1 1 DIVISION OF ADMINISTRATIVE HEARINGS DEPARTMENT OF ADMINISTRATION, STATE OF FLORIDA 2 CASE NOS. 92-3038 3 92-3039 92-3040 4 SUGAR CANE GROWERS COOPERATIVE OF ) 5 FLORIDA, et. al., ) ) 6 Petitioners, ) ) 7 vs. ) ) 8 SOUTH FLORIDA WATER MANAGEMENT ) DISTRICT, ) 9 ) Respondent. ) 10 ) UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, et. al.,) 11 ) Intervenors. ) 12 13 14 99 Northeast 4th Street Miami, Florida 15 April 7, 1994 9:20 a.m. - 12:02 p.m. 16 12:54 p.m. - 4:38 p.m. 17 18 19 Deposition of Doctor Frank Jay Coale 20 21 Taken before Stan Seplin, Certified Shorthand 22 Reporter and Notary Public in and for the State of 23 Florida at Large, pursuant to Notice of Taking 24 Deposition filed in the above cause. 25 - - - - - - - JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 2 1 APPEARANCES: 2 3 ON BEHALF OF THE PETITIONERS: 4 Earl, Blank, Kavanaugh & Stotts, P.A. 5 Two South Biscayne Boulevard, Suite 3636 Miami, Florida 33131 6 BY: Jonathan Gaines, Esq. 7 ON BEHALF OF THE UNITED STATES: 8 United States Department of Justice Environmental and Natural Resources Division 9 601 Pennsylvania Avenue, N.W. Washington, D.C. 20004 10 BY: Stephen M. MacFarlane, Esq. 11 12 - - - - - - - 13 I N D E X 14 WITNESS DIRECT CROSS REDIRECT RECROSS Dr. F.J. Coale 3 -- 15 GOVERNMENT'S EXHIBITS 16 Coale Exhibit 1 - Page 4 17 Coale Exhibit 2 - Page 8 Coale Exhibit 3 - Page 36 18 Coale Exhibit 4 - Page 42 Coale Exhibit 5 - Page 47 19 Coale Exhibit 6 - Page 55 Coale Exhibits 7,8,9 - Page 91 20 Coale Exhibits 10 and 11 - Page 159 Coale Exhibit 12 - Page 168 21 Coale Exhibit 13 - Page 203 Coale Exhibit 14 - Page 228 22 23 24 25 JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 3 1 Thereupon: 2 Doctor Frank Jay Coale, 3 was called as a witness by the United States, and 4 after being first duly sworn, was examined and 5 testified under oath as follows: 6 DIRECT EXAMINATION 7 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 8 Q. State your name, please. 9 A. Frank Coale. 10 Q. Mr. Coale, would you give us your 11 address, please. 12 A. 14428 Bradshaw Drive, Silver Spring, 13 Maryland. 14 MR. GAINES: Incidently, it's Doctor 15 Coale. 16 MR. MACFARLANE: I'm sorry. I apologize. 17 THE WITNESS: I answer to both, and other 18 things. 19 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 20 Q. Doctor Coale, how are you employed? 21 A. I'm an associate professor at the 22 University of Maryland. 23 Q. Well, good mornng. My name is Steve 24 MacFarlane. I'm with the Department of Justice, and 25 one of the attorneys representing the federal JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 4 1 intervenors in the present SWIM Plan challenge, 2 which you were listed as a witness, and the purpose 3 of this deposition today is to learn what testimony 4 you plan to give at the final hearing, if there is 5 to be a final hearing, and let me just ask you, have 6 you ever been deposed before? 7 A. No, I haven't. 8 Q. You should tell me if I ask questions 9 that are unclear to you, and-- I'm sure your lawyer 10 will object if it's appropriate to do so. 11 Unless he instructs you not to answer, 12 you should-- if you possibly can, you should go 13 ahead and answer my question, if you understand it, 14 but please don't hesitate to ask me to rephrase or 15 make myself clear, if that's necessary. 16 A. All right. 17 Q. Also, if you need to take a break at any 18 time, please don't hesitate to give a holler, and 19 we'll do that. 20 A. I will. 21 MR. MACFARLANE: Mark this as an exhibit. 22 (The document referred to 23 was thereupon marked as 24 Coale Exhibit Number 25 One for Identification, JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 5 1 a copy of which is attached 2 hereto.) 3 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 4 Q. Doctor Coale, I'm handing you what's 5 been marked as Coale Exhibit One, and I'll represent 6 that this is a supplemental list of witnesses, dated 7 January 20, 1994. 8 Would you please turn to the second page 9 and look at number three (indicating). 10 A. (Witness complies.) 11 Q. Let me ask you, have you seen this done 12 before? 13 A. No, I don't believe I have. 14 Q. Doctor Coale, you're listed as a witness 15 for the Florida Sugar Cane League and United States 16 Sugar in this proceeding. 17 Do you anticipate giving testimony at 18 the final SWIM Plan challenge? 19 A. I'm not quite sure what all these 20 procedures are entitled, but from what I hear, 21 there's a hearing proposed to come up-- 22 MR. GAINES: Yes. For the record, it is 23 anticipated that Doctor Coale will provide testimony 24 at the final hearing, in areas listed on the witness 25 disclosure. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 6 1 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 2 Q. Let's look to the next page, then, page 3 three (indicating). 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. The subject matter of your expected 6 testimony is listed as agricultural BMPs and 7 alternatives. 8 Is that consistent with your 9 understanding, of the areas which you're-- I'm not 10 sure what alternatives means, but primarily, my area 11 is agricultural BMPs. 12 Q. The alternatives have been used in a 13 number of different systems in this litigation. 14 Do you intend to give testimony about 15 the agricultural BMPs-- let me rephrase it. The 16 on-farm BMPs that are listed in the SWIM Plan? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. Do you anticipate giving testimony about 19 other on-farm BMPs that are not in the SWIM Plan? 20 A. That's correct, yes. 21 Q. Do you anticipate giving testimony on 22 alternative treatment technologies, that is to say, 23 alternatives to storage water treatment areas, or 24 STAs? 25 A. No. I-- JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 7 1 MR. GAINES: There's no secret what his 2 testimony is about, but the word alternatives is a 3 little fuzzy, especially in this case. 4 He's not going to give testimony on 5 areas, such as direct filtration, chemical 6 treatment, so forth. 7 MR. BARTELL: That is what-- 8 MR. GAINES: How much, there are-- I 9 don't know if they follow the rubric of 10 alternatives, but however, some sedimentation 11 practices-- I don't know if they fall under that 12 label or not. It's not strictly on the on-farm BMP 13 plan, but just so it's clear-- 14 MR. MACFARLANE: Sure. I think I 15 understand. 16 Another one of your witnesses, John 17 David Stewart, distinguished between alternative 18 BMPs and alternative STAs. 19 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 20 Q. Doctor Coale, you would anticipate 21 giving testimony about on-farm practices to reduce 22 phosphorus; is that correct? 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. Now, I note the date of Exhibit One is 25 January 20, 1994 (indicating). JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 8 1 Doctor Coale, are you presently under 2 contract with either the Florida Sugar Cane League 3 or the law firm of Earl, Blank, Kavanaugh and 4 Stotts? 5 A. I have an agreement with Earl, Blank, 6 Kavanaugh and Stotts to serve as a consultant. 7 Q. Is that a written agreement? 8 A. Yes. 9 Q. When did you enter into that agreement? 10 A. The exact date, I can't tell you. 11 It was about mid January of this year. 12 Q. Is that with the firm of Earl, Blank? 13 A. Kavanaugh and Stotts, yes. 14 Q. Doctor Coale, have you ever done 15 consulting work for the sugar cane industry in South 16 Florida before? 17 A. No. 18 Q. But you've done research down in South 19 Florida before, on sugar cane related issues; is 20 that correct? 21 A. That's correct. 22 MR. MACFARLANE: Let's mark this as two 23 (indicating). 24 (The document referred to 25 was thereupon marked as JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 9 1 Coale Exhibit Number 2 Two for Identification, 3 a copy of which is attached 4 hereto.) 5 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 6 Q. Doctor Coale, I'm showing you what's 7 been marked as Exhibit Two. 8 Do you recognize that document 9 (indicating)? 10 A. Yes, I do. It looks like my current CV. 11 Q. I note on the first page, you indicated 12 you were an associate professor of agronomy at the 13 University of Maryland (indicating). 14 A. Yes. 15 Q. You have tenure; is that correct? 16 A. That's correct. 17 Q. And how long have you been an associate 18 professor at the University of Maryland? 19 A. Since July of '93. 20 Q. I note under your work experience, the 21 second paragraph, that you have done work at the 22 Everglades Research and Education Center at Belle 23 Glade, Florida. 24 How-- are you still affiliated with 25 EREC, as it's known? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 10 1 A. No, I'm not. 2 Q. Are you still conducting research in 3 South Florida? 4 A. No, I'm not. 5 Q. When did you stop conducting research in 6 South Florida? 7 A. I resigned from my position with the 8 University of Florida in July of '93. 9 Q. Was there any particular reason you 10 resigned from your position? 11 A. To take the new position at the 12 University of Maryland. 13 Q. Do you work out at Bellsville, at the 14 agriculture extension? 15 Is that where it's-- 16 A. No, in College Park, the University of 17 Maryland campus. 18 Q. Right. Doctor Coale, I would like you 19 to turn to-- let's see. Turn to page four 20 (indicating). 21 A. Uh-hum. 22 Q. Of your resume. It's a continuation of 23 your list of your refereed publications, and the 24 third publication down from the top, lists you as 25 author, along with and F.T. Izuno and A.B. Bottcher, JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 11 1 an article, sugar cane production impact on nitrogen 2 and phosphorus in drainage water from Everglades 3 histosols. 4 Is that currently in press? 5 A. No. That is published. 6 MR. MACFARLANE: Could we have a copy of 7 that? 8 MR. GAINES: Did we not give you a copy 9 of that one? 10 I thought that was one of the three that 11 we had sent you. 12 MR. MACFARLANE: Oh, I believe it is. 13 I'm sorry. I apologize. 14 MR. GAINES: Just for the record, we sent 15 to you three of his articles, copies of them, that I 16 think were the most germane to the subject matter of 17 this case. 18 There could possibly be other articles 19 in here that, you know, have some tangential 20 relationship, but we sent you the three, I think, 21 most-- 22 MR. MACFARLANE: I would like to ask you 23 about some of the things on his resume that he 24 hasn't produced. 25 MR. GAINES: Okay. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 12 1 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 2 Q. Let me ask you about the next article 3 down, the fourth down from the top on the same page. 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. Coale, F. J., D.B. Jones, reflood timing 6 for ratoon rice grown on Everglades histosols. 7 Has that been published yet? 8 A. No. That has not come out in print yet. 9 Q. Could you give me a brief idea of what 10 that article is about? 11 A. When you're growing rice on the 12 histosols in South Florida, a lot of-- you grow two 13 crops; you plant one and you let it grow, and let it 14 mature and harvest, and the stubble that remains is 15 referred to as ratoon, so you essentially get two 16 harvests off of one planting. 17 There's a very not well understood 18 effect of-- of course, you grow rice under a-- most 19 of the season, under a flooded condition, and at 20 harvest time, you take the water off and then you 21 come in with the combines and harvest the rice, and 22 if you are going to grow ratoon crops, you have to 23 to put the water back on to support the growth, and 24 that is the topic of that article, when to put the 25 water back on. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 13 1 Q. What was the conclusion of your article? 2 A. The conclusion was that there was a-- I 3 guess, an ideal time, you would say, if I recall, 4 having-- if I recall, it was approximately 25 or 30 5 days of drained time, before reflooding the ratoon 6 crop, which is the best treatment. 7 Q. Was the research that you did that's 8 reflected in that article, done while you were 9 associated with EREC? 10 A. EREC? 11 Q. Yes. 12 A. Yes, it was. 13 Q. Let me ask you, previously about the-- 14 it would be the sixth article down from the top, 15 Coale, Porter and Davis, soil amendments for 16 reducing phosphorus concentration of drainage water 17 from histosols. 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. Has that article been published? 20 A. No, not presently. Not yet. 21 Q. Could you give me an idea what that 22 article is about? 23 A. That was a laboratory study where we 24 collected some soil from the field, some histosol 25 organic soil from the field, and put it in columns, JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 14 1 cylinders, pipes, and we added different amendments 2 to the soil, and then we put on some high phosphorus 3 water on these columns and leached them with 4 distilled water, and measured what phosphorus 5 concentration came out the bottom of these columns. 6 Q. What were the amendments? 7 A. We had four amendment treatments. One 8 was a control, where there was no amendment, and 9 another one, dolominic lime, which is a natural 10 dolomoite product, and the third one was using 11 gypsum, and the fourth was using waste products from 12 a drinking water purification facility. 13 Q. What was that? 14 A. It was mainly calcium carbonate, what 15 the-- mainly calcium carbonate used for the 16 purification system, and an organic based polymer 17 they had, and I forget what that one was, and I'm 18 not sure what the total analysis was, but primarily 19 calcium carbonate. 20 Q. What did you conclude as a result of 21 this experiment? 22 A. Most of the treatments had no effect. 23 There was some evidence that the gypsum 24 amended soil tended to retain more phosphorus in the 25 soil and prevent it from leaching out than the other JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 15 1 amendment did, but we went to pretty great lengths 2 in the end, saying we are unsure about this. 3 There's some evidence, but it needed much more 4 study. 5 Q. Let me ask you to turn to page six of 6 your resume-- 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. Or your CV, and at the top, you have 9 identified a book chapter, which you are an author. 10 Is that correct? 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. Titled Sugar Cane Production in the 13 Everglades Agricultural Area, in a book, titled 14 water, agriculture and the environment in the 15 Everglades. 16 Has this book been published yet? 17 A. That's a very good question. 18 I don't know. It's been a long, long, 19 long drawn out process. 20 It's supposed to be coming out this 21 year, but I haven't seen it. 22 Q. When did you do the research for this 23 article? 24 A. It was just a review article. No 25 original research in there. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 16 1 It was done-- it was-- I'm guessing I 2 wrote that in about '85, '86-- no, excuse me. That 3 can't be right. 4 About '87 or '88. 5 Q. Was that article written in connection 6 with or work undertaken for the Institute of Food 7 and Agricultural Sciences for the University of 8 Florida? 9 A. Yes, there was. 10 There was an enlarged project at that 11 time, which the first part of the project 12 encompassed a literature review, and there were 13 several people involved with that, and it was 14 decided after the literature review was complete, 15 this would be a nice stand-alone publication for-- 16 and we proceeded for publication, with that in mind. 17 Q. Let me ask you to flip it to the next 18 page, page seven (indicating). 19 A. (Witness complies.) 20 Q. And you have listed a number of 21 publications in the Everglades Rice Newsletter. 22 A. Uh-hum. 23 Q. Could you tell me what research you're 24 doing on rice? 25 Is this research you're doing at the JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 17 1 present time, or is this research-- I know the dates 2 of these publications are from '88 to '91. 3 There are various volumes of the 4 Everglades Rice Newsletter. 5 Let me ask you first, are you currently 6 doing research on rice cultivation in South Florida? 7 A. No, I'm not. 8 Q. During what period of time-- well, have 9 you done research on rice cultivation in South 10 Florida? 11 A. Yes, I have. 12 Q. During what period of time? 13 A. During my whole tenure on the faculty of 14 the University of Florida, which was '86 through 15 '93. 16 Q. Was the research you did on rice 17 cultivation, focused on the Everglades agricultural 18 area? 19 A. Yes. All the work that I did, was on 20 production, practices on the organic soils, which 21 are predominantly in the EAA. 22 Q. Would this be cultivation of rice in 23 conjunction with sugar cane or vegetable 24 cultivation? 25 A. In conjunction-- I'm taking that-- it's JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 18 1 the same types of land, grown in rotation with each 2 other. 3 That's what you mean-- our studies were 4 independent. They were just rice-- our studies were 5 just rice studies. 6 Q. Would this be cultivating rice on lands 7 that were also used for sugar cane production, just 8 as part of the growing cycle for sugar cane? 9 A. Yes. Most of the rice that's produced 10 in the EAA, is in rotation with sugar cane, so 11 that's the way it works. 12 Q. Were you investigating rice cultivation, 13 as a best management practice for sugar cane? 14 A. No, not really. I just like rice as a 15 crop to work with. 16 It's-- I think it's a nice crop, has a 17 good place in that area, and there's a lot of 18 unknownds on how to grow it. 19 We were just looking at production 20 practices. 21 Q. Do you think that rice cultivation is a 22 viable BMP for reducing phosphorus in the EAA? 23 A. I think it can play a role. How 24 important, I'm not sure, but it can play a role. 25 Q. But you have never investigated for that JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 19 1 purpose? 2 A. No. 3 Q. Page 12-- 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. I want to direct your attention-- these 6 are a continuation of lists of non-refereed and 7 extension publications, printed fact sheets and 8 research reports, and I want to direct your 9 attention to the fourth article from the top, where 10 you are listed as a coauthor, I believe. 11 Is that correct? 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. A 1989 study of manganese and phosphorus 14 studies (indicating). 15 A. Uh-hum. 16 Q. Can you tell me briefly what that paper 17 was about? 18 A. I-- 19 Q. Or that report? 20 A. Let me tell you what that report is. 21 This is a field day report, and it says 12th Annual 22 Rice Field Day. 23 That grandiose title refers to about a 24 one paragraph description that was given to farmers 25 on a tour of research plots, so there's not much to JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 20 1 it. There's not much substance. 2 It essentially describes the experiment 3 in place, what the treatments were and observations 4 were that we made to date. 5 Q. What was the treatment? 6 A. Well, this study-- this is one that-- 7 one explanation-- this is little publication, if I 8 remember correctly, again, and it's a while since I 9 have seen this-- actually was describing several 10 different experiments at one stop on a tour, if you 11 would. 12 My involvement there was I have this 13 interest in root system development of different 14 crop plants, and I was looking at the effect of 15 manganese treatments as a fertilizer treatment on 16 the root system development of rice, and that was my 17 role. 18 Some of the other cooperators, like 19 George Sniden, was looking at the phosphorus 20 fertility at rest. 21 Q. You weren't focusing on phosphorus, 22 yourself? 23 A. No. 24 If I remember correctly-- a caution, 25 that I might not remember correctly, because I JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 21 1 haven't seen this since 1989-- I was looking at the 2 manganese, the effect on rice root growth. 3 Q. Did you come to any conclusion about the 4 use of manganese as a fertilizer, or-- 5 A. Well, there are several situations where 6 it's very helpful, but there's other ways to-- when 7 you get a high PH soil, that manganese becomes 8 deficient, but an easy way to correct that is to put 9 the rice crop-- flood water on the rice crop, which 10 causes reduction of the soil and liberates the 11 manganese, so you can avoid it. 12 Q. It-- 13 A. It works, but you don't need it. 14 Q. Where was the rice actually being grown, 15 that was displayed on this-- 16 A. That was at the Everglades Research and 17 Education Center. 18 Q. Was that being grown in high PH soil? 19 A. Yes. I believe the PH was about seven. 20 Q. Let me ask you about the next article 21 down from that, Phosphorus Fertilization of Rice On 22 a Low-P Histosol. 23 Is this the similar kind of report to 24 the previous article you just discussed? 25 A. Let's see. Yes, very similar. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 22 1 That was-- a two-page-- let's see. Page 2 17 and 19-- report in a growers seminar proceeding, 3 which is a very similar type of deal of-- of 4 presentation, where we invite the rice growers in, 5 and talk to them about what we have going on, and 6 give them little proceedings, and-- 7 Q. Do you remember or do you recall what 8 the point of this particular presentation was? 9 A. No, I don't, and as the priority of 10 authorship, I'm on the tail end-- I probably had 11 very little to do with it. 12 Q. Can I assume that priorty of authorship, 13 holds through most of the publications listed here 14 (indicating)? 15 A. Yes. That's true. 16 Q. Do you have any views about the use of 17 phosphorus fertilization on rice, in low phosphorus 18 histosols? 19 A. Generally, there hasn't been very good 20 response to phosphorus fertility treatments in 21 rice. 22 It's an invariable, and inconclsive. 23 The last time I looked at the 24 recommendation a couple of years ago, we weren't 25 recommending the use of phosphorus fertilizer. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 23 1 Q. Why would that be? 2 Is that because whatever phosphorus the 3 rice needs, it can get from the soil directly? 4 A. Apparently. 5 Q. Have you done any studies on phosphorus 6 uptake in rice? 7 A. Not that I can recall. 8 Q. Have you done research on that subject? 9 A. I can't say for sure, but most probably, 10 I have. 11 Q. And that would be the basis-- would that 12 be the basis of your conclusion that phosphorus 13 fertilization of rice is not recommended? 14 A. Oh, yes. 15 There are publications that say that. 16 Q. Let's move right along here to page 16 17 (indicating). 18 A. (Witness complies.) 19 Q. Doctor Coale, the two articles at the 20 top of page 16, and this is a list of abstracts, 21 incidently-- 22 A. Uh-hum. 23 Q. Concerning sugar cane variety trials 24 (indicating). 25 A. Yes. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 24 1 Q. Have you undertaken research on sugar 2 cane varieties? 3 A. Yes. The work I have done pertained to 4 doing side by side comparison of commercially 5 available varieties, and make an assessment of their 6 production potential. 7 Q. And have you done any research on the 8 development of sugar cane varieties, that are more-- 9 I'll use the term, resistant to inundation by water? 10 A. No, I haven't done any research on that. 11 Q. Are you aware of research that's being 12 done on that subject? 13 A. I have one project that I observed. 14 I didn't have any involvement in it. It 15 was Doctor Christopher Darin, a University of 16 Florida faculty member. 17 He screened a pretty large population of 18 varieties. I'm not sure of the numbers, but I'll 19 guess somewhere in the neighborhood of a hundred-- 20 to get an idea of the variation amongst this big 21 population, in tolerance, and he's a breeder, plant 22 breeder, and he's studying a heritable variation, in 23 terms of whether it was truly heritable. 24 Q. Do you recall if he came to any 25 conclusions? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 25 1 A. I believe he did. 2 Probably, at the time-- it still doesn't 3 mean a lot to me, because he had these hundred 4 varieties or so, and as I said, maybe 20 percent of 5 them produced nicely, and 80 percent of them didn't, 6 or what have you, but I think his results were that 7 it was quite a variation in productivity potential. 8 Q. Where you aware of whether this research 9 is ongoing? 10 A. I haven't spoken with him recently. I'm 11 not sure what the status is. 12 Q. Are you aware of any other research 13 that's going on regarding the development of sugar 14 cane varieties that could withstand inundation for 15 lengthier periods of time? 16 A. Other than the work that Doctor Darin 17 and-- 18 Q. Yes. 19 A. No. 20 Q. Let me direct your attention to-- let's 21 see. The fourth article from the bottom on page 16, 22 which lists you along with Doctors Izuno and 23 Bottcher on Drainage Water Quality and Phosphorus 24 and Nitrogen Utilization by Sugar Cane Grown On 25 Everglades Histosols. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 26 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. Is that article one of the produced-- on 3 one of the papers that you have produced for your 4 deposition today? 5 MR. GAINES: Which one? 6 MR. MACFARLANE: It's the fourth from the 7 bottom, John. 8 MR. GAINES: Okay. 9 THE WITNESS: That's an abstract of an 10 oral presentation. 11 Actually, it was a poster presentation 12 given at the American Society of Agronomy meeting, 13 and one paragraph type of abstract, and this is a 14 summary of-- I think the three papers that John sent 15 over to you. 16 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 17 Q. Would that be true also for the next 18 paper down, Sugar Cane, Phosphorus Water, The 19 everglades and a Pinch of Science? 20 A. Yes, same topic. 21 Q. Same topic? 22 A. Yes. 23 Q. Can you briefly summarize what the 24 conclusions were, if you can recall? 25 A. That it was-- there's a lot of JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 27 1 information packed in there. 2 We can spend some time going through all 3 the conclusions, if you would like. 4 What the conclusions of those 5 manuscripts, the three-- 6 Q. We'll get to those, then. 7 A. On page-- 8 Q. All right. On page 17, the fourth 9 abstract listed from the top, Affected Area of 10 Nutrient Acquisition for Sugar Cane Grown on 11 Everglades Histosols. 12 Do you recall that abstract? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. And what was the conclusion? 15 A. That was a study in which it was mainly 16 a research techniques type study, where we were 17 putting-- conducted fertility trials, or any trial 18 on these-- it sounds trivial, but how much bigger 19 the plots you need to use before you start getting 20 cross or contamination from one plot to the adjacent 21 plot, so we used in 15 labeled nitrogen, a 22 non-radioactive tracer to get a handle on how far 23 from-- how much sugar cane plants could acquire 24 nutrient. 25 We couldn't distinguish what was moving, JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 28 1 the nutrient in the soil, and how far the roots went 2 out to get them, but we just decided, if you have a 3 plot of sugar cane, you need to have a certain size 4 plot, and a certain buffer distance between plots, 5 before you start getting contamination between 6 plots. 7 Q. Do you recall offhand what the size of 8 that area was? 9 A. The buffer area, I believe, was two or 10 three rows, which would be 10 or 15 feet. 11 Q. Have you made recommendations or do you 12 know if recommendations have been made to the sugar 13 industry, based upon your findings in this study? 14 A. Well, we presented this, with this-- 15 this publication, and it's an abstract in the sugar 16 journal, which is an industrywide journal, so that's 17 available to them through that. 18 Q. Page 18-- 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. Right at the top there you have two 21 papers in which you're listed as a coauthor here, 22 with others? 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. First, Phosphorus Concentrations From 25 Drainage Water In Fields From the EAA, and Potential JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 29 1 BMPs. 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. Is that article-- let me ask it this 4 way: Are the conclusions in that article, 5 essentially covered in the three papers that you 6 have produced for your deposition today? 7 A. I'm-- I can't recall what the 8 conclusions of that article were, or was. 9 It depends on how many there were. 10 Q. Right. 11 A. But it's all the same group of projects, 12 so it would all be encompassed. 13 Q. The next paper down, Phosphorus 14 Concentrations in Drainage Water in the Everglades 15 Agricultural Area. 16 That's an abstract? 17 A. Yes. 18 The one above it, also. 19 Q. Do you recall what you reported in that 20 abstract? 21 A. What I believe that was, was the 22 results-- I can't say for sure. It's been a long 23 time since I have seen that, but it was the same 24 group of studies. 25 We did one collection of studies, and JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 30 1 all these presentations and publications were 2 derived from that same group of studies. 3 Q. This group of studies concerned BMPs 4 that were appropriate for sugar cane cultivation? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. Do you generally come to any conclusions 7 about which BMPs were most effective in the sugar 8 cane cultivation? 9 A. No. That really wasn't my intent in the 10 work that I did. 11 We were trying to not rank them or 12 prioritize them, the relative effectiveness of any 13 of the BMPs listed? 14 A. We were trying to compare one BMP, 15 versus a control, and trying to get some more 16 individual data on practices. 17 Q. Would it be fair to say, you were just 18 trying to find out what you worked and what you 19 didn't? 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. About midway down the page, you are 22 listed as a coauthor with D. J. Pitts. 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. D.L. Myer and J.M. Grimm, Influence of 25 Depth to Water Table on Yield of Sugar Cane Grown on JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 31 1 Sandy Soil. 2 Do you recall what you were doing on 3 that abstract? 4 A. Yes. The whole project-- I was a very 5 congenial member of that team. I didn't have a great 6 deal of involved with it, and I think the outcome of 7 that project pretty much flooped. 8 Q. What do you mean flopped? 9 A. I think-- this happens with 10 environment-- the way it was designed in the field, 11 we couldn't do what he wanted to do, and as far as 12 controlling water levels, etcetera, and therefore, 13 the data was all confounded, very difficult to make 14 a conclusion. 15 Q. Was this experiment done in connection 16 with IFAS? 17 A. Yes. It was conducted at the Southwest 18 Florida Research and Education Center over in 19 Immocolee, Florida. 20 Q. And what was the point of the 21 experiment? 22 What were you trying to find out? 23 A. The people involved Doctor Pitt, Mr. 24 Grimm and Doctor Myer, were looking at-- Doctor 25 Pitts is an ag engineer who handled irrigation, JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 32 1 drainage, water table problems, so forth, didn't 2 know anything about sugar cane. 3 My role-- set up the-- my role was to do 4 some measurment of the sugar cane production and 5 essentially let him know what his manipulation of 6 water management impact was on the sugar cane 7 production, so my role was just to document what's 8 going on with the crop. 9 Q. Do you have any understanding of why the 10 experiment flopped? 11 A. From what I understand, and this is-- 12 again, this is recollection that might be a little 13 hazy-- what I understand was that the water table 14 levels that they were able to maintain, they 15 couldn't maintain. 16 In other words, you had to find 17 treatments, and you couldn't maintain the 18 treatments, so therefore the whole thing is 19 compromised. 20 Q. Was that a pumping problem? Do you 21 recall? 22 A. I don't really recall. 23 I think it was a plot design problem, a 24 pumping problem, a plumbing problem-- I think there 25 were all kinds of things that messed it up. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 33 1 MR. GAINES: Sounds like a flop to me. 2 THE WITNESS: It was a flop, but we did 3 it. 4 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 5 Q. Do you intend to testify about 6 phosphorus loads in water discharged from the EAA 7 into the Everglades protection area? 8 A. No. 9 MR. GAINES: Well, wait a minute. 10 THE WITNESS: In the Everglades 11 protection area? 12 MR. GAINES: Do you know what he is 13 referring to by that? 14 THE WITNESS: I'm assuming you mean the 15 water conservation areas. 16 MR. MACFARLANE: I'll clarify it. 17 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 18 Q. Do you intend to offer testimony about 19 phosphorus loading in water discharged from the EAA 20 into the water conservation areas? 21 MR. GAINES: I guess I'm not 22 understanding-- maybe you guys are understanding 23 this question better than I am, but the BMP 24 testimony, it's a very central testimony, in all of 25 the BMP testimony, unless there's some more JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 34 1 technical aspects about your question I'm not 2 following. 3 MR. MACFARLANE: I guess it was a lead in 4 to the papers that Doctor Coale has produced for 5 this deposition, but I-- 6 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 7 Q. Have you actually gone out and done 8 water sampling in connection with runoff from farms 9 in the EAA? 10 A. Yes. We have done some work in that 11 area. 12 Q. Will your testimony be based on that 13 research? 14 A. Yes. 15 Q. Will it-- and that research has been 16 undertaken by you, as well as others? 17 A. Yes, in collaborating with others, at 18 times. 19 Q. And how long have you been carrying on 20 research or-- withdraw that. 21 How long have you been sampling, doing 22 the sampling of water quality in the EAA? 23 A. Yes. Well, there is a team of scientists 24 working for the University of Florida, that I was 25 part of that team, so there's-- multifaceted team JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 35 1 effort of taking-- it started, I believe, roughly 2 about 1988, and it was continued through the time I 3 left the University of Florida in 1993. 4 Q. Is it fair to see or would it be correct 5 for me to infer from what you've said about moving 6 from Florida up to Maryland-- 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. That you are no longer engaged in water 9 sampling activities in the EAA? 10 A. That's correct. 11 Q. And you stopped doing that in July of 12 '93? 13 A. Yes. 14 Probably in a practicle sense, some time 15 before that. 16 Q. Do you know if that water sampling-- if 17 the team of scientists is still conducting that 18 water sampling? 19 A. I believe some of the people are still 20 there, and some of the similar type of work is 21 continuing. 22 Q. Was that water sampling activity done in 23 connection with field tests of specific BMPs that 24 were being implemented in the EAA? 25 A. Parts of it were, yes. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 36 1 MR. MACFARLANE: Let me mark this as 2 Number Three (indicating). 3 (The document referred to 4 was thereupon marked as 5 Coale Exhibit Number 6 Three for Identification, 7 a copy of which is attached 8 hereto.) 9 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 10 Q. Doctor Coale, I have handed you Coale 11 Exhibit Number Three. 12 This is an article entitled Nutrient 13 Accumulation and Removal By Sugar Cane Grown On 14 everglades Histosols, and you are listed as an 15 author (indicating). 16 Is that correct? 17 A. That's correct. 18 Q. And, in fact, you were listed, as I 19 understand from the first page here, as the 20 corresponding author. 21 A. That's correct. 22 Q. What is the corresponding author? 23 A. That is the person responsible for 24 handling all the correspondence with editors and 25 management editors of the journals, and handle the JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 37 1 billing, for page charges, etcetera. 2 Q. How much of this article, if you can 3 recall-- how much of this article did you actually 4 write, yourself? 5 A. Virtually all of it. 6 Q. What was the work that Doctors Izuno and 7 Bottcher-- what was their input? 8 A. This was a resulting product of an 9 overall large project that was initiated to the-- of 10 Izuno and Bottcher, so they were team members. 11 Q. And the project concerned what? 12 A. It was looking at BMPs or on-farm-- 13 on-farm type, and it originally started out for 14 nitrogen and phosphorus reduction in the EAA. 15 Q. Doctor Coale, I would like to direct 16 your attention to the first paragraph (indicating). 17 A. Uh-hum. 18 Q. And just a little bit above half way 19 down that paragraph, there's a sentence that reads, 20 "Phosphorus has been determined to be the 21 biologically limiting nutrient in neighboring Lake 22 Okeechobee." 23 Do you see that sentence? 24 A. Yes, I do. 25 Q. Do you agree with that statement? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 38 1 A. Referenced with Federico in this 2 publication-- the date that he presented it, I 3 believe it was true. 4 Q. What is your understanding of the 5 phrase, biologically limiting nutrient? 6 A. In a general sense, it refers to the 7 growth of microorganisms and small macroorganisms, 8 like algae, etcetera, that-- their growth and 9 productivity is limited, because they essentially in 10 this case, have run out of phosphorus, there's not 11 enough there to support expansion of their 12 populations, and therefore, that's why-- that is why 13 phosphorus is a limiting nutrient, and you add more 14 into the system, then the population is going to 15 continue to be able to expand. 16 Q. Would it be an inference to be drawn 17 from that statement, that large amounts of 18 phosphorus would greatly expand the population of 19 those algae and other plant organisms that you were 20 mentioning? 21 A. Yes, until the point where something 22 else, other than that one element, becomes limiting. 23 Q. The next sentence down from that, 24 "Hence, the influx of P into Lake Okeechobee 25 through agriculture drainage has been proposed as a JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 39 1 contributing factor to the Lake's eutrophication." 2 MR. GAINES: I object to the form of the 3 question. 4 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 5 Q. Do you agree-- 6 MR. GAINES: I don't know if you are 7 asking him whether he agrees it has been proposed, 8 or he agrees with the proposal. 9 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 10 Q. Let's start with, do you agree it was 11 proposed as a contributing factor to the Lake's 12 eutrophication? 13 A. Yes, and I have a citation there, and 14 that was the source of that. 15 Q. And would you agree that the influx of 16 phosphorus into Lake Okeechobee, your understanding 17 of the research reflected in the citation there, was 18 a contributing factor to the Lake's accelerating 19 eutrophication? 