERE TRYING TO TAKE KIND OF ADVANTAGE OF HIS ACTIVITIES, HIS ONGOING RESEARCH ACTIVITIES WITH OUR COMBINED INTEREST AND EXPERTISE IN MERCURY. Q. HOW LONG OF A -- WAS THIS STUDY TO HAVE TAKEN TO COMPLETE? A. TWO -- IT SAYS TWO YEARS, YEAH. Q. OKAY. WHAT WAS YOUR INPUT INTO THE SUBMISSION OF THIS GRANT APPLICATION? A. WELL, I HELPED WRITE IT AND HELPED FORMULATE THE HYPOTHESES. I MEAN IT WAS PRETTY MUCH A JOINT EFFORT AMONG CURT AND I, SOME GRADUATE STUDENTS AT THE TIME. I THINK WE ALL CONTRIBUTED. IT'D BE HARD FOR ME TO GO LINE-BY-LINE AND SAY WHO DID THIS OR THAT. BUT IT WAS, I'D SAY, PRETTY MUCH A REASONABLE COLLECTIVE EFFORT. CURT KNOWS FAR MORE ABOUT -- HE KNEW FAR MORE ABOUT THE SPECIFICS OF THE AREA, ABOUT THE PLANT DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 63 COMMUNITIES, THE PLANT DYNAMIC IMPACTS. I KNEW MORE ABOUT THE SPECIFICS OF MERCURY, BIOACCUMULATION, FRACTIONATION AND SOILS ANALYSIS. Q. DID YOU REVIEW THE GRANT APPLICATION PRIOR TO ITS SUBMISSION TO THE UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE? A. DID I REVIEW IT? Q. UH-HUH (YES). A. WELL, YEAH. WE READ OVER IT, SURE. Q. OKAY. A. WE WROTE IT. Q. SO, IT EXPRESSES YOUR OPINIONS? A. WELL, I DON'T SEE A GRANT PROPOSAL AS AN OPINION; IT'S A PROPOSED STUDY. YEAH, BUT I MEAN I WOULDN'T -- I'LL TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR IT, SURE. Q. OKAY. MS. HOGAN: HAVE WE ALREADY MARKED IT AS AN EXHIBIT? YES. OKAY. IT'S EXHIBIT FOUR? WITNESS: OH, YEAH, UH-HUH (YES). MS. HOGAN: OKAY. Q. (BY MS. HOGAN) CAN YOU TURN TO PAGE 3? A. 30? Q. 3. A. 3. Q. 3. DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 64 A. OKAY. Q. OKAY. IT SAYS "PROJECT SUMMARY." A. UH-HUH (YES). Q. IN PARAGRAPH TWO IT SAYS -- YOU SEE WHERE I AM? A. RIGHT. Q. OKAY. IT SAYS, "WE POSTULATE THAT AGRICULTURAL PRACTICES ARE AFFECTING THE REDOX STATUS OF THE SOILS, WHICH IN TURN AFFECTS THE UPTAKE AND RELEASE OF Hg [mercury] BY PLANTS." A. YEAH. Q. DO YOU AGREE WITH THAT STATEMENT? A. YEAH. Q. OKAY. AND THEN WHAT IS THE BASIS FOR THAT OPINION -- OR THAT STATEMENT? MR. SAMS: OBJECT TO THE FORM OF THE QUESTION. A. I'M SORRY? Q. (BY MS. HOGAN) WHAT IS THE BASIS OF THAT STATEMENT? WHY DID YOU POSTULATE THAT AGRICULTURAL PRACTICES WERE AFFECTING THE REDOX STATUS OF THE SOILS, WHICH IN TURN WOULD AFFECT THE UPTAKE AND RELEASE OF MERCURY BY PLANTS? A. WELL, THE -- A REASONABLE HYPOTHESIS -- A REASONABLE TESTABLE HYPOTHESIS WOULD BE THAT AS -- IF DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 65 YOU TOOK WETLAND SOILS AND DRAINED THEM AND CONVERTED THEM INTO AGRICULTURAL SOILS, THAT THAT WOULD ALTER REDOX CONDITIONS OF THE SOIL THAT MIGHT AFFECT MERCURY MOBILIZATION. Q. WHY? A. WELL, AS YOU -- IF YOU -- AGAIN, ALONG THE SAME LINES OF THE NORTH CAROLINA STUDY A REASONABLE HYPOTHESIS WOULD BE THAT, IF YOU TAKE SOILS THAT HAVE BEEN CONTINUALLY FLOODED AND DRY THEM OUT, THAT THAT MIGHT OXIDIZE THOSE SURFACES AND ENHANCE RELEASE OF MERCURY UPON FOLLOW -- YOU KNOW, SUBSEQUENT RAIN EVENTS AND SO FORTH. Q. OKAY. YOU MENTION SPECIFICALLY AGRICULTURAL PRACTICES; WHAT AGRICULTURAL PRACTICES WERE YOU REFERRING TO? A. WELL, I THINK THE, YOU KNOW, MAIN ONES WOULD BE -- I'M NOT A FARMER, BUT, YOU KNOW, WOULD BE TAKING A FLOODED SOIL AND MAKING IT TILLABLE BY DRAINAGE. AND THEN THE VARIOUS ACTIVITIES THAT WOULD UNCOVER -- YOU KNOW, RID THIS -- THE AREA OF NATURAL VEGETATION, WOULD EXPOSE SOILS TO DIRECT SUNLIGHT AND SO FORTH, RAINFALL, DRYING CONDITIONS. Q. WERE YOU REFERRING TO THE ADDITION OF CHEMICALS TO THE SOIL? A. NO, ACTUALLY, WE WEREN'T. WE WEREN'T AT ALL. DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 66 IN THIS STUDY WE WEREN'T ADDRESSING -- I'M TRY -- I DON'T RECALL THAT WE ADDRESSED, LIKE, FERTILIZER AT ALL. AND WE CERTAINLY WEREN'T ADDRESSING PESTICIDES. Q. OKAY. A. WE WERE REALLY INTERESTED IN ACTUALLY WHAT -- WHAT'S THE CHANGES IN SOIL CHEMICAL PROCESSES. Q. OKAY. DOWN AT THE BOTTOM, THE LAST PARAGRAPH--- A. UH-HUH (YES). Q. ---IT SAYS, "KNOWLEDGE OBTAINED FROM THESE STUDIES WILL CONTRIBUTE SIGNIFICANTLY TO OUR UNDERSTANDING OF THE BIOGEOCHEMISTRY OF Hg [mercury] IN ORGANIC SOILS AND WATER AS WELL AS PROVIDE THE AGRICULTURAL COMMUNITY KEY INFORMATION ON EFFECTIVE MANAGEMENT STRATEGIES CONCERNING WATER RESOURCES AND SOILS IN THE EVERGLADES AGRICULTURAL AREA." A. UH-HUH (YES). Q. DO YOU AGREE WITH THAT STATEMENT STILL? A. YEAH. Q. OKAY. ON THE NEXT PAGE, PAGE 4, IN THE SECOND PARAGRAPH, THE FIRST SENTENCE SAYS, "THE FLORIDA EVERGLADES ARE FACING A CRISIS." DO YOU AGREE WITH THAT STATEMENT? A. YEAH. I THINK IN THE CONTEXT OF MERCURY, THAT'S, YOU KNOW -- YEAH. DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 67 Q. AND WHY IS THAT? A. WELL, AS IT SAYS HERE, I THINK, IF YOU HAVE A MILLION ACRES OF LAND UNDER HEALTH ADVISORIES DUE TO MERCURY CONTAMINATION, I MEAN I THINK, YOU KNOW, CRISIS -- YOU CAN ARGUE HOW -- YOU KNOW, WHERE DOES A CRISIS BEGIN OR END, YOU KNOW. BUT I THINK A MILLION ACRES OF LAND -- OF AREA UNDER A HEALTH ADVISORY FOR HIGH LEVELS OF MERCURY COULD QUALIFY AS A CRISIS. Q. DO YOU THINK THAT THE CRISIS IS OVERBLOWN? A. NO. Q. WHY NOT? A. WELL, BECAUSE I THINK A HUGE AREA OF LAND THAT HAS HIGH CONCENTRATIONS OF SOMETHING AS TOXIC AS METHYLMERCURY IS NOTHING TO TAKE LIGHTLY. Q. CAN YOU TURN TO PAGE 6? IN PARAGRAPH THREE, IN THE MIDDLE OF THE PARAGRAPH--- A. UH-HUH (YES). Q. ---IT SAYS, "AGRICULTURAL PRACTICES ARE PROBABLY AFFECTING THE REDOX STATUS OF THE SOILS AS WELL AS THE UPTAKE AND RELEASE OF Hg [mercury] BY PLANTS." A. UH-HUH (YES). Q. DO YOU AGREE WITH THAT? A. YES. Q. AND ARE THE REASONS THE SAME, THAT YOU JUST DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 68 MENTIONED PREVIOUSLY? A. YES, UH-HUH (YES). Q. OKAY. ON PAGE 7 AT THE BOTTOM ARE LISTED SPECIFIC OBJECTIVES. A. HYPOTHESES. Q. I MEAN, EXCUSE ME, SPECIFIC HYPOTHESES. AND THE FIRST ONE IS THAT YOU HYPOTHESIZE THAT "THE DIFFERENCES IN SOIL REDOX STATUS FROM ANAEROBIC TO AEROBIC CONDITIONS (FLOODED VERSUS DRAINED) WILL AFFECT ALTERATIONS IN MERCURY FRACTIONS (WATER SOLUBLE, ION EXCHANGEABLE, HUMIC/FULVIC BOUND, SULFIDE BOUND, ETC.) AND [that the] CHEMICAL SPECIATION (METHYLMERCURY VS INORGANIC Hg [mercury]). THESE CHANGES IN Hg [mercury] WILL RESULT IN INCREASES IN THE SOLUBILITY AND AVAILABILITY OF Hg [mercury] TO THE WATER COLUMN." IS THAT STILL YOUR HYPOTHESIS? A. THAT -- I -- AGAIN, I THINK THAT IS -- YEAH, THAT IS CERTAINLY A REASONABLE HYPOTHESIS. Q. OKAY. THE SECOND ONE SAYS, AN ALTERNATIVE -- EXCUSE ME, "AN ALTERNATE HYPOTHESIS IS THAT Hg [mercury] SPECIATION AND AVAILABILITY IS INCREASED PRIMARILY BY MICROBIOLOGICAL MEDIATED PROCESSES OF METHYLATION IN SOILS AND WATER. WE WILL ALSO TEST FOR ABIOTIC METHYLATION. THESE PROCESSES WOULD AFFECT TRANSFERS 1 AND 2 (FIGURE 2)." AND THEN "A DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 69 SUBHYPOTHESIS IS THAT METHYLATION INCREASES UNDER AEROBIC CONDITIONS." DO YOU STILL--- A. WELL, I -- YOU KNOW--- Q. ---HOLD THAT HYPOTHESIS? A. ---I -- I WOULDN'T PUT THAT SUBHYPOTHESIS. Q. NO? A. NO. Q. OKAY. A. I MEAN, I THINK AT THAT TIME THAT OUR UNDERSTANDING FROM SOME OF THE OLDER LITERATURE WAS THAT -- IT'S HARD FOR ME TO COMPLETELY RECOLLECT THIS -- BUT I THINK WE HAD THE IMPRESSION THAT AEROBIC CONDITIONS MIGHT ENHANCE METHYLATION. TODAY, THOUGH, I DON'T HAVE THAT OPINION. SO, IF I WERE WRITING THIS TODAY, I WOULDN'T ADD THAT SUBHYPOTHESIS. Q. OKAY. YOUR THIRD HYPOTHESIS STATES, "WE HYPOTHESIZE THAT PLANT UPTAKE OF Hg [mercury] INCREASES UNDER AEROBIC SOIL CONDITIONS VERSUS ANAEROBIC SOILS. THIS POSTULATED INCREASE IN Hg [mercury] IN PLANTS COULD RESULT IN MORE AVAILABLE Hg [mercury] TO DOWNSTREAM WATERS DUE TO DECOMPOSITION OF DEAD PLANT AND SOIL MATERIAL WITH HIGHER Hg [mercury] CONTENT." DO YOU STILL AGREE WITH THAT HYPOTHESIS? A. WELL, I THINK IT--- MR. SAMS: I OBJECT TO THE--- DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 70 A. YEAH. MR. SAMS: ---FORM OF THE QUESTION. A. I AGREE THAT THAT'S A REASONABLE TESTABLE HYPOTHESIS. AND, REMEMBER, THERE'S NOT -- A TESTABLE HYPOTHESIS ISN'T SAYING I -- YOU KNOW, FRANKLY, I'D SAY IT'S TOUGH TO SAY EXACTLY WHICH DIRECTION THINGS WOULD GO IN. BUT IT CERTAINLY WOULD BE REASONABLE TO THINK THAT ANAEROBIC VERSUS AEROBIC SOILS ARE GOING TO AFFECT A PLANT UPTAKE IN MERCURY. AND AS AN HYPOTHESIS IT WOULD BE, YOU KNOW -- IN THE SCIENTIFIC METHOD WE'RE PUTTING UP HYPOTHESES TO BE TESTED. SO WE COULD PHRASE IT IN EITHER DIRECTION. AND, YOU KNOW, REAL FRANKLY, I'M NOT -- I THINK THAT'D BE A TOUGH ONE TO PREDICT. I WOULD PROBABLY PREDICT THAT AEROBIC CONDITIONS WOULD ENHANCE PLANT UPTAKE. BUT I CAN THINK OF REASONS WHY IT COULD BE WRONG. IT WOULD JUST BE SOMETHING, THOUGH, REASONABLY STRAIGHTFORWARD TO TEST. Q. OKAY. A. OKAY. Q. WHAT REASONS WHY -- WHAT REASONS WOULD IT BE WRONG? A. WELL, AGAIN, I WAS OPERATING UNDER THE MISCONCEPTION AT THIS TIME THAT METHYLATION, AS I RECALL -- I THINK I WAS, I -- OR ELSE -- I CAN'T DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 71 REMEMBER WHY WE HAD THAT SET HYPOTHESIS, BUT I THINK I HAD THE THOUGHT THAT AEROBIC CONDITIONS WOULD ENHANCE METHYLATION. AND I THINK THAT WAS BASED ON SOME OLDER LITERATURE, WHATEVER. BUT NOW I GUESS, IF YOU TAKE THE TACK THAT ANAEROBIC CONDITIONS MIGHT ENHANCE METHYLATION, AND SINCE METHYLATION IS HIGHLY BIOAVAILABLE, WELL, PERHAPS THAT COULD ENHANCE PLANT UPTAKE. SEE, I THINK IT GETS REAL COMPLICATED. I THINK IT COULD GO IN BOTH DIRECTIONS. I WOULD STILL SUSPECT THAT AEROBIC CONDITIONS WOULD TEND TO ENHANCE UPTAKE OF IONIC -- YOU KNOW, MERCURIC ION--- Q. UH-HUH (YES). A. ---BECAUSE IT'D BE -- TEND TO BE MORE BIOAVAILABLE. AND MY UNDERSTANDING IS PROBABLY THAT MOST MERCURY IN LEAFY PLANTS IS MERCURIC ION. SO, I STILL TEND TO THINK ON A MASS BALANCE THE PREDICTABLE OUTCOME MIGHT BE THAT AEROBIC CONDITIONS WOULD ENHANCE TOTAL MASS. BUT, ON THE OTHER HAND, FOR -- CERTAINLY FOR METHYLMERCURY IT MIGHT NOT BE THAT AT ALL. Q. OKAY. THEN THERE'S ALSO STATED A FOURTH HYPOTHESIS. AND IT SAYS, "AN ALTERNATIVE HYPOTHESIS IS THAT METHYLMERCURY IS MORE READILY AVAILABLE TO PLANTS THAN INORGANIC Hg [mercury] UNDER EITHER FLOODED OR UNFLOODED CONDITIONS." DO YOU STILL--- DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 72 A. WELL, NO, YEAH. I THINK THAT'S A -- I MEAN THAT HYPOTHESIS ISN'T GOING VERY FAR OUT ON A LIMB. IT'S -- IT'S JUST MORE OR LESS SAYING THAT. IF I WERE A REVIEWER, I'D PROBABLY CRITICIZE THAT HYPOTHESIS. BUT I THINK IT IS A REASONABLE HYPOTHESIS. AS I WAS SAYING, THAT METHYLMERCURY WOULD BE MORE READILY AVAILABLE. THAT'S KIND OF WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO GET AT. YOU KNOW, IN OTHER WORDS, YOU GOT THIS REAL COMPLEX THING AND THE DIFFERENCES OF PLANT UPTAKE OF INORGANIC VERSUS ORGANIC MERCURY. AND THEN WE SAY UNDER EITHER FLOODED OR UNFLOODED. BASICALLY, WE'RE JUST -- THE THOUGHT, AS I RECALL, WAS THAT WHATEVER CONDITION ENHANCED METHYLATION MIGHT ENHANCE -- BE EXPECTED TO ENHANCE UPTAKE BY PLANTS. AND IF UPTAKE OF PLANTS IS REALLY BEING DRIVEN BY METHYLMERCURY, THEN THAT WOULD OVERRIDE -- THAT MIGHT OVERRIDE WHETHER IT WERE FLOODED OR UNFLOODED, i.e., AEROBIC OR ANAEROBIC. WITNESS: NO WONDER IT DIDN'T GET FUNDED. Q. (BY MS. HOGAN) CAN YOU TURN TO PAGE 19? A. OKAY. Q. OKAY. THERE'S A PARAGRAPH ON "EXPECTED BENEFITS AND RESULTS." A. UH-HUH (YES). Q. SAYS "THE INFORMATION GAINED FROM THIS DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 73 RESEARCH WILL CONTRIBUTE SIGNIFICANTLY TO OUR UNDERSTANDING OF THE MECHANISMS CONTROLLING MERCURY CYCLING, UPTAKE AND TRANSFERS IN THE AGRICULTURAL AREAS OF THE EVERGLADES. THE IMPORTANCE OF REDOX CONDITIONS WILL HELP IN DEVELOPING WATER MANAGEMENT STRATEGIES TO PREVENT Hg [mercury] LOSSES FROM SOIL. THESE STRATEGIES CAN ONLY BE DEVELOPED WITH AN UNDERSTANDING OF THE MECHANISMS CONTROLLING Hg [mercury] BIOGEOCHEMISTRY. IT WILL BE ONE OF THE FIRST STUDIES IN PEAT SOILS AND THUS SHOULD PROVIDE SIGNIFICANT NEW INFORMATION ON THE ROLE OF ORGANIC FRACTIONS (HUMIC AND FULVICS) IN Hg [mercury] MOVEMENT AS WELL AS ADDRESS THE CURRENT CONDITIONS [sic] CONCERNING THE ROLE OF MICROORGANISMS VERSUS ABIOTIC CONVERSION OF INORGANIC Hg [mercury] TO METHYLMERCURY. AN UNDERSTANDING OF THE ENVIRONMENTAL CONDITIONS AFFECTING ADSORPTION AND DESORPTION, METHYLATION/DEMETHYLATION AND THE ROLE OF REDOX STATUS ON Hg [mercury] AVAILABILITY ARE ESSENTIAL TO OUR BEING ABLE TO ADDRESS THE QUESTION Hg [mercury] LEVELS IN THE EVERGLADES ARE DIRECTLY THE RESULT OF AGRICULTURAL ACTIVITY OR ARE PART OF THE NATURAL EVERGLADES BIOGEOCHEMISTRY. THE STATE AND FEDERAL AGENCIES, ALONG WITH THE GENERAL PUBLIC, NEED TO KNOW IF THE POSTULATED MERCURY CRISIS IN THE PEATLANDS OF SOUTH FLORIDA IS REAL. [AND] THIS STUDY IS ONE OF THE DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 74 FIRST TO ADDRESS THE MECHANISMS CONTROLLING Hg [mercury] MOVEMENT IN WETLANDS AND ITS POTENTIAL TO MOVE FROM PLANTS INTO SURFACE WATERS." DO YOU AGREE THAT THOSE WOULD BE THE -- WOULD HAVE BEEN THE BENEFITS OF YOUR STUDY? A. YEAH. I THINK IN A GENERAL SENSE -- I'M TRYING TO -- SEEMS LIKE THERE WAS ONE THAT I--- (THEREUPON, WITNESS REVIEWS DOCUMENT.) A. ---I WOULD PROBABLY REWRITE SOME OF THIS. FOR INSTANCE, THE PART ABOUT WHETHER OR -- ESSENTIAL TO OUR BEING ABLE TO ADDRESS WHETHER OR NOT MERCURY LEVELS IN THE EVERGLADES ARE DIRECTLY THE RESULT OF AGRICULTURAL ACTIVITY OR ARE PART OF THE EVERGLADES BIOCHEMISTRY [sic] -- I THINK THAT WHOLE STATEMENT OR MORE OR LESS. AND WE DIDN'T -- WE DIDN'T ADDRESS THAT AT ALL. BUT THE STUDY COMPLETELY IGNORES THE ATMOSPHERIC SIDE OF THINGS, WHICH IS PROBABLY EXTREMELY IMPORTANT. SO, I THINK THAT'S A BIT OVERSTATED. Q. OKAY. ANY OTHER CHANGES TO THE PARAGRAPH THAT YOU WOULD SUGGEST? A. NOT -- NO. Q. OKAY. AND THEN ATTACHED TO THE GRANT APPLICATION ARE CURRICULUM VITAE FROM CURTIS RICHARDSON. A. UH-HUH (YES). DR. Di GIULIO VOLUME I PAGE 75 Q. AND THEN YOUR CURRICULUM VITAE. A. UH-HUH (YES). Q. AND THEN IN THE BACK THERE'S A BUDGET FOR YEAR 1 AND YEAR 2, AND THEN A TOTAL. A. UH-HUH (YES). Q. WHAT WAS YOUR INVOLVEMENT IN THE COMPUTATION OF YOUR BUDGET FOR THIS PROJECT? A. WHAT DO YOU MEAN EXACT -- WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY WHAT WAS -- WHAT ROLE DID I HAVE IN DEVE