20 A. I really can't say. 21 I really don't have any firsthand 22 experience of measuring eutrophication. 23 Q. Have you studied the eutrophication 24 process? 25 A. No, I haven't. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 40 1 Q. Let me go back to the previous sentence. 2 Do you believe that phosphorus is a 3 biologically limiting nutrient in the WCAs? 4 A. I have-- 5 MR. GAINES: You can answer. I object. 6 It's outside his area of designation of 7 his testimony, but if you have an opinion-- 8 THE WITNESS: I haven't done any studies, 9 and I really don't know. 10 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 11 Q. Let me ask you to turn to page 313 12 (indicating). 13 A. {Witness complies.) 14 Okay. 15 Q. And there's a-- I guess it's the 16 paragraph that begins on that page (indicating). 17 I would like you to look at the last two 18 sentences, "Crop P removal, was equivalent to 63 19 percent of total crop accumulation and 179 percent 20 of added fertilizer P. Apparently fertilizer P was a 21 minor contribution to the total soil pool of plant 22 available P," and that's-- as far as you are 23 concerned, that's a true statement? 24 A. Yes, it is. 25 Q. Could you explain very briefly, why JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 41 1 fertilizer P is a minor contribution to the total 2 soil pool of plant available P? 3 I assume you-- 4 A. Right. 5 Q. I'm assuming you are including sugar 6 cane. 7 A. Right. The first of those two sentences 8 you read, where we said that the crop accumulated-- 9 where I am now, crop accumulated certain amount of 10 phosphorus in the plant, and that accumulated 11 phosphorus, was equal, then, to 179 percent, or one 12 and three quarters times the amount of fertilizer 13 phosphorus that was put on the field to grow that 14 crop. 15 The efficiency of fertilizer phosphorus, 16 is not a hundred percent. You don't get it all back 17 in the crop that you put on. 18 Q. Why is that? 19 A. The chemical reaction of the phosphorus 20 fertilizer in the soil-- a lot of it becomes 21 chemically unavailable or physically unavailable for 22 the plant, and therefore, to have the plant 23 accumulate 179 percent of what you added, the-- 24 there are-- the derivation from that is, what you 25 added is a minor part of what the total available JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 42 1 amount to the crop was. 2 Q. So is the inference to be drawn-- well, 3 let me ask you, what inference would you draw from 4 that, as to where the phosphorus is coming from that 5 the sugar cane is taking up? 6 A. These organic soils, the histosols, have 7 a large background level of plant available 8 phosphorus that's there, whether you add fertilizer 9 or you don't. 10 It's a background level, and it's 11 apparently fairly substantial, and the sugar cane 12 crop can utilize that. 13 MR. MACFARLANE: Mark this as the next 14 exhibit, Four (indicating). 15 (The document referred to 16 was thereupon marked as 17 Coale Exhibit Number 18 Four for Identification, 19 a copy of which is attached 20 hereto.) A 21 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 22 Q. Doctor Coale, I have shown you Exhibit 23 Number Four. This is an article entitled Sugar Cane 24 Production Impact on Nitrogen and Phosphorus in 25 Drainage Water from an Everglades Histosol, and you JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 43 1 are listed as a coauthor with F.T. Izuno and A.B. 2 Bottcher; is that correct? 3 A. That's correct. 4 Q. Once again, Doctor Coale, did you do 5 most of the writing and the research that went into 6 this article? 7 A. Yes. I wrote this article (indicating). 8 Q. Where was the histosol that was the 9 subject of this research? 10 A. Let's see. This one was at the 11 Everglades Research and Education Center in Belle 12 Glade, Florida. 13 Q. Let me direct your attention to page 14 120, last page (indicating). 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. And at the top paragraph, it-- the third 17 sentence down, reads, "Much of the P loading in 18 drainage water may be attributed to these high 19 levels of soil P." 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. I assume you would regard that as 22 consistent with the finding of the article as it 23 exists in this Exhibit Three (indicating)? 24 A. Yes, that would be the same information. 25 Q. Continuing, "Biological oxidation of JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 44 1 soil organic matter which results in land 2 subsidence, has been identified as the primary 3 source of nutrients in drainage waters." 4 Do you agree with that statement, still 5 (indicating)? 6 A. That was reference statement from a 7 publication I have cited there in the text, on-- 8 I have no reason to believe that it's 9 not true. 10 Q. And it continues, "It has been estimated 11 that subsidence in the EAA, generates 24,800 12 milligrams phosphorus." 13 A. That's megagams. 14 Q. I apologize, megagrams of phosphorus per 15 year, or 87 kilograms of phosphorus per hectare per 16 year? 17 A. Right. 18 Q. Do you have any reason to disagree with 19 that statement? 20 A. No, I don't. 21 Q. Have you undertaken research on 22 subsidence in the EAA? 23 A. No, not directly. 24 Q. Do you anticipate giving any testimony 25 at the final hearing on subsidence? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 45 1 A. If asked, I have some opinions. 2 MR. GAINES: I think that general topic 3 of subsidence would be within his scope. 4 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 5 Q. While we're on the subject, can you tell 6 me what your opinions are with regard to subsidence? 7 A. Well, just based on the chemistry and 8 biochemistry that is going on in these organic 9 soils, the-- if-- maybe I should ask you to narrow 10 that down. 11 MR. KOBELINZKI: And maybe I should 12 object to the form. It's kind of a broad question. 13 THE WITNESS: It was kind of a huge 14 question. 15 MR. KOBELINZKI: If you could focus a 16 little more on what you're asking him. That would 17 help. 18 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 19 Q. Well, let me come at it this way: You 20 conclude here that phosphorus loading in drainage 21 water is treatable to high levels of soil 22 phosphorus. 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. While the contribution of fertilizer to 25 phosphorus, to total drainage water, was JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 46 1 undetectable. 2 I don't know-- 3 A. I was looking-- 4 Q. I'm sorry. I apologize. I don't think 5 that's what you said directly. 6 Would maintaining a high water table, 7 slow down the oxidation of soils of histosols in the 8 EAA? 9 A. Let me make sure we have the same 10 terminology going here, because-- water table, high, 11 inordinate-- 12 A. I consider a high water table being 13 closer to the surface. 14 Q. That's my understanding, as well. 15 A. A soil can only oxidize if it's in an 16 aerobic state, aerated, and if it's saturated with 17 water, it's primarily in an anaerobic state, and 18 oxidation would be reduced. 19 Q. Does it follow, maintaining high water 20 table and anerobic conditions in the soil, would 21 retard subsidence? 22 A. Yes. 23 Q. Do you have an opinion as to whether 24 subsidence will continue in the EAA on the 25 histosols? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 47 1 A. Given the way the soils are managed, 2 currently? 3 Q. Yes. 4 A. As long as these organic soils are 5 aerated, there will be some degree of subsidence. 6 Q. Do you-- would it follow from the 7 sentences we have just focused on this paragraph, 8 120, that water table management BMP, would have an 9 impact on reducing soil oxidation? 10 A. Water-- that would really depend on what 11 the water table management BMP did, what its final 12 outcome was. 13 Q. I think we'll get to that in a minute, 14 so-- 15 A. Okay. 16 (The document referred to 17 was thereupon marked as 18 Coale Exhibit Number 19 Five for Identification, 20 a copy of which is attached 21 hereto.) 22 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 23 Q. Doctor Coale, I have shown you the third 24 paper that's been produced as-- for your deposition, 25 and this is entitled, Phosphorus in Drainage Water JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 48 1 from Sugar Cane in Everglades Agriculture Areas As 2 Affected by Drainage Rate. 3 You were listed, again, as a coauthor 4 with Doctor Izuno and Bottcher; is that correct? 5 A. That's correct. 6 Q. Once again, did you write-- were you the 7 primary author of this paper? 8 A. Yes, I was. 9 Q. What-- can you just generally describe 10 for me, what it was that-- what the experiment was 11 that you were undertaking here, that's reported on 12 (indicating)? 13 A. Okay. 14 Q. These were studies involving sugar cane 15 growing on histosols. What the treatments were, with 16 simplisticly, a fast and a slow drainage rate from 17 different plots at that site, and measuring the 18 impact of these drainage rate treatments on crop 19 productivity and the water quality parameters of 20 nutrients in the water coming off those plots. 21 Q. If you can recall, and we can look at a 22 specific passage-- 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. Let me ask you generally, if you recall 25 what the conclusion of this paper was. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 49 1 A. I recall, because it was the opposite of 2 what we thought it was going to be when we started 3 out, which is enlightening sometimes. 4 I believe our general conclusion was 5 that in reference to field drainage water, as the 6 water coming comes the fields, that it was-- had 7 your least amount of-- lowest concentration, I 8 should say, of phosphorus, under the faster drainage 9 rate reatment, than under the slow. 10 Q. All right. 11 A. That was the bottom line. 12 Q. Why was that a surprise? 13 A. Well, our original hypothesis was if you 14 drained it faster, you would get more turbulent 15 flow. You would get more of an erosion type of 16 runoff drainage coming off that field, and 17 therefore, your sediment load or particulate or 18 phosphorus, would be much higher, but we didn't see 19 that. 20 Q. What was the recommendation or-- let me 21 ask you this way: Was there a recommendation that 22 came out of this paper? 23 A. Let me look, to make sure (indicating). 24 Q. The best thing to do would probably be 25 for me to point you to a particular passage JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 50 1 (indicating). 2 A. Okay. 3 Q. Let's turn to 125, at the very end 4 (indicating). 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. Almost at the very end there, there's a 7 sentence, "If, at the initiation of a drainage 8 event, main farm canal water which has relatively 9 low TP and TDP concentrations was rapidly pumped off 10 farm, a steep drainage gradient would develop 11 between the main farm canal and field water tables. 12 Further, if unobstructed field ditches that provided 13 minimal physical resistance to drainage water flow, 14 were maintained, the field drainage rate would be 15 fast. This situation would ensure field draining 16 water with relatively low TP and TDP 17 concentrations." 18 Let's stop there (indicating). 19 A. Okay. 20 Q. Is what you're recommending there, then, 21 that farmers employ a fast drain approach or fast 22 drainage approach when they pump? 23 A. I think there's a critical distinction 24 that needs to be made, and I think it's in here 25 somewhere (indicating.) JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 51 1 Yes. The same paragraph you were 2 reading, but the first couple of sentences of that 3 paragraph, I just want to make sure we are both on 4 the same page-- 5 Q. Yes. 6 A. This study is relative to field 7 drainage. Farm drainage, which is what comes out of 8 the main farm canal and into the area network 9 canals-- 10 Q. Yes. 11 A. Is a different phenomena that we need to 12 study. 13 This is referring to field drainage 14 coming out of the farm ditches, into the receiving 15 canals. 16 Under that condition, yes, we want to 17 see the water come off those fields into the main 18 farm canal as fast as possible. 19 Q. Did you make any recommendation here 20 about the duration of pumping at the fast drainage 21 rate? 22 Is that a subject-- 23 A. I don't believe we did at all. 24 Q. Let me ask you generally about the three 25 articles we just looked at briefly. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 52 1 How would you or would you use the 2 analysis in these three papers to make 3 recommendations, if you were called upon to do so, 4 for reducing phosphorus loads from the EAA into the 5 Everglades, the water conservation areas? 6 A. On these three papers, the first one we 7 looked at was a descriptive paper, was just ascribed 8 for-- when a sugar cane crop accumulated different 9 nutrients. 10 It gives you an idea what part of the 11 growth cycle and what part of the calendar year was 12 the most rapid accumulation rate of nutrients from 13 the soil water matrix the plant is grown in. 14 That gives you some idea what the plant 15 demand is when there's low plant demand and high. 16 We can use information like that if 17 you're trying to time applications of a nutrient. If 18 you make a nutrient available to the plant at the 19 point of high demand, the chances of that plant of 20 accumulating that nutrient is greater, than when 21 there's a low time, so-- which is common sense. 22 The second one, the second paper here, 23 is marked as number four-- 24 Q. Yes. 25 A. Number four is-- was essentially JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 53 1 comparing sugar cane-- growing sugar cane and fallow 2 land side by side, and looking at what the relative 3 contributions to phosphorus and nitrogen in drainage 4 water coming off those lands were, and the bottom 5 line was there was no distinguishable difference. 6 Q. Let me stop you and ask you what-- 7 A. Okay. 8 Q. Do you see an implication in that 9 conclusion, for a recommendation on agriculture BMPs 10 to reduce phosphorus? 11 A. The main-- I say it with a smile on my 12 face. The court reporter can't get that down, and 13 there's a-- 14 Q. Let the record reflect Doctor Coale is 15 smiling. 16 A. The main practical application of that 17 study was to see that if you just stop producing 18 sugar cane on these soils and let them sit idle, 19 you're going to have the same situation as far as 20 the quality of the water coming off the land, as you 21 have now with the sugar cane being grown, so if 22 they-- having vacant land is not a BMP. That was the 23 practical use of that data. 24 Q. Do you see any other conclusion as to 25 BMPs that might relate to that finding? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 54 1 I know that's awfully broad, but-- 2 A. At that time-- I-- I think that's about 3 all it says. 4 Q. What about the last one? 5 A. The third one as we just recently talked 6 about, was the drainage rate, and we can talk about 7 our conclusion, as far as-- about how you would use 8 these drainage rate differences and the data we 9 collected on the different drainage rates and how 10 that could be incorporated into farm water 11 management. 12 Q. So you say that primarily is a finding 13 that would lead to a recommendation that you or 14 someone else might make to individual farmers, as to 15 using what-- a pump BMP? 16 A. I wouldn't even call it a pump BMP, 17 because this whole study, we never used pumps. We 18 were at the whim of the commercial pump operation. 19 All it does, management of water within 20 the property. 21 It wasn't-- there were no BMPs involved 22 in it. 23 Q. Was it concerned at all with water table 24 management, or just strictly speaking, getting water 25 off the fields, let's say, during a rain event or JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 55 1 just after? 2 A. Right. The topic was strictly drainage 3 rate, getting the water off, how fast it came out. 4 Q. And was any phosphorus loss within the 5 water, strictly in relation to which the-- speed to 6 which the water was gotten off? 7 A. Right. 8 Q. I'm going to shift gears here. 9 Do you want to take a brief break? 10 MR. GAINES: Yes. Let's take two minutes. 11 (Thereupon a recess was taken 12 in the deposition, after which 13 the deposition continued as follows:) 14 MR. MACFARLANE: Back on the record. 15 Let's mark this as the next exhibit. 16 (The document referred to 17 was thereupon marked as 18 Coale Exhibit Number 19 Six for Identification, 20 a copy of which is attached 21 hereto.) 22 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 23 Q. Doctor Coale, I've just handed you a-- 24 an extract of the planning document of the 25 Everglades SWIM Plan. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 56 1 Do you recognize that (indicating)? 2 A. I have seen it. 3 Q. Have you had occasion to read the SWIM 4 Plan? 5 A. No. I have never studied it from front 6 to back. 7 I have looked at bits and pieces of it. 8 Q. Have you read the portion that I have 9 excerpted there, from-- let's see. It would be page 10 110 to 117, dealing with the regulatory-- the EAA 11 regulatory program (indicating). 12 A. Let me briefly walk through it. 13 Q. Sure. Take a look. Take your time 14 (indicating). 15 A. Part of this I recall, and other parts, 16 I don't recall having read it before. 17 Q. Let me direct your attention to page 113 18 (indicating). 19 A. (Witness complies.) 20 Q. And on page 113 is this list or 21 beginning of a list of BMPs with associated 22 phosphorus reduction ranges (indicating). 23 A. Uh-hum. 24 Q. Are you familiar with this particular 25 list of BMPs? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 57 1 A. Yes, I have seen this list. 2 Q. Let me just-- let's just go through 3 this, and let me ask you, directing your attention 4 to BMP number one, calibrated soil test 5 recommendations. 6 What is your understanding, if you have 7 one, of what that BMP is? 8 A. A calculated soil test is a tool to use 9 to give guidance to a farmer about how much 10 fertilizer is needed to be applied to a crop, to 11 achieve his maximum productivity potential. 12 Q. How does that work? 13 A. It's kind of a long, evolving process. 14 There's two phases to it, really. 15 First, the researcher must identify a 16 laboratory methodology by which they can take a 17 soil, collect it from a field, and essentially, what 18 you do in a crude nutshell, is put it in a glass and 19 shake it up with an extracting solution, and then 20 you measure the concentration of the nutrient and 21 solution that you pool off of that soil sample that 22 you are working with, and try to find, identify an 23 extracting solution that has a representative 24 extracting power from very low on soils, that 25 doesn't have a lot of nutrient that you're looking JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 58 1 to-- as opposed to extracting it from soils that 2 have a lot of nutrient in it, and so that's the 3 correlation phase, and so you have this extractant 4 that you are using with the soils, and then you 5 identify levels of extractable nutrient from a soil, 6 and you make a relationship between that soil test 7 level and crop response to the fertilizer, and from 8 that, you can say if you have a soil test, using an 9 arbitrary number, ten units, then we recommend you 10 need to put on X-number of pounds of whatever 11 nutrient you're interested in. 12 Q. Do you have an opinion as to whether 13 implementation of calibrated soil test BMP, could 14 reduce phosphorus losses from zero to 25, zero to 15 ten percent, for vegetables and sugar cane, 16 respectively? 17 A. As far as the exact ranges, I can't say. 18 They're probably in the ballpark. 19 Truly, zero is a realistic number on one 20 end, because if a grower is already doing that, it's 21 not going to do him any good to continue doing it, 22 so he has it in his base already, so it's standard 23 operating procedures, and the end number is 24 depending on how poor of a manager the farm was-- if 25 he was grossly over-applying, a soil test may give JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 59 1 him a tremendous, one, savings in fertilizer cost, 2 and two, savings in application of the nutrient, but 3 if he was a reasonable manager, maybe it wouldn't 4 help him at all. Maybe he was on target to begin 5 with. 6 Q. Have you undertaken any study of this 7 particular BMP, yourself? 8 A. I haven't done any soil test 9 calculations with sugar cane. 10 What I-- my experience is, I manage this 11 soil testing lab at the Everglades Research and 12 Education Center for a couple of years. 13 Q. So in that capacity, did you actually 14 perform soil tests? 15 A. I didn't perform them. We had 16 technicians that actually did the laboratory work, 17 but I supervised them. 18 Q. Would you-- were you called upon to 19 recommend a BMP to sugar cane growers-- would this 20 be a BMP you would recommend? 21 A. Yes. I would like to see every grower 22 use soil testing. 23 Q. Let me draw your attention to the second 24 one, "Banding fertilizer for vegetable production, 25 instead of broadcasting it could reduce P losses JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 60 1 from 10 to 40 percent, and application rates of 50 2 percent." 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. What is your understanding of this BMP? 5 A. I watched this work being done by 6 colleagues. I wasn't involved in-- and I had some 7 discussion, informal discussions with them, and I 8 heard some of the conclusions they came up with, and 9 banding fertilizer, in this case, phosphorus 10 fertilizer, looked like it was a very good 11 practice. 12 It looked like utilizing that practice, 13 you could reduce your fertilizer application rate 14 without sacrificing yield, so it looked like it was 15 a viable BMP. 16 Q. Does that conclusion you have just 17 given, or that opinion, apply to the statement-- let 18 me rephrase that. 19 Do you have an opinion whether that 20 particular BMP could reduce phosphorus losses from 21 10 to 40 percent, and application rates of 22 fertilizer in the order of 50 percent? 23 A. I'm not familiar with phosphorus loss 24 data. 25 In talking to some of the researches, JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 61 1 and some of the-- some of the people that do 2 research for some vegetable growing corporations, I 3 think that 50 percent application rate reduction is 4 realistic. It's somewhere near what they can do. 5 Q. Let's move on to the third BMP, 6 "Prevention of fertilizer spills and the direct 7 spreading of fertilizer into drainage ditches, could 8 reduce P losses by zero to 15 percent." 9 What is your understanding-- 10 A. I think it's a very good BMP that should 11 be 100 percent implemented. 12 Q. That's your opinion? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. How would you go about reducing 15 fertilizer spills, or how would a farmer go about 16 reducing fertilizer spills, if you were going to 17 recommend to him that-- 18 A. What you are primarily concerned with 19 there is the education of the labor who is involved 20 in transferring the fertilizer, either from the 21 tractor-trailer, or whatever means it's delivered to 22 the farm, into the spreader which takes it out into 23 the field. 24 An educational program aimed at those 25 individuals, telling them how important it is not to JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 62 1 spill, techniques to use not to spill-- it's very 2 simplistic, but it's just a matter of educating the 3 labor who is handling the material. 4 Q. Were you working at IFAS in connection 5 with IFAS researchers, at the time this particular 6 recommendation or recommended BMP was developed? 7 A. The answer is yes to that, but I'm not 8 sure of the exact date it was developed. 9 I was there, I think, during the 10 formulation process. 11 Q. Did you have occasion to go out to farms 12 and observe what the usual practices were on the 13 farms for handling fertilizer? 14 A. Oh, frequently. 15 Q. Would you say based upon your 16 observation, you would think this was a good BMP to 17 implement? 18 A. Very good. 19 Q. Do you have an opinion whether the 20 prevention of fertilizer spills and direct spreading 21 of fertilizer into drainage ditches, could reduce 22 those losses by zero to 15 percent? 23 A. Again, zero I think is the sound number, 24 because of some people that didn't spill any, to 25 start with, and 15 percent, I don't know what the JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 63 1 number would be. 2 Q. Number four, minimizing water table 3 fluctuations in vegetable and sugar cane fields-- 4 What is your understanding of this BMP? 5 A. My understanding is that what you're 6 trying to minimize is two things, or are two things; 7 one being the exposure to acres, again, of soil that 8 you don't necessarily have to have exposed to 9 oxygen, and therefore, have mineralization taking 10 place, and therefore having phosphorus release, and 11 you don't have to do that. You don't have to expose 12 more soil than necessary for farm management. 13 And the second thing relates back to 14 some of the drainage rate studies that we talked 15 about a little while ago, in that you want to-- 16 well, no use revisiting that, but want to get the 17 water off as fast as you can, and not-- off the 18 field, reiterate, the field-- this is field data-- 19 off the field as fast as you can, and not have the 20 zone of aeration going from the top of the soil 21 profile to the bottom of the soil profile during the 22 event. 23 Q. Is that what-- is that what is meant 24 here by fluctuations, as you understand it? 25 A. As I understand it, yes. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 64 1 Q. Do you, from your knowledge, know if 2 this particular water management BMP, I'll 3 characterize is as such-- 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. Is currently in use in the EAA? 6 A. Yes, I believe it is. 7 Q. Do you have an opinion whether it could 8 reduce phosphorus losses from zero to 50 percent? 9 A. I-- yes. I think phosphorus losses could 10 be reduced by-- by using these water management 11 BMPs, and in that range-- that's a pretty broad 12 range-- I think it would fit in there. 13 Q. Have you done research into water 14 management BMPs, yourself, as a part of the drainage 15 studies? 16 A. No. 17 MR. GAINES: I want to make sure that I 18 understand that. I think I do, but when you say has 19 he done any research, himself, you're referring to a 20 formal experimental study that he's conducted and 21 written up, rather than-- 22 MR. MACFARLANE: That's correct. 23 MR. KOBELINZKI: Rather than informal 24 research that he's looked into the-- 25 MR. MACFARLANE: That's correct. I'll JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 65 1 make that distinction. 2 THE WITNESS: That's the way I was 3 interpreting it. 4 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 5 Q. Have you reviewed other studies 6 undertaken by other people, you just following 7 along, of this water management practice? 8 A. Yes, I have. 9 Q. Can you, just off the top of your head, 10 list for me whose studies you have reviewed? 11 A. The research team at U.S. Sugar 12 Corporation has done a very extensive study in this 13 area, and they've-- I have looked at some of their 14 data, and have to admit it's quite impressive, how 15 much data they have collected. 16 Q. Can you give me approximately the time 17 frame which this data was collected? 18 A. The time frame? 19 Q. Yes, the data that you looked at. 20 A. Okay. The data that I looked at, was a 21 summary of data for the calendar year of 1993. 22 Q. Did you produce that data as part of 23 your document production? 24 Do you recall? 25 MR. GAINES: Yes, we did. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 66 1 MR. MACFARLANE: All right. 2 MR. GAINES: I hope you got it. 3 MR. MACFARLANE: I believe we did. 4 Off the record. 5 (Off the record discussion.) 6 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 7 Q. Back on the record. 8 Where has the U.S. Sugar team undertaken 9 this research, if you know? 10 A. At numerous locations throughout the 11 EAA. 12 Q. Do you know if this research was in 13 progress prior to 1993? 14 A. I don't know for sure. I don't know for 15 sure when they started it. 16 I'm trying to recall some of the data 17 sheets we looked at, what the dates were. 18 The summary sheet that I'm most familiar 19 with, was a '93 annual summary, and I don't know 20 when the whole project commenced. 21 I'm not sure about that. 22 Q. And is it your understanding that the 23 research that the U.S. Sugar team was undertaking, 24 was based upon this particular BMP, the minimizing 25 water table fluctuations? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 67 1 A. Well, I believe that was one of the 2 strong premises behind the work they were doing, 3 yes. 4 Q. And based upon that research and your-- 5 whatever other knowledge you have about that-- this 6 particular BMP, would you recommend that BMP to the 7 sugar cane industry? 8 A. Yes. It looked very good. 9 Q. Let me move to BMP number five, 10 retention of on-farm drainage (indicating). 11 What is your understanding of that BMP, 12 if you have one? 13 A. That has potential. 14 It-- the way I understand it works, is 15 that you would have the capability and the 16 infrastructure in place on the farm, to be able to 17 route water that you needed to drain off of one 18 field, because of-- because there's too much water 19 on that field, to get it to other areas on the farm, 20 or an adjacent farm, whatever, that could tolerate 21 more water at that period of time, and therefore, be 22 able to potentially move this water around your 23 system of internal drainageways on the property. 24 Q. Do you know if this BMP is currently 25 being used in the EAA? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 68 1 A. I understand that it is. 2 Q. Do you know where? 3 A. In some of my discussions with 4 individuals at the U.S. Sugar research department, 5 they indicated on some of their property, they were 6 doing this. 7 Q. Do you have an opinion, whether the 8 implementation of on-farm retention of drainage, 9 could reduce phosphorus losses from 15 to 60 10 percent? 11 A. Again, as I said before a couple of 12 times, I'm really uncomfortable with the 13 percentages, because I don't have enough information 14 at my disposal to critique them. 15 I think it could be universal, and I 16 think it would have an impact on reducing overall 17 phosphorus drainage, but the range-- again, it's a 18 very broad range, and probably a reasonable 19 ballpark, and that's a-- 15 to 60 percent, that's 20 pretty large. 21 Q. I understand. The last item, do you 22 understand that this BMP could only be used for 23 sugar production (indicating)? 24 A. I guess I'm not clear as to what-- to 25 me, that sentence is excluding other operations. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 69 1 I'm not sure what other operations there 2 are. 3 Q. Vegetable. 4 A. Oh, vegetable-- 5 Q. Could you use this BMP-- 6 A. Vegetables, from what I understand-- I'm 7 not a horticulturist, but typically vegetables have 8 a lower tolerance for too much water, and their per 9 acre value is so much higher, etcetera, if that's 10 what is meant there, then they probably wouldn't 11 want to hold water on vegetable land. Probably ruin 12 your crop. 13 Q. Except if it was fallow? 14 A. Right. 15 Q. Let's move on to BMP number six, 16 retention of vegetable field drainage water in sugar 17 cane or fallow lands. 18 Do you have an understanding of that 19 BMP? 20 A. I believe that's very similar to the one 21 before, just a more specific case of some literature 22 which has shown that phosphorus in drainage water 23 from vegetable fields, tends to be higher than from 24 sugar cane fields, and sugar cane has some tolerance 25 to more inundation by water than vegetables do, so JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 70 1 you could perhaps support some of that water-- that 2 you wanted to take off your vegetables fields, and 3 put it on the sugar cane field, without having much 4 impact on the sugar cane. 5 Q. Do you have an opinion whether 6 implementation of this practice, could reduce 7 phosphorus losses from 20 to 90 percent from any 8 particular farm? 9 A. That's even a bigger one. 10 Yes. I would say somewhere in that 11 ballpark, yes, 20 to 90 percent. 12 Q. It would be correct, that this would be 13 a BMP you would be prepeared to recommend, if it 14 were appropriate for a particular farm? 15 A. Right. If the situation was right, and 16 they had a-- all the necessary factors in place, it 17 would be a good BMP. 18 Q. What sort of situation would one need to 19 have, in order to implement these BMPs? 20 A. Well, if your operations didn't include 21 any vegetable land, it would be a moot point. This 22 BMP wouldn't be usable. 23 Q. Are there any other factors that you 24 could think of, that-- 25 A. You have to be physically able to move JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 71 1 that water from that point where you're draining it 2 off the vegetable producing area-- physically be 3 able to move it to the area where you want to put it 4 on the sugar cane or fallow land. 5 If you don't have the right connections 6 and the ditch workings, and then you wouldn't-- if 7 you could only dump it in one direction-- if you 8 need to take it north and you can only take it 9 south, then you couldn't use it. 10 Q. Number seven, aquatic cover crop for 11 off-season vegetable production and fallow rotation 12 of sugar cane, could reduce P losses from five to 13 twenty percent. 14 What is your understanding, if you have 15 one, of that particular BMP? 16 A. The only practical cover crop I could 17 think of in that situation, would be the-- would be 18 the use of rice. 19 When you harvest a rice crop, the rice 20 crop you harvest, the rough rice, as it's called 21 when it comes off the field, there is some 22 phosphorus content in the grain which is physically 23 removed, or-- I would say the last recommendation I 24 saw for rice production, was we didn't recommend any 25 phosphorus inputs, no fertilizer on that, so it JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 72 1 makes sense that if you're growing a crop that is 2 physically removing phosphorus from a field in the 3 harvested product, the grain, which is hauled away 4 in a truck, and not adding a new source of 5 phosphorus to the field, it seems like a pretty good 6 BMP for removing phosphorus from the system. 7 Q. Would the use of an aquatic cover crop, 8 like rice, affect the phosphorus production in any 9 other way? 10 A. Well, during the period when the crop 11 was-- the aquatic parts of the year when the rice 12 crop was flooded, you would be essentially 13 eliminatng soil oxidation during that period of 14 time, and therefore, you wouldn't see the 15 mineralization of soil or phosphorus, for that 16 matter, than you normally would if it was aerated. 17 Q. Am I correct in thinking this would be a 18 BMP you would recommend, again, if it were 19 appropriate to do so for a particular farm? 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. And do you have an opinion whether 22 implementation of this BMP, could reduce phosphorus 23 losses from five to twenty percent? 24 A. I haven't done the calculation about how 25 much phosphorus is removed in the grain of a rice JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 73 1 crop. 2 But to me, if you are looking at the 3 entire-- the system, which I call the water, the 4 soil, the plant, put together, that whatever is 5 removed in the grain harvest, is the net reduction 6 from the system, that has the potential to go 7 somewhere else, if you didn't take it off from the 8 grain crop. 9 Q. Assuming that you weren't fertilizing? 10 A. Right. 11 Q. Number eight, on-farm retention ponds 12 utilized to store excess rainfall for later use as 13 irrigation water. 14 Do you have an understanding of this 15 particular BMP? 16 A. I believe I understand what it means, 17 that they have retention possibility as a-- 18 physically constructed area for holding water. 19 I have not seen this in practice 20 anywhere in sugar cane production in the EAA. 21 Q. Do you have an opinion as to its 22 practicality or effectiveness as a BMP? 23 A. No, I really don't, because I haven't 24 seen it, and I haven't seen any data relating to it. 25 Q. When you say you haven't seen it, you JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 74 1 haven't seen it in action? 2 A. Right. 3 Q. So would it be correct in thinking that 4 you would not be prepared to give an opinion as to 5 whether it could reduce phosphorus losses from 10 to 6 60 percent? 7 A. That's true. 8 Q. And number nine, coordinated farm crop 9 cropping patterns. 10 Do you understand what that BMP entails, 11 as it's indicated here, BMPs four through seven? 12 A. I think it touches back on what we 13 talked before, about if a person doesn't have the 14 capacity to move his water north, and his only place 15 he could use the water or store the water, is in a 16 sugar cane field, for example, on the north side of 17 his property, not on the south, he couldn't use it. 18 If he wanted to use that BMP in the 19 future, he may need to pump in the other direction, 20 or flip-flop the cropping on these two areas, so he 21 could move from south to north, and not from north 22 to south, vice-versa, with his water movement. 23 You can use an aquatic cover crop, and 24 if you don't have the water available, you can't, so 25 those are the examples. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 75 1 I tend to think of these as coordinating 2 cropping patterns, and you have to mesh these 3 different BMPs, like I said, to give them the 4 physical ability to work on that location. It's 5 very location specific, farm by farm specific. 6 Q. Are you aware of any attempt in the EAA 7 to change the particular pattern of crops, in order 8 to maximize the effectiveness of a certain group of 9 BMPs? 10 A. I'm hesitating, because I'm trying to 11 recall if I do. 12 Q. Take your time. 13 A. I can't recall that this has been done, 14 historically. 15 Q. Do you know whether it's being done at 16 the present time? 17 A. I can't say for sure. 18 I-- that some of the BMPs are being 19 used, for example-- I mentioned before, for example, 20 that we saw-- well, we're taking about the people at 21 U.S. Sugar, they are draining water from vegetables 22 and retaining on-farm. We mentioned that earlier, 23 so that is-- that is some of these BMPs in 24 practice. 25 Maybe I should change back what I said JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 76 1 earlier, but that's one case they are being used. 2 Q. Did that particular instance involve 3 actually changing the crops that were grown on 4 adjoining fields, let's say, or adjacent fields, to 5 implement a number of these BMPs? 6 A. I don't think I can say. 7 I don't know what their original plans 8 were, and if they changed them from what the 9 original-- I don't know if they have a ten year plan 10 for what they are going to do, and they changed it, 11 whether it was going to happen on that field, 12 anyway-- I can't say. 13 Q. When did you-- if you can recall, when 14 did you discuss with the U.S. Sugar research 15 department, these particular practices? 16 A. I spent two days with them, and-- in 17 March of this year, and we covered it, a lot of-- 18 the practices that they are doing. 19 That's where I learned this information. 20 Q. Did you actually go out to the field and 21 look at what they were doing, or were you basically 22 presented with a, you know, lectures or-- 23 A. No. We spent quite a bit of time running 24 around the fields, and a lot of time around a 25 conference table looking at data and looking at JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 77 1 descriptions, plans, etcetera, so we did both. 2 Q. Let me ask you to look a little bit down 3 the page, on 114, just below BMP number nine, and-- 4 oh, before I do that, do you have an opinion as to 5 whether BMP number nine would be an effective BMP? 6 I note that a specific reduction is-- in 7 phosphorus, is not given here, but-- 8 Q. Yes. I believe it would be a 9 coordination of effort-- it is a good BMP. 10 Q. Let's move on to the next paragraph. 11 The first sentence sentence reads, "Please also note 12 that the above reductions are not cumulatve, in that 13 the effectiveness of one BMP may be significantly 14 reduced by the implementation of another BMP, or the 15 second BMP may not even be possible." 16 My question is, do you agree with that 17 statement? 18 A. Yes, I do. 19 Q. When you attended the U.S. Sugar 20 presentation in March-- 21 MR. GAINES: Object to the form. 22 Go ahead. 23 Presentation-- I don't think it was a 24 presentation. 25 BY MR. MACFARLANE: JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 78 1 Q. When you visited with the U.S. Sugar 2 research department there-- 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. Did you see evidence of multiple BMPs, 5 or more than one BMP being used on a particular 6 site? 7 A. I believe I did, yes. 8 Q. Can you recall any specifics of that? 9 A. There was one location where I believe 10 there was a block of vegetable production land, and 11 now that-- the drainage water from that vegetable 12 production land was being rerouted, instead of going 13 right into a main canal, rerouted into sugar cane 14 production level, and so that's-- that's putting 15 sugar cane, vegetable drainage water on sugar cane 16 land, and also the water within that sugar cane 17 production land that was receiving the vegetable 18 drainage water, was being rerouted, and not-- from 19 the way I understood it, not directly pumped off 20 farm, as the way it had been in the past, so there 21 was two of them put together in that instance. 22 Q. When you visited with the U.S. Sugar 23 research department in March, were you told about or 24 did you review data as to the amount of phosphorus 25 reduction in loading that could be achieved through JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 79 1 BMPs? 2 A. Yes. We went through a lot of data they 3 had, and they had done a very good job. I was quite 4 impressed. 5 We were looking at different 6 comparisons, different types of comparisons on 7 discrete plots, and then they had overall 8 comparisons, broke it down to, like, 19 different 9 comparisons at the end, and they had estimates of 10 these comparisons on what the reduction of the 11 non-BMP lands were, versus what the BMP lands were. 12 Q. When you say 19 different variations of 13 BMPs-- are these BMPs that were currently in use? 14 A. What they had done-- let me make sure 15 my-- 19 different variations-- they took, you know, 16 essentially the same data set, the data that they 17 had collected, and by looking at this parcel versus 18 this one, that was one comparison, and then they 19 said, "Let's look at this parcel versus this 20 parcel," another comparison, and some of them, 21 general, general type and some specifics, and-- 22 Q. I understand it. So-- 23 A. Can you repeat the rest of the question? 24 I kind of lost myself there. 25 Q. Well, let me try to ask it in a slightly JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 80 1 different way. 2 The different combinations or the 3 different sites that you reviewed with the U.S. 4 Sugar research department team-- 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. Were you reviewing data that had been 7 collected for particular combination of BMPs, or 8 were you looking at estimates of what could be 9 accomplished, if particular BMPs were combined in 10 the field on a particular site? 11 A. No. This was hard data they had 12 collected from BMPs that had been implemented. 13 Q. All right. And do you recall what the 14 period of time was that-- for this hard data? 15 A. Like I mentioned previously, the data 16 set that I paid most attention to was for the 17 calendar year of 1993. 18 Q. And that would be the entire calendar 19 year? Do you recall? 20 A. Yes, the entire calendar year. 21 Q. Do you recall or do you have any 22 knowledge of whether calendar year 1993, was 23 particularly wet or a rainy year in the EAA? 24 A. I don't recall. I don't recall. 25 I wasn't living in that-- but for the JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 81 1 first half of the year, in that area. 2 Q. Do you think, based upon your knowledge 3 of the agricultural BMPs, it would make a 4 difference, in terms of what the climactic-- 5 A. Yes, there's going to be a lot of 6 variation from year to year, and I think the best 7 evaluation would be to look at as long of a term 8 data set as you had available. 9 Looking at a five year data set is 10 better than one year, and one year is better than 11 one month. 12 Q. And the data set that you looked at, was 13 for one year? 14 A. Yes. 15 Q. Are you familiar with what has been 16 termed the BMP rule? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. Do you understand that-- well, let me 19 ask you what your understanding of that rule is. 20 A. That is the rule that simply-- the main 21 point I recall from reading it, is that the rule 22 states the target of a 25 percent reduction in 23 phosphorus loads from the EAA into the water 24 conservation areas, and-- areas south of the EAA, 25 and also a-- JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 82 1 Q. Right. 2 A. And also I believe-- I can't remember 3 right off exactly how it is stated, but there is 4 reference to, that this 25 percent reduction of 5 phosphorus load had to be accomplished with no more 6 than a 20 percent reduction in water flow, I 7 believe. 8 Q. Based upon your understanding of the BMP 9 rule, do you have an opinion whether a 25 percent 10 reduction in total phosphorus load discharged from 11 the EAA, could be achieved through the 12 implementation of the SWIM Plan BMPs, in combination 13 as appropriate for a particular site? 14 MR. GAINES: Let me object to the form of 15 the question. 16 Here's my reason: I think the second 17 half of the question, you said can a 25 percent 18 reduction of phosphorus be achieved through the 19 implementation of the SWIM Plan BMPs, and the first 20 part, based on your understanding of the BMP rule-- 21 I don't know-- 22 MR. MACFARLANE: I am sorry. Let me-- 23 MR. GAINES: I don't have any problems 24 with him giving his understanding of the BMP rule. 25 I should have made this statement earlier, it's a JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 83 1 legal rule, and I would object to the extent he's 2 asked to give a legal opinion, but I have no problem 3 with him answering the question. 4 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 5 Q. Based upon your understanding of the 6 SWIM Plan BMPs-- 7 A. This list of nine? 8 Q. Yes. 9 A. Okay. 10 Q. Do you have an opinion whether the 11 implementation of those BMPs in the EAA, could 12 result in a 25 percent reduction in load phosphorus, 13 from the-- 14 A. Okay. I understand now. 15 Let me tell you what my answer is based 16 on. 17 Q. Please do. 18 A. The data set that I reviewed, that was 19 researched by the U.S. Sugar research department. 20 They did a comparison of essentially 25 percent of 21 their property, which-- say, roughly 25,000 acres, I 22 think it was. 23 They maintained water management 24 practices, as pumping practices and fertilizer 25 practices, that historically had been done-- I think JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 84 1 the way they did it-- this is old time, what had 2 been done for a long time, and there's the data 3 from, I think it was 107,000 acres, we think of 4 implementing these pumping BMPs and fertilizer BMPs 5 on, and I believe I'm clear on that-- from my 6 recollection, I think that's what the numbers were. 7 And then they did some comparisons of 8 sugar cane land, which had these water management 9 BMPs and fertilizer BMPs initiated. They were in 10 place on similar land which was being managed, 11 again, the old way, without the BMPs in place, and-- 12 Q. As part of that 75 percent? 13 A. That was a subset, the 75 percent, yes. 14 There were two very similar areas that 15 were on a head to head comparison, because they were 16 very similar to management areas, because one had 17 BMPs implemented and one didn't. 18 From that data that they presented, they 19 achieved at least a 25 percent reduction, if-- I 20 have lost your original question, but-- 21 Q. Let me-- I think you may have answered a 22 somewhat different question. Let me just rephrase 23 it. 24 A. Okay. 25 Q. Based upon your understanding of these JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 85 1 particular BMPs-- and we'll get into some other BMPs 2 in a few minutes-- do you have an opinion whether 3 implementation of these BMPs could lead or would 4 lead to a result of 25 percent phosphorus load 5 reduction, as we've just described? 6 A. Based on the data I saw, what I just 7 described to you, if that was implemented all across 8 e EAA, and if it was a true representation of the 9 impact of what would take place over the rest of the 10 EAA, then these BMPs in the plan could have a 25 11 percent reduction of phosphorus, yes. 12 Q. Let me ask you, what we-- I don't think 13 we need to make this an exhibit, but I want to ask 14 you if you recognize this document (indicating). 15 A. Yes, I do. 16 MR. MACFARLANE: I'm not going to ask him 17 any detailed questions about it-- 18 MR. GAINES: Let's state for the record, 19 if we can-- this was a deposition exhibit at John 20 Bert's deposition, Exhibit 13, on April 1, 1993, and 21 it's titled final report and the effect of on-farm 22 agriculture practices in organic soils of the EAA, 23 nitrogen and phosphorus transport, at Bates number 24 0889283 through 0889593-- I'm sorry, 94. 25 MR. MACFARLANE: So noted for the JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 86 1 record. 2 MR. GAINES: I just wanted to participate 3 in some fashion here. 4 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 5 Q. Let me ask you, Doctor Coale, you're 6 listed as a contributing author on that study; are 7 you not? 8 A. Yes, I am. 9 MR. MACFARLANE: Off the record. 10 (Off the record discussion.) 11 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 12 Q. Before that brief interruption, Doctor 13 Coale, I was asking if you had been listed as a 14 contributing author on this final report, and I 15 believe you confirmed-- you confirmed that you were 16 listed as such. 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. Let me just ask you, what did you do as 19 a contributing author in producing the final report? 20 A. In producing the report, I-- virtually 21 nothing, really. 22 Some of the information and data in the 23 report is in a preliminary or raw form, the same 24 information as published in the manuscripts that we 25 went through for the last couple of hours. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 87 1 And that is my contribution to it, was 2 some of that data that I generated, that eventually 3 came out in this publication, is also in here 4 (indicating). 5 Q. Did you do any drafting or writing up of 6 the final report or parts of it? 7 A. I don't believe I wrote any of it. 8 Q. Had you contributed to the drafting-- I 9 believe my understanding is that there were previous 10 drafts to this; is that correct? 11 A. I'm not certain. 12 There were quarterly reports, project 13 reports, and then this was a final report, so if 14 those preliminary quarterly type reports were 15 considered previous drafts, it matches. 16 Q. Did you contribute to those quarterly 17 reports? 18 A. In the same manner as this. 19 Q. Basically going out and collecting data 20 or generating data? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. Have you had any-- were you formally 23 affiliated in any way with IFAS, at the time you 24 were a contributing-- 25 MR. GAINES: Did you say formerly or JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 88 1 formally? 2 MR. MACFARLANE: Formally. I'm sorry. 3 MR. KOBELINZKI: Like a tuxedo. 4 MR. MACFARLANE: Formal. 5 THE WITNESS: Yes, I was on the faculty 6 of the University of Florida. 7 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 8 Q. So it was in your capacity as a 9 University of Florida member, you were participating 10 there in-- 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. And have you had any continuing 13 relationship with IFAS, in any capacity, since you 14 left the University of Florida in 1993? 15 A. Well, it's hard to draw lines, because 16 we have professional acquaintances and friendships, 17 and there's been some contact. 18 We finished up some projects that were 19 near finished when I left. 20 For example, some of these publication 21 we went over, the Publix ace dates are after I left 22 there because just because you leave one place, you 23 don't-- doesn't mean you abandon what you have 90 24 percent finished when you leave. 25 BY MR. MACFARLANE: JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 89 1 Q. Sure. 2 A. In that case, yes. 3 MR. GAINES: It depends on where you're 4 leaving from, I guess. 5 Off the record. 6 (Off the record discussion.) 7 MR. GAINES: I have left some law firms 8 where I-- 9 THE WITNESS: Well, in the scientific 10 community, you tend to finish up everything. 11 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 12 Q. Let's move on to other BMPs that you may 13 be familiar with, and I'll ask you now, if you 14 anticipate giving any testimony on BMPs, other than 15 those we have identified in the SWIM Plan. 16 A. Uh-hum. 17 Q. Could you tell me which ones? 18 A. The ones I'm familiar with and have seen 19 data pertaining to, are mainly sediment control type 20 BMPs. 21 Q. Before we get into sediment control type 22 BMPs, do you have any-- do you anticipate giving any 23 testimony on what had been described as pump BMPs, 24 or the floor of the-- do you-- I'm not sure that I 25 know what that title refers to. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 90 1 If-- well, maybe you can explain it to 2 me. 3 Q. Well, no, I won't explain it to you, but 4 let me ask you, would you anticipate giving 5 testimony on BMPs having to do with pumping 6 practices? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. All right. 9 A. Just for our communication, I tend to 10 refer to this as water management type BMPs. 11 Q. Let me go back to some sediment control 12 type BMPs. 13 Well, you refer to this as a range of 14 BMPs? Did I understand you correctly? Did you-- for 15 the sediment control? 16 Q. Yes. 17 A. I don't recall whether I used that term 18 or not. 19 Q. Sediment control BMP, one particular 20 BMP, or a group of BMPs? 21 A. No. There's many different practices. 22 Q. Can you describe some of them for me, 23 please? 24 A. Well, I-- 25 Q. Before we get into the details, let me-- JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 91 1 what is your understanding of the general purpose of 2 a sediment control BMP? 3 A. Okay. Data has been published and 4 presented in different places somewhere in this 5 neighborhood, and this is a ballpark neighborhood of 6 half of the phosphorus that's coming off of a farm 7 or in the drainage canal system, is a particulate 8 phosphorus, and roughly is half dissolved 9 phosphorus. 10 What sediment control BMPs are aimed to 11 do, is to trap the particulate forms of phosphorus 12 that are on particulate matter, sediments, and keep 13 them from entering the drainage system. 14 So they are all targeted at the same, 15 end goal, is to keep that particulate-- action of 16 the phosphorus, from getting into the system and 17 going downstream. 18 MR. MACFARLANE: Off the record. 19 (Off the record discussion.) 20 (The documents referred to 21 were thereupon marked as 22 Coale Exhibit Numbers 23 Seven, Eight and Nine for 24 Identification, copies of 25 which are attached hereto.) JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 92 1 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 2 Q. Back on the record. 3 Doctor Coale, let me show you exhibits-- 4 what's been marked as Exhibit Number Seven, and ask 5 you if you recognize it (indicating). 6 A. Yes. I've seen this before. 7 Q. And for the record, it's titled United 8 States Sugar Corporation Best Management Practices 9 for On-farm Reduction Through Sediment Control, 10 reading upside down (indicating). 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. And would it be fair to say that this is 13 a collection of overheads, illustrating sediment 14 control practices? 15 Would that be consistent with your 16 understanding of this document, Doctor Coale? 17 A. I don't know if these were originally 18 overheads, how they were presented, in what form, 19 but it clearly could be overhead. 20 They are very concise and to the point, 21 simple, simplistic, examples of these practices. 22 Q. Have you had occasion to review this 23 document? 24 A. Yes, I looked through it. 25 Q. How did you come across or how did you JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 93 1 acquire that document, which, for the record, was 2 produced as part of your document production for 3 today's deposition? 4 A. Right. I believe I received that from 5 the-- Mr. Gaines. 6 Q. So you didn't receive this document 7 during your visit to the U.S. Sugar research team in 8 March of 1994? 9 A. No. I believe I had it prior to that. 10 Q. I would like you to take a flip through 11 there, Doctor Coale, and ask you if those sediment 12 control BMPs that were listed that are there, and 13 we'll go through some of them in detail-- were among 14 those that you were briefed on or had an opportunity 15 to observe, when you visited U.S. Sugar's facilities 16 in March of '94 (indicating). 17 MR. GAINES: Is this one Number Eight or 18 Nine? 19 MR. MACFARLANE: That's Number Eight 20 (indicating). 21 THE WITNESS: Yes. This list has-- I 22 can't see say whether this is all inclusive or 23 exclusive, but this is a similar list to the one we 24 observed and talked about previously (indicating). 25 BY MR. MACFARLANE: JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 94 1 Q. Doctor Coale, let me direct your 2 attention to page five (indicating). 3 A. Page five? 4 Q. Yes. 5 A. (Witness complies.) 6 Okay. 7 Q. And let me ask you to describe what you 8 see there (indicating). 9 A. This looks like a drawing depicting the 10 laser leveler operated in a field, to give an idea 11 how laser leveling equipment makes the soil surface 12 plat, compared to some other method, without laser. 13 Q. Is this a settlement control BMP? 14 A. Yes, I believe it could be. 15 Q. How would it work as a sediment control 16 BMP? 17 A. If you had an underlying terrain, you 18 tend to have drainage canals on the surface and rain 19 water collected on the surface, channeled through 20 the drainiage paths, and through the action of the 21 water, would carry down sediment, down to the ditch. 22 Q. That's basically erosion? 23 A. Yes. I'll agree with that. 24 Q. Do you know if laser leveling of fields 25 is being implemented in the EAAs? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 95 1 A. Laser leveling is very common in the 2 EAA. 3 Q. Has it been common for a period of time? 4 Do you know? 5 A. It's been more widely used, I believe, 6 in the vegetable industry than in the sugar cane 7 industry. 8 Q. Let me ask you just generally about this 9 document, exhibit seven. 10 Do you have any idea when this 11 particular collection of material was produced? 12 I don't see a date on there, but what is 13 your understanding, if you have one, about this 14 (indicating)? 15 A. I don't really know when this was 16 produced. 17 MR. GAINES: When you guys are talking 18 about produced, you are talking about when this 19 document was created, as opposed to to discovery? 20 MR. MACFARLANE: I apologize. I'm sorry. 21 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 22 Q. Do you understand when this was created? 23 A. I don't know when this was created. 24 Q. Do you have any idea for what purpose it 25 was created? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 96 1 A. There was a presentation given by Mr. 2 Andreis at the American Society of Agronomy 3 meetings, and-- in November of '93, which he-- I 4 didn't attend the presentation, but from talking to 5 people who were there, etcetera, some of these 6 topics were covered. 7 Whether it was prepared prior to that, I 8 can't say, but I think some of these topics were 9 talked about at that meeting. 10 Q. Let me ask-- let's move on to page 11 seven, use of cover crops to reduce wind and water 12 soil erosion. 13 Based on your understanding of the EAA, 14 is wind erosion common? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. Primarily on fallow fields or-- 17 A. They would be a prime candidate for wind 18 erosion, and, of course, when you have a field that 19 isn't fallow but just recently planted, but doesn't 20 have a standing vegetative mat there to block the 21 wind, you can have serious big broad clouds of dust 22 blown up in the air, serious wind erosion. 23 Q. So use of cover crops to reduce wind and 24 water soil erosion, is mentioned here as a sediment 25 control BMP; is that correct? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 97 1 A. Yes, it could be. 2 Q. Is it-- what cover crops would you-- 3 would be used for that purpose? 4 A. A wide variety of crops could be used. 5 Growing across-- rice crop is a cover 6 crop, even though it has other production uses, 7 also. 8 You can grow any variety of plants, 9 grass, whatever, as long as it didn't become a pest 10 and didn't interfere with your overall production 11 plans for that field. 12 Were you to use aquatic cover crops, 13 like rice, for example, there really wouldn't be 14 much difference between the use of the rice and-- 15 you would be doing the same thing, as-- 16 A. You would be doing the same thing. 17 Q. So wind and water erosion prevention, 18 would be an added benefit, correct? 19 A. An added benefit-- 20 Q. For the use of aquatic-- 21 A. Yes, alone with-- but-- 22 Q. Please continue. 23 A. Aquatic cover crops is just one example. 24 There are all types of crops you could 25 use, that wouldn't be aquatic crops, that would fall JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 98 1 into the rice crop scheme that's laid out in the BMP 2 plan. 3 Q. Have you got sort of examples of aquatic 4 and non-aquatic cover crops being used in the EAA? 5 A. No, I haven't. 6 Q. When you went out to U.S. Sugar's 7 research-- visited with the U.S. Sugar research team 8 in 1994, did you have occasion to discuss this 9 particular sediment control BMP? 10 Do you recall? 11 A. I believe we did discuss it. 12 Q. Were you shown any examples of this 13 particular BMP or told of any examples of this BMP 14 being implemented, that you recall? 15 A. I believe we did talk about it, and I 16 believe they showed me some data pertaining to it. 17 We went through a long list of 18 practices, and we looked at data being collected off 19 of a list of practices. 20 I'm not sure we-- they were all 21 representative, but I believe this one was. 22 MR. GAINES: I think that's among the 23 documents that we have produced, and it might be 24 among these three exhibits that we have just marked. 25 THE WITNESS: It may be in that Number JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 99 1 Nine there (indicating). 2 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 3 Q. I tell you what-- let's go ahead and go 4 through Numbers Eight and Nine, and see if we can 5 speed things along, and using these in conjunction 6 with each other. 7 Let me ask you, Doctor Coale, if you can 8 identify what's marked as Exhibit Number Eight 9 (indicating). 10 A. I have seen this. 11 Q. Could you tell me what it is? 12 A. What it is, is a list of data tables, of 13 data collected off of experiments evaluating 14 sediment control BMPs, versus non-BMPs. 15 Q. Did you-- do you know who produced these 16 data sheets? 17 A. Yes. I believe these data sheets were 18 produced by the university research-- sugar research 19 department. 20 Q. Did you see these sheets? 21 A. When you visited-- did you see these 22 sheets when you visited the U.S. Sugar-- 23 A. I believe we had them prior to that. 24 MR. KOBELINSKI: Just for whatever it's 25 worth, there were a series or stack of documents JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 100 1 provided to Doctor Coale, prior to his going down to 2 visit with those guys, and he may have gotten one or 3 two additional documents while he was there, and I 4 frankly couldn't tell you the-- 5 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 6 Q. I'm just trying to get an understanding 7 of the time frame which you received this document. 8 A. That was about spring of '94, I think. 9 Q. That was about a month or so ago? 10 A. I-- 11 MR. GAINES: I think most of the U.S. 12 Sugar documents that were produced to-- were 13 provided to Doctor Coale prior to his going down to 14 meet with the U.S. Sugar research people. 15 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 16 Q. To get you up to speed, what was going 17 on with-- 18 A. That would make the best use of my time. 19 Q. Did you have occasion to review these 20 documents with members of the U.S. Sugar research 21 team, while you were there? 22 A. Yes, we did. 23 Q. Now, let me just, so we've got all our 24 cards on the table here, ask you if you can identify 25 what's been marked as Exhibit Number Nine JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 101 1 (indicating). 2 A. Yes. This is very similar to the one 3 marked as Number Eight (indicating). 4 It's, again, a series of data tables, 5 looking at sediment control BMPs, versus non-BMPs. 6 Q. I note on the first page of Exhibit 7 Nine, the bottom left-hand corner, more or less, is 8 what appears to be a date, 2-24-94. 9 Do you have any understanding of the 10 significance of that date? 11 A. No. 12 Q. You don't know if that's the date which 13 these data sheets were prepared, or-- 14 A. I don't know what that date is. 15 Q. Let's see if we can go back now and 16 coordinate here. 17 We were talking about, a moment ago, 18 the-- the use of cover crops to reduce wind and soil 19 erosion. 20 I want to direct your attention, Doctor 21 Coale, to Exhibit Eight, and item five, or the sheet 22 that's numbered five at the top, and for the record, 23 you-- for the record, Exhibit Eight, the cover sheet 24 of Exhibit Eight, has what appears to be a list of 25 16 sediment control BMPs. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 102 1 Is that correct? If you look at the 2 front page, are those all sediment control BMPs? 3 A. Give me a chance to look down the list. 4 Q. Sure, take your time (indicating). 5 A. They look like they ought to be 6 construed as sediment control BMPs, and some, but 7 not all of these-- of the 16 BMPs itemized here, 8 have a check that has been-- what appears to be hand 9 entered on the left margin, and at the bottom is a 10 check, equals, data included. 11 Doctor Coale, do you have any 12 understanding of why only some sediment control BMPs 13 have data sheets here, and not the entire list of 14 16? 15 A. No. I don't know why. 16 Q. Would that-- would you think that-- is 17 it your understanding that those BMPs on this list 18 with checks next to them, are those BMPs that are 19 currently being implemented, or have been 20 implemented? 21 A. No. That's not my understanding. 22 My understanding is that from the 23 footnote, that check equals date, means that 24 included in this package that they put together 25 here, those are just the ones that have data tables JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 103 1 included in this package. 2 Q. Do you know whether those BMPs that do 3 not have checks listed next to them? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. Do you know whether there's been hard 6 data collected for those BMPs? 7 A. I don't know. 8 If the data is not presented, then 9 it's-- in this Exhibit Number Nine, I probably 10 haven't seen it. 11 Q. Okay. Fair enough. 12 Now, let's go on and talk about number 13 five, which appears, in fact, as the fourth sheet, 14 in use of cover crops to reduce wind and water soil 15 erosion. 16 MR. KOBELINSKI: Actually, I think it's 17 several pages. 18 That sheet, is either three pages-- that 19 sheet and the three pages after that, all relate to 20 that. It's not just one sheet. 21 MR. MACFARLANE: I stand corrected. Thank 22 you, counsel. 23 MR. GAINES: Just to keep things clear. 24 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 25 Q. Let me ask you what your understanding JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 104 1 is of the use of wheat as a sediment control BMP in 2 the area of cover crop, based upon your 3 understanding of sediment control BMPs and the first 4 of these papers? 5 The one that's hand lettered five at the 6 top, what is your understanding of what this data 7 sheet, for example, purports to show? 8 A. Okay. There's six enumerated pages at 9 the top, which basically gives a brief description 10 of how the data was collected and what the 11 treatments were, and then there's a table headed by 12 the heading, results, that shows sediment, pounds of 13 soil per acre per day which was collected in these 14 collection points that were set out in the field-- 15 one field had-- one treatment having no wheat cover 16 crop, and the one being a fallow field-- one with 17 the wheat cover crop, showed an average mean pounds 18 of soil collected in those areas, which presumed to 19 be collected from airborne wind erosion, airborne 20 particulates, and wheat, 24 hours per day, and for 21 the fallow field, it was 89.8, and the next column 22 over, a percent reduction of the 24 pounds from 23 the-- it was a 73.2 reduction in the air 24 transported, I guess you call it, sediments, across 25 these fields. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 105 1 Q. Let me ask you, did you actually go out 2 and visit or go to the site where this experiment or 3 this activity was underway? 4 A. No. 5 Q. So you don't know, do you, where the 6 sampling pans were placed in each wheat field or in 7 the fallow field? 8 A. No, I don't. 9 Q. If you were going to design an 10 experiment or a test to evaluate the use of this 11 particular cover crop, would you design it in this 12 way, having six sampling pans in the control field 13 and in the wheat field? 14 A. I-- it's not a bad procedure. 15 It's-- I have to be careful here, by-- 16 what I think as an academic scientist-- we try to do 17 everything very strictly by the book, if you will, 18 and very rigorously, and other researchers who have 19 like, missions, say, other than academic, may have a 20 different procedure that they will follow, okay? 21 And sometimes they-- they find 22 conclusions maybe the same, and sometimes not. 23 If I was to set this up from my academic 24 background, academic status, I-- six sampling sites 25 within a field is good. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 106 1 I would have done several tests, each 2 treatment over a time period-- I would have made 3 this a huge study, which time and resources may not 4 have been available to look at this. 5 Q. Well, let me ask you, line five on this 6 page, reads "After seven days, the pans were 7 collected for other dry soil determinations." 8 From your perspective as an academic 9 scientist and researcher, would you regard seven 10 days as a sufficiently long period of time to 11 collect samples for analyses on a-- 12 A. It very well could be, depending on the 13 weather patterns, if there is-- a seven day period 14 of time, done five times during the year, may have 15 be a better sample, or may not have been. 16 Q. Do you know if these results are based 17 on more than one seven day observation period? 18 A. I don't recall, and in riding over this 19 brief outline, it doesn't say. 20 I don't recall. I don't know. 21 Q. Let's go and look at the table here 22 (indicating). 23 A. Okay. 24 Q. The table gives mean pounds soil per 25 acre per day, forever wheat, as 24 pounds. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 107 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. With a mean reduction of 83.2. 3 How do you interpret that mean 4 reduction? 5 Mean reduction from what? Let's put it 6 that way. 7 A. I interpret that to be the mean 8 reduction in the amount of soil moved by wind, of-- 9 of what's collected in the wheat field, versus what 10 was collected in the fallow field. 11 Q. Do you know if these fields were 12 adjoining fields? 13 A. I don't know. 14 Q. Doctor Coale, are you-- are you 15 familiar-- let me put it this way: Do you understand 16 the weather patterns in the EAA or throughout the 17 Everglades area, to be highly variable? 18 A. Yes, highly variable. 19 Q. Would it make a difference whether you 20 had fields that were in an area such as this-- 21 fields that were widely separated, or that had 22 joined one and another, in order to test the 23 erosion? 24 A. Yes. You would want them close together, 25 regardless of what assessment you are doing or what JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 108 1 I are trying to show. 2 I want to make all the factors as equal 3 as possible, so knowing that there's a difference in 4 climactic conditions across the EAA, you would want 5 to elimiate that, but most of these go-- 6 Q. Do you understand the assumption from 7 this table, to be that the 27.2 percent mean 8 reduction given here, is 73.2 percent of the 89.8 9 pounds soil per acre per day, for the fallow field? 10 A. Yes. As I understand it, without 11 punching up the numbers and calculating the 12 difference between those two numbers, is-- there's a 13 73.2 percent reduction. 14 MR. MACFARLANE: Off the record. 15 (Thereupon a lunch recess was 16 taken in the deposition, after which 17 the deposition continued as follows:) 18 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 19 Q. Back on the record. 20 Good afternoon, Doctor Coale. 21 What I think I would like to do is focus 22 on Exhibit Eight, I believe, and-- 23 MR. GAINES: Okay. 24 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 25 Q. And not trying to keep all these things JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 109 1 juggling in the air at the same time. 2 I have one last question to ask you or I 3 have some questions to ask you about the data sheet 4 we were looking at before we broke for lunch. 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. This is the first of the data sheets 7 marked five at the top. 8 It pertains to the mean percentage 9 reduction figure of 73.2 percent that is given in 10 the table. 11 That is a mean reduction in soil; is 12 that correct? 13 A. That's mean reduction in the amount of 14 soil collected in those pans, the way I understand 15 it. 16 Q. That is the custom it follows, then, 17 that 73.2 percent figure is not a mean reduction in 18 particulates or any other kind of phosphorus? 19 A. No. I don't think it is. 20 It's a pound of soil. 21 Q. Do you know whether that soil was ever 22 tested for phosphorus? 23 A. I don't know. 24 Q. Let's go on. 25 As long as we're talking about cover JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 110 1 crops, let's go on to the next data sheet in the 2 set. 3 This titled Cover Crops to Reduce Soil 4 Entering Canals, Sorghum Sudan. 5 What's sorghum sudan? 6 A. It's a species of grass. 7 Q. Did you have occasion to discuss this 8 particular data sheet when you were out at U.S. 9 Sugar in March of 1993? 10 A. I believe we did. 11 Q. Can you describe for me what the 12 experiment was that-- or the tests that this data 13 sheet reflects? 14 A. I believe this was a very similar one to 15 the wheat study that preceded it. 16 I'm reading through the details that are 17 numbers, one, two, three, four, to see what 18 differences there were. 19 I-- it looks like it was similar 20 (indicating). 21 Q. Let me ask you, under the numbered 22 paragraph two-- 23 A. Uh-hum. 24 Q. The last sentences, two sites per field 25 were done two times, but further study was stopped JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 111 1 due to the rain. 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. Do you know when these two sites per 4 field were done? 5 A. Well, let's see. The sorghum was planted 6 June 23, 1992, and the sorghum was 12 to 18 inches 7 high. 8 I don't have the growth set for sorghum 9 in my brain, but 12, 18 inches-- I would say the 10 summer of 1991. 11 Q. Do you think-- do you know if the 12 experiment was continued after the indication here, 13 that it had been stopped because of rain? 14 A. I don't know. 15 Q. In paragraph four, it states, "Samples 16 were collected and processed twice." 17 What would it prove to process the 18 samples twice? 19 A. The way it's phrased, it was a little 20 ambiguous. It can mean one of two things, the way I 21 read it, is that three samples were collected and 22 then analyzed, two controls, a replicate analysis, 23 so there were two entirely separate sets of samples 24 collected, and each of those were sampled ones. 25 Q. And the table indicates a mean reduction JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 112 1 of 35 percent in terms of pounds per soil acre per 2 day; is that correct? 3 A. That's what it looks like, yes. 4 Q. And again, you-- do you know whether the 5 soil was tested for phosphorus? 6 A. I don't know. 7 Q. At the bottom it indicates, just below 8 the table, that-- it reads, sampled over a ten day 9 period. 10 Do you have any indication what time of 11 the year that ten days happened to be? 12 A. Well, presumably from your previous 13 question, I thought-- the study was probably done in 14 the summer of '92, so ten day period, sometime-- the 15 sorghum was planted June 23rd, and given time for 16 sorghum to grow 12 to 18 inches, so it was, like, 17 late July. 18 I'm just speculating. 19 Q. That's speculation on your part? 20 A. Yes. I would have to say-- 21 Q. If you were designing an experiment to 22 use this particular variety of sorghum as a cover 23 crop to reduce sediment-- 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. Erosion, would you think that a sampling JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 113 1 period of ten days would be sufficient to yield 2 results that you would have some confidence in? 3 MR. GAINES: Object to the form. 4 MR. MACFARLANE: You can go ahead and 5 answer. 6 THE WITNESS: Okay. It-- 7 MR. GAINES: Go ahead. I was going to 8 tell you what my objection was, but I won't, if you 9 don't care. 10 MR. GAINES: You can go ahead and tell 11 the-- when you say if you were to design an 12 experiment, I don't know if you're talking about an 13 experiment of unlimited resources and interest-- the 14 ultimate experiment-- I don't think you have given 15 him enough of the parameters to-- 16 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 17 Q. If you were designing an experiment to 18 test the reliability of this particular form of 19 cover crop-- 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. Given the kinds of constraints you 22 underwent up at the University of Florida-- 23 A. Okay. 24 Q. Would you be satisfied with a sample 25 over a ten day period? Would that be sufficient, in JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 114 1 your point of view? 2 A. If I was to do these in my role as an 3 academic researcher, it would have been a better 4 experiment, and-- incorporating more factors and 5 looking at more factors than are in here. 6 For example, this ten day period, it 7 would have been reasonable to-- let me say, I think 8 ten days is a reasonable period, but I might have 9 been interested in doing a five day sample, 10, 15, 10 and 20 day sample. They may have told me the same 11 thing, or there may have been a difference in the 12 duration, and if you only have a-- the time or 13 resources or what have you, to do a one-shot 14 estimate, trying to get some useful data that could 15 be, in their case, incorporated into production 16 practices, try to guide them, ten days is a 17 reasonable time period to look at. 18 Q. So you would agree that the 35 percent 19 reduction figure that's given in this table, is a 20 reduction of a one-shot test? 21 A. Yes. This is-- this experiment is done 22 one way. 23 Q. Let's move on to the next data sheet, 24 Cover Crops to Reduce Soil Entering Canals: Airborne 25 Soil Entering Canal Water in Fallow Versus Ratoon JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 115 1 Cane. 2 Do you have any understanding of how 3 this particular experiment was conducted? 4 A. I don't recall talking about this one. 5 We may or may not have talked about it. 6 I can read through here and tell you 7 what it says on paper, but this one, I don't recall 8 (indicating). 9 Q. All right. Let's move on to the next 10 one. 11 A. Okay. 12 Q. Cover crops to reduce soil entering 13 canals: Fallow Versus Ratoon Cane, Water Sampled 14 After Rains for Particulate Phosphorus. 15 Do you have any recollection of having 16 discussed this particular experiment? 17 A. No. This is very similar to the other 18 one. I don't recall either one of them. 19 Q. Can you tell from either of these two 20 experiments, just looking at what is on the page, 21 what time of the year or what season these 22 experiments were conducted? 23 A. Let's see. Looking at the one that has 24 the 5-6 written at the top-- 25 Q. Yes. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 116 1 A. It's stubble cane, which means ratoon 2 cane, stubble cane, one to two feet tall, so you 3 would expect that would be sometime in-- depending 4 on when it was-- they plant cane-- the earlier 5 stubble crop was harvested, but one to two foot 6 stubble could be any time from, I guess-- any time, 7 approximately, December through April. 8 Q. It says in paragraph three, "Five paired 9 fields, up to 14 sample dates per field over a two 10 month period in spring." 11 A. Okay. I said December-- that's about 12 roughly the time, yes. 13 Q. And what about the next page? 14 Can you-- do you see any indication 15 there of-- 16 A. The same information about how tall the 17 stubble cane was, and again, that's relative to when 18 the canals-- I have no-- 19 Q. Are you on this particular one-- 20 A. I have no information. 21 Q. The results on this one, indicate a 22 reduction of 29.4 percent in particulate phosphorus 23 from ratoon cane, with a 90 percent confidence level 24 (indicating). 25 A. Uh-hum. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 117 1 Q. From your standpoint as a researcher, is 2 a 90 percent confidence level, one equivalent to 3 statistical significance? 4 A. This is a common used level, statistical 5 significance. 6 Q. Is-- generally, from looking at this 7 particular data sheet, what's going on here, simply 8 leaving the stubble cane on the field? 9 Is that what's happening here? 10 A. I think it's even more simple than 11 that. 12 I think we're just looking at, trying to 13 document what the particulate phosphorus 14 concentration on a fallow field, versus ratoon 15 field. 16 In other words, they are saying if 17 there's a ratoon crop out there, we have a 29.4 18 percent lower concentration. 19 Q. So this wouldn't be a best management 20 practice, would it? 21 A. Yes, it was. 22 Q. In what respect? 23 A. Because there's two different ways sugar 24 cane is planted. One is called the-- has several 25 different names, fallow planting system and JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 118 1 successive planting system. 2 The fallow planting, a more traditional 3 system, you plant the sugar cane. It grows for 15 4 months or so, you havest it, and the stubble grows 5 back, and then-- so forth, until three or four 6 cycles, whatever, and when one of your last crops, 7 your yields are starting to decline, you're trying 8 to rest that crop, you-- and that land is prepared 9 fallow, left fallow until planted again, so that 10 fallow planting-- it's-- when you come back and 11 plant, you're planting new fallow land. 12 The other system, after your last ratoon 13 harvest, you very quickly prepare that filed and 14 replant it that same winter, so you don't have that 15 open planting. 16 If this is a viable BMP, saying we have 17 less phosphorus concentrations on ratoon cane land 18 than fallow land, then planting more of your area in 19 the successive planting system, would be a practice 20 that would be beneficial. 21 Q. So the implication here is simply you 22 wouldn't leave a field fallow for a lengthy period 23 of time? 24 A. Right. 25 Q. Now, let's go on to the next page. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 119 1 This one is-- has a seven written at the 2 top, and it's entitled, Use Sumps with a Discharge 3 Pipe to Minimize Sediments in Water Runoff from Farm 4 Land. 5 Doctor Coale, what is your understanding 6 of this sediment BMP? 7 A. What this refers to is surface water 8 will run off of a field-- with a heavy rainstorm, it 9 will run off, and a lot of runoff is carried with 10 it, and-- soil, and a sump is a depression, and 11 whereas that water will collect there, the sediment 12 will collect there, and I believe there's a pipe 13 coming out of the sump at the field edge, and what 14 this is, a pipe that-- the opening to the pipe is 15 above the surface of the soil. 16 Q. Would it help-- sorry to interrupt you. 17 Would it help to refer to this diagram 18 (indicating)? 19 A. Yes. That basically is it. 20 Q. For the record, this is from Exhibit 21 Seven, I believe; is that correct? 22 A. Yes. 23 Q. And it is page 21, the diagram on page 24 21. 25 A. Let me get my own copy here JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 120 1 (indicating). 2 So what happens is, as the water 3 collects in the sump, of course, the sediment is 4 heavier, and it settles to the bottom, and the 5 water, it cascades over the top of the standpipe, 6 and relatively little sediment goes out to the 7 drainage ditch, and limits the bulk of it to the 8 drop in the field. 9 Q. Would implementation of this, call for 10 operation maintenance procedures to keep the pipes 11 clear or keep the sediment from building up too 12 much? 13 A. Eventually, but I think it's pretty 14 minor. 15 Q. Why is that? 16 A. Because a well maintained farm, they 17 should be going through and cleaning out these 18 ditches periodically, anyway, and it would be a very 19 simple procedure, once a pipe is enclosed, you come 20 through with a backhoe, you just clean that out. 21 You know, slightly different, but very 22 little difference. 23 Q. What does this data sheet on this 24 particular BMP tell you? 25 Can you basically run through it with JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 121 1 me? 2 A. The data there? 3 Q. Yes. 4 A. It looks like they measure the amount of 5 sediment, the mass of sediment that's left with the 6 water leaving the field, one treatment being where 7 there is no sump, and apparently just the water 8 coming off the edge of the field, and the other, 9 where there's a sump and pipe apparatus installed, 10 and it looks like with the sump, the mean mass of 11 sediment per liter was 10.8 grams of sediment, and 12 with the sump, the sediment was 2.6 grams per liter, 13 which leads to a reduction of 79.8 percent reduction 14 in sediment loss per liter. 15 Q. Do you know if that was analyzed for 16 phosphorus? 17 A. No, unless it says in here, I don't 18 know. 19 Q. Did you actually go out into the field 20 and see this in action, or visit a farm field where 21 these-- this particular BMP had been installed? 22 A. No. This one we did not see. 23 We did see some pictures, some 24 photographs, that were taken of this, in place. 25 Q. And based on those photographs, it would JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 122 1 be your understanding that this particular BMP is 2 currently being implemented? 3 A. I can't say. 4 I can say, at least one spot where they 5 took a picture of it. 6 Q. Do you know roughly, where the farm 7 field was that was used to generate this data sheet? 8 A. All I know, it was on organic-- well, 9 the Ritta farm, at the top line-- 10 Q. Yes. 11 A. I don't have a U.S. Sugar map committed 12 to memory, but it's one of these parcels-- it's 13 pretty much central of their properties, kind of in 14 the middle. 15 Q. Would the-- would this BMP be used for 16 discharge of sediment laden water into the ditch or 17 into a maintenance canal, into a farm canal? 18 A. I would anticipate it would be a-- into 19 a field ditch. 20 Q. Is there any indication here, or do you 21 know when this BMP test was undertaken? 22 A. No. I don't know when it was done. 23 Q. Let's move to the next one (indicating). 24 This one has-- is numbered eight at the 25 top, and it is entitled Use Sumps with a Discharge JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 123 1 Pipe, to Minimize Sediment in Runoff From Swales 2 Between Fields and Roads. 3 Just for the uninitiated readers of this 4 deposition, what is a swale? 5 A. A swale is a depression. 6 If you were walking from a road into the 7 field, you would go down a small incline, back up-- 8 a bowl shaped depression at the end of the field. 9 Q. What is your understanding of this 10 particular sediment control BMP? 11 A. I think this is very, very similar to 12 the one we just discussed. 13 I'm just thinking-- I'm-- on Exhibit 14 Seven, page 19 and page 21, even though they have 15 different diagrams of the-- these two are very, very 16 similar. 17 Q. Would you say, in effect, these are the 18 same BMPs? 19 A. The same theory. 20 They look like they have a slightly 21 different application, but they have the same 22 resulting effect. 23 Q. Turning back to the data sheet-- 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. It indicates, in paragraph one, that the JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 124 1 experiment was performed at the Ritta farm, again. 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. Under-- on paragraph three, there-- it 4 reads, "The rain event began 6:00 a.m., 1-25-93, and 5 ended 10:00 a.m., 1-26-93, 1.7 inches total." 6 Do you know whether the samples or-- 7 yes, the samples were taken on other occasions? 8 A. I don't know that, whether they were or 9 not. 10 Q. So would you agree that this data sheet 11 gives the impression that this is-- the measurements 12 were simply made after a single rain event? 13 A. Yes. That's the impression that I get. 14 Q. Again, the table here on this data 15 sheet, indicates a reduction in sediment per liter, 16 on the order of 28.5 percent, between the drain with 17 no sump, and with a sump, and-- is it your 18 understanding that that 28.5 percent is not a 19 measurement in reduction of phosphorus? 20 A. I understand that to be a measurment 21 and-- of an amount of sediment. 22 Q. Let's move on to the next-- this is 23 numbered nine at the top, and it's entitled Sumps 24 Upstream from Culverts. 25 What is your understanding, if you have JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 125 1 one, of this BMP, that-- 2 A. The way I understand it, the field ditch 3 outlet, that is-- that's typically a culvert that 4 the water flows through to go into the main farm 5 water canal, and apparently the study here, and I 6 looked at it-- enlarging the size-- not the size, 7 but the depth of the drainage canal-- of the field 8 drainage ditch upstream from the culvert, and 9 attempt to drain some of the-- that water flow to 10 the draining ditch, but it goes out into the culvert 11 and out into the drainage canal. 12 Q. Would that be essentially using the 13 drainage ditch as a sediment trap? 14 A. Yes, that section of the drainage ditch 15 which was enlarged. 16 Q. Do you see any indication here on this 17 particular data sheet, of how often samples were 18 taken over-- how many samples were taken over time? 19 A. Over time? 20 I can't find any indication about the 21 consideration of the-- 22 Q. Paragraph five reads, "Pumping started 23 after 2.5 inch rain." 24 Would it appear to you that the results 25 that are reported in these tables, are the results JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 126 1 obtained after a single 2.5 inch rain? 2 A. That's the assumption that I would have 3 to draw. 4 Q. If you were recommending-- well, let me 5 ask you this question first: Would you recommend any 6 of these sump forms of sediment control BMP to 7 farmers in the EAA, as one particular way of 8 reducing phosphorus loading? 9 A. I would say that they have merit, and 10 they should be investigated. 11 They-- it's tough to stand behind a 12 measurement of one time, but that still is a very 13 good indication that there's great potential that it 14 could be successful, and it should be-- efforts to 15 investigate it, if they are successful, expanded. 16 Q. So let me see if I can be clear about 17 what you're saying. 18 Are you saying that you would feel on 19 the basis of the three sump applications, that you 20 would feel confident about running further studies? 21 A. Depending on the time frame you had to 22 work with, where there's two days to do studies, one 23 day to do studies, so forth. 24 MR. MACFARLANE: Off the record. 25 (Thereupon a recess was taken JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 127 1 in the deposition, after which 2 the deposition continued as follows:) 3 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 4 Q. Doctor Coale, let me return to my 5 question. I'm not sure you got an answer in before 6 we took a brief break, and my question was, just to 7 be clear, we looked at three different versions of 8 sediment control BMPs, involving the use of sumps. 9 A. Yes. 10 Q. Based upon the data that we have gone 11 through on these three data sheets, am I correct in 12 understanding that you would feel confident, 13 recommending that these sump BMPs, were worthy of 14 further testing? 15 A. I-- 16 Q. Based upon what you reviewed in these 17 data sheets? 18 A. Definitely, for the-- further testing, I 19 think I started-- I don't-- depending on the time 20 frame you had to work in, you can test while 21 implementing, because they are very-- it's easy to 22 do this kind of testing, and you may find out they 23 are not worth doing. 24 You can put them in and attempt them on 25 the run, and if they they don't run, stop them. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 128 1 Q. Do you have-- well, let's go down and 2 look at the one, numbered nine. 3 At the bottom, there is a lower table 4 that reads, "Phosphorus in drainage water from sugar 5 cane field ditches with and without a sump. Ditches 6 not drained to the bottom." 7 And could you tell me what you 8 understand this table to say? 9 A. That looks like the phosphorus, the 10 chemical analysis of the water that was collected 11 and reported in the table above. 12 I would-- now, without digging deeply 13 into this-- 14 Q. As opposed to sediment? 15 A. Right. The first table on that paper, is 16 the mass of sediment per liter of water, and the 17 second, concentration of phosphorus per liter 18 (indicating). 19 It is listed as either total phosphorus 20 or particulate phosphorus. 21 Q. And I note the table indicates the 22 number of observations as being 12. 23 Do you have any understanding of when 24 these 12 observations occurred? 25 A. I-- on number four above there. And JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 129 1 number four, it indicates when they were collected. 2 The-- auto samples were used to collect them during 3 the drainage event. 4 Q. Do you have any idea when these drainage 5 events were occurring? 6 A. No. After a rain, after a 2.5 inch rain, 7 but we don't know when that was. 8 Q. Do we know what year it was? 9 A. No, I don't. 10 Q. Would this be a-- would you think that 11 the figure, or the figures of 26 and 54 percent 12 reductions of total P and particulate P, 13 respectively, that are given in the lower table, 14 are-- would you think that those figures might be 15 different, depending upon the amount of rain during 16 a-- during a rain event or drainage event? 17 I guess another way of asking the 18 question, would the amount of rain have an influence 19 on these figures? 20 A. Oh, yes. 21 We publish data that is shown. From 22 event to event, there's a big variation in what you 23 measure. 24 Usually the difference is, the data we 25 published that we talked about this morning, that is JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 130 1 in those manuscripts. The relative difference has 2 totaled up pretty consistently, but absolute 3 magnitude of total P were highly variable. 4 Q. Can you tell from this table, whether 5 the percentage reduction in total phosphorus and 6 particulate phosphorus, represents means or medians, 7 or just a total reduction? 8 A. The way data like this is usually 9 presented, would be a reduction of the-- between the 10 means. 11 Q. Okay. 12 A. Again, I haven't gone back and checked 13 these calculations, but I would-- that would be my 14 first thought about how it would have been-- 15 Q. Would you agree that it doesn't indicate 16 that on this? 17 A. No, but it would be easy to check with a 18 calculator. 19 Q. Let's flip the page, and we have another 20 table that says, "Phosphorus in drainage water from 21 sugar cane field ditches, with and without a sump, 22 ditch drained to the bottom." 23 And my question is, what difference does 24 it make where you drain the ditch to the bottom or 25 not, in implementing this BMP? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 131 1 A. Well, usually you are draining the ditch 2 down, and-- the lower you get to the bottom, the 3 more sediment you are pulling with the drainage 4 water, which it makes sense on a practical basis; 5 therefore, in the first table you're referring to, 6 if they don't drain to the bottom, you expect the 7 total concentration of phosphorus, especially 8 particulate numbers to be lower, than if you drain 9 to the bottom, bottom, and they are, in this case. 10 And with some reductions, you would 11 expect to be-- if the sump was effective, you expect 12 the percent reductions to be greater, than if you 13 drained it all the way to the bottom, than if you 14 just drained it partially. 15 Q. Have you seen this particular sump in 16 action, as it were, out of the EAA? 17 A. We saw some fields-- of course it wasn't 18 a rainy day when we were there, and we weren't 19 pumping, but-- you're looking down into-- we didn't 20 go put on scuba gear and go down and investigate, 21 but they showed us several sites where sumps had 22 been installed. 23 Q. Do you know how long this particular 24 practice has been going on in the EAA? 25 A. This experiment? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 132 1 Q. Yes. 2 A. I don't know what the duration of this 3 experiment was. 4 Q. Do you know if it's still going on? 5 MR. GAINES: Are you-- 6 MR. MACFARLANE: Sorry. Let me clarify 7 what this is. 8 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 9 Q. I'm talking about strictly about the 10 sediment control BMP, using a sump, as described on 11 that page. 12 MR. GAINES: You're talking about the 13 practice, that practice by farmers, in general, as 14 opposed to this expermental data gathering? 15 MR. MACFARLANE: Well, let's do both. 16 MR. GAINES: I was just confused. 17 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 18 Q. As far as the experiment is concerned, 19 do you know whether it's still ongoing? 20 A. I don't know. 21 Something like a sump, unless you 22 physically fill it in and got rid of the sump, 23 it's-- that has happened, and-- probably still 24 there, but on an experimental basis, I don't know if 25 the experiments are going any further, in a JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 133 1 practical-- on a general farming community basis. I 2 don't know if they are still ongoing or not. 3 Q. Let's move along to number 10, parallel 4 canal, and tell me what your understanding is of 5 parallel canal as a sediment control BMP. 6 A. What a parallel canal is, is you would-- 7 you have your main farm drainage canal, and you 8 would excavate an additional canal for a given 9 length, parallel and in close proximity. 10 I don't remember how far they were 11 apart, maybe 50 feet, a hundred feet, right around 12 there. 13 And what you would do, you would-- you 14 would have-- you have a pump in-- in the main, 15 existing main farm canal, that would pump water 16 through the parallel canal, which is a short length 17 of canal that was at a higher elevation than the 18 main pump canal. 19 Q. Let me stop you. Just so this is clear 20 in my mind, this parallel canal, would it be between 21 the main farm canal and the field ditch, field 22 ditches? 23 A. It-- 24 Q. Or would it be outside? 25 A. It would be independent of the field JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 134 1 ditches. 2 Think of it as a trough, like a watering 3 trough that was set parallel to the main farm canal, 4 roughly the same width and some given length. 5 So that the parallel canal was excavated 6 and-- 7 Q. Yes. 8 A. So water could be pumped from the main 9 farm canal, as it was going toward the outlet from 10 the farm, up on to-- into this trough, this parallel 11 canal, and then it would, because the materials 12 are-- weren't impervious, it would slowly trickle 13 and percolate through the broken rock and soil that 14 the parallel canal trough was made out of, and that 15 water would eventually go back into the main canal, 16 hopefully leaving a lot of the sediment behind in 17 this canal, or in the rock fragments. 18 Q. And you would use the head differential 19 between the trough, as you would describe it, and 20 how that seepage would occur, back into-- 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. Okay. Would the trough or the parallel 23 canal, have to be cleaned on a regular basis, in 24 order to continue to function? 25 A. I guess it depends on how big it is. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 135 1 I guess in theory, you can make it big 2 enough, you never had to, theoretically, but if you 3 made it too small, you would have to. 4 Q. Did you have an opportunity to see this 5 particular BMP in action, as it were, out on the 6 EAA? 7 A. We saw it in static condition, because 8 again, we weren't in a drainage mode. There was no 9 pumping going on, except for the test. 10 We saw it, and it-- 11 Q. Do you have any idea how long parallel 12 canals have been used out in the EAA for this 13 purpose? 14 A. I don't know of any of them that have 15 been used, except in this one instance. 16 This is the only one I have seen. 17 Q. I note on paragraph eight, it says, "We 18 will still have to calculate how fast and how much 19 water can be treated." 20 Is it your understanding from that, the 21 results that are reported on this data sheet, are 22 not final results, if you understand-- perhaps 23 that's not the best way of phrasing it. 24 A. Number seven above that says 25 approximately 5,000,000 gallons were pumped, so they JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 136 1 collected this data off of 5,000,000 pumped gallons, 2 and my-- again, my intepretation was-- again, I 3 think what they are saying, they don't know what the 4 ultimate capacity of this thing is. 5 Q. I direct your attention to paragraph 6 five, samples were taken from 4-7-93 through 7 10-14-93. 8 A. Uh-hum. 9 Q. My understanding of the climate of South 10 Florida, would seem to suggest that that-- is that 11 primarily during the dry season or primarily during 12 the rainy season? 13 A. During the rainy season. 14 Q. Would you think that in paragraph six, 15 it indicates the 13 composite samples were taken-- 16 would you think that 13 samples taken during that 17 time period, would-- would be sufficient to give you 18 confidence to recommend this particular BMP to 19 farmers? 20 A. That's a good data set. 21 There are 13 discrete samples taken at 22 different points, through that-- that's a pretty 23 good time period. 24 It gives you pretty good confidence in 25 this data. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 137 1 Q. Let's flip to the next one, number 12, 2 Construct Sediment Traps Upstream from Drainage 3 Pumps. 4 And the first paragraph indicates a 5 sediment trap was constructed during the winter of 6 1992, and-- Doctor Coale, do you know where this 7 sediment trap was constructed? 8 A. We visited it. 9 I was there. I don't know the name of 10 the parcel of land that it was put on, but it's-- 11 it's in the EAA, due south of-- if I remember which 12 direction we were heading, south of South Bay, 13 Florida. In that area. 14 Maybe down, south of Lake Harbor. 15 I don't know. 16 Q. Can you explain to me with reference to 17 this particular experiment, how the sediment trap 18 operates? 19 A. Yes. This is a tremendous construction 20 project. This is a huge thing. 21 I think-- I can read it in here, the one 22 they built, is 250 feet upstream, 125 feet long. 23 That's downstream of the barrier, and-- so the whole 24 thing is 357 feet long. 25 What they have done, on a main farm JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 138 1 canal, before you got to the off-farm pump facility, 2 that they have taken a section of the main farm 3 canal and enlarged its width and its depth, and 4 made, if you will, a great big swimming pool out 5 there and then down-- which is a sump, this huge 6 sump, and in the middle of it, I think-- not in the 7 middle, but one third of the way from-- from the 8 downstream end of it, they left a wall of rock that 9 they didn't excavate when they made the sump, so if 10 you were coming down the canal and tracing the 11 bottom surface, or the bottom contour of the 12 drainage canal as you're going from upstream in the 13 farm, downstream toward the pump station, you would 14 have your main farm canal, about-- at a normal 15 depth, and at a certain point, the canal depth would 16 drop, and I believe-- the way they explained it, was 17 eight to ten feet, something like that, deep, and 18 the width increased by three fold, and this large-- 19 enlarged area continued for-- and this description 20 says 250 feet, and then there's a wall, vertical 21 wall, and it came up to the upper surface of the 22 wall, was below the surface of the water because of 23 the submerged wall, and that wall was of a certain 24 thickness, 12, 15 feet, the-- thick wall, and then 25 it dropped down again on the other side, so you had, JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 139 1 like, this freestanding wall in the middle of this 2 big sump, and the theory being, as the water came 3 down the main farm canal, when it reached the pipe 4 where the volume increased, because the depth and 5 width was greater, the velocity of the water would 6 decrease, and as the velocity decreases, there's 7 more chance for sediment to fall out, because 8 there's less of a vector force carrying it 9 downstream. 10 That's the idea of-- behind this 11 enlarged sump area. 12 Further, as the sediment was dropping 13 out and the water moving downstream, encountered 14 this wall, the sediment would be physically 15 encouraged, I don't know if that's the proper term-- 16 physically encouraged to drop down at the base of 17 that wall, and the water goes up and over, and the 18 water going to the pump, in theory, would have much 19 less sediment, than the sediment trap area. 20 Q. You say in theory. 21 Let me ask you, does the success or 22 ability of this particular sump to settle out-- 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. Particulate phosphorus, depends on the 25 rate of flow of the water? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 140 1 A. Yes. It does, yes, and one thing we 2 discussed in detail while we were there, was why 3 this size, and-- 4 Q. And why this size? 5 A. I-- and it was-- from the information 6 they had available, was they thought it would work, 7 and I think these people are the first ones to 8 admit, if they see it's working a little bit, not as 9 much as they hope, it might be a matter of making it 10 a little bit bigger, and slow down the velocity-- 11 Q. In other words, the point of making it 12 that big, is to slow down the velocity of the water 13 in the canal, so you would have the settling effect? 14 A. Yes. Right. 15 Q. Did you discuss the people who were 16 showing you this, the cost of constructing this 17 particular-- 18 A. No. 19 Q. Sediment trap on this scale? 20 A. No. We didn't discuss costs of any of 21 these. 22 Q. But you described this as, I think you 23 said, huge project-- this would be-- would you guess 24 that this would be a much costlier project to 25 implement, than the sediment control BMPs we've been JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 141 1 discussing up to this point? 2 A. Let me object to the form of the 3 question. 4 Asking the witness to guess. 5 MR. MACFARLANE: I will guess. I 6 shouldn't do that, and you shouldn't guess. 7 THE WITNESS: I'm not going to guess. I'm 8 not a civil engineer, and I don't know what it costs 9 to move a yard of rock, but-- 10 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 11 Q. But it was a big project? 12 A. It was a big hole in the ground. 13 Q. Let's go to number 13 on the next page, 14 cleaned versus non-cleaned ditches. 15 And let me ask you, does a cleaning 16 ditch really come into play on all these sediment 17 control BMPs involving the sediment trap we've just 18 discussed, or the use of sumps or the use of 19 parallel canals or field ditches, as sediment traps? 20 Q. No. It's-- I think it's-- it comes into 21 play, but also of interest. 22 It can be its own practice, but-- I have 23 seen farm field ditches that are so plugged up with 24 sediment, they are desperately in need of a 25 cleaning, that they are very effective, even for JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 142 1 water control, much less sediment control. 2 Q. Do you have any idea, based on your 3 research you have done or research you are aware of, 4 of how often it would be necessary to clean a ditch 5 so it can continue to function as a collector of 6 sediment? 7 A. I think it's highly variable across the 8 area. 9 Q. Let's go back to the first couple of 10 sediment control BMPs in this collection, and let me 11 ask you about the first one, which is actually 12 number three at the top, and it's entitled Ditch 13 Banks Stabilized by Vegetation, and can you tell me 14 a little bit about how this sediment control BMP 15 works? 16 A. Well, in the past, there's-- there's a 17 pretty concerted effort across the industry, to keep 18 ditch banks bare, because they harbor rodents and 19 pests and everything else, and-- but when you do 20 that, you are also subjecting them to be eroded by 21 rainwater and ditch water moving downstream, and 22 this was an attempt to compare a bare ditch bank 23 with one which had been sodded, so it had a solid 24 grass covering on it, and to look at the sediment 25 load in the drainage water of those two treatments. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 143 1 Q. And there is a table here, and-- which 2 gives percentage reductions, and let me just ask, 3 again, those percentage reductions are reductions of 4 sediment; are they not-- sediment content of 5 drainage water? 6 A. Yes. 7 Q. And they don't purport to report 8 reductions in particulate phosphorus? 9 A. That's-- phosphorus is not listed here, 10 no (indicating). 11 Q. Let's go to the next page (indicating). 12 It's-- it doesn't have a number. I 13 assume it's of the same variety, called grassed-in 14 stabilized ditch banks, and very briefly, Doctor 15 Coale, what is your understanding of this particular 16 practice? 17 Is this essentially the same as the one 18 you just looked at? 19 A. Very similar idea. I think the theory is 20 the same. 21 Q. What is paragrass? 22 A. Oh, a just a species of grass. 23 Q. Let's look at Exhibit Nine (indicating). 24 A. I don't have Nine. 25 Q. Here it is (indicating). JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 144 1 A. Okay. 2 Q. Let me ask you to-- this is-- you have 3 already identified this particular exhibit. It's 4 titled Updated Data for Certain Sediment Control 5 BMPs. 6 Let me ask you, did you receive-- was 7 this among-- along with the other materials, 8 Exhibits Seven and Eight, part of the material you 9 received prior to visiting the U.S. Sugar research 10 facility in March? 11 A. As far as I remember, yes. 12 Q. And let's look at the first data set 13 recorded here, Grass Ditchbank Experiment at Ritta 14 Farm, and let me just ask you, in the table here-- 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. Which gives figures for total 17 phosphorus, total dissolved phosphorus and 18 particulate phosphorus-- the table indicates that 19 number of observations was 15 (indicating). 20 Is that correct? 21 A. That's correct. 22 Q. Do you have any knowledge or 23 understanding of when those 15 observations were 24 taken? 25 A. From what's presented here, no, I can't JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 145 1 tell. 2 Q. The same question for the next table, 3 which is entitled field ditch sump experiment at 4 Ritta Farm. 5 A. No. There's no indication of times or 6 dates, what's on here (indicating). 7 Q. Same question for the ditch cleaning 8 experiment at Boy Farm (indicating). 9 A. No indication. No indication of time or 10 dates (indicating). 11 Q. How about the parallel canal experiment 12 at Vaughn Farm? 13 Do you have any indication of when these 14 observations were made? 15 A. No. There's no indication here. 16 Q. Let me ask you, with respect to this 17 one, or, indeed, any of these, would the results 18 of-- differ, depending upon the season, results, 19 meaning the figures for phosphorus that are given in 20 each of these tables? 21 Would these vary, according to season or 22 whether it was a wet year or dry year? 23 MR. GAINES: Object to the form, to the 24 extent it calls for speculation, but if it doesn't, 25 in your opinion, you can-- if you can answer it, you JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 146 1 can answer it. 2 THE WITNESS: Phosphorus concentrations 3 do vary from season to season, from day to day, and 4 from drainage bank to drainage bank. 5 That's obvious from all of the published 6 information that's out there. 7 If in their number of observations-- for 8 example, there is 15 observations they collected 9 over 15 discrete points in time. That's a pretty 10 good representation of that time period, but we 11 don't have an indication of what that time period 12 is. 13 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 14 Q. So looking at the parallel canal 15 experiment figures for Vaughn Farm, the percentage 16 reduction in particulate phosphorus in the table is 17 given, is 55 percent. 18 A. Uh-hum. 19 Q. You don't really know, do you, what time 20 period that 55 percent reduction took place over, do 21 you? 22 A. No, I don't. 23 Q. Let's go on to the next one. 24 The cascade experiment at Wetherald 25 Farm. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 147 1 Do you have any indication here as to 2 the time or the frequency of the observations? 3 A. No. 4 Q. What is your understanding of the 5 cascade experiment? 6 A. As he described it, we didn't see this 7 one. 8 We saw some photographs of it. 9 There was a-- essentially, a mound of 10 broken rock in the canal, that the water, drainage 11 water was forced by flow to cascade down over, and 12 hence the name, and hopefully, sediment would be 13 drained, as it tumbled and percolated through this 14 broken rock, as it made its way down the canal. 15 Q. Do you know whether this is a technique 16 that had been implemented anywhere else in the EAA, 17 other than Wetherald Farm? 18 A. I have never seen it. 19 Q. Have you been to Wetherald Farm? 20 A. I believe that was one of the stops we 21 made the day we were out there, and in the past 22 years, I'm sure I have been on that property before. 23 Q. This has come up in other depositions, 24 but there seemed to have been some testing, BMP 25 testing going on there involving BMPs, at one point JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 148 1 in time. 2 Are you familiar with those experiments? 3 I keep hearing about different BMP 4 experiments at Wetherald Farm. 5 MR. GAINES: I think that was the one 6 with documents that we produced to you. 7 There was a report on that. It-- 8 MR. MACFARLANE: Yes. 9 MR. GAINES: Were all one, I believe-- 10 Doctor John Davis was involved with it. I think 11 that's some of the documents that we produced. 12 If you want me to, I can check on that. 13 MR. MACFARLANE: No. I'll agree that you 14 did produce it. 15 I just wondered if the witness was 16 generally familiar with what had gone on out there. 17 THE WITNESS: I can't say for sure what 18 was done on what property, what the names of the 19 properties were. 20 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 21 Q. Fair enough. Setting up a sediment trap 22 experiment at Mott Farm-- this table only gives 23 reduction for total phosphorus, and indicates a five 24 percent reduction based on 17 observations. 25 Am I reading that correctly? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 149 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. Do you know whether there are any 3 figures for total dissolved phosphorus or 4 particulate phosphorus? 5 A. No, I don't. 6 Q. Have you seen this particular sediment 7 trap? 8 A. I don't know which sediment trap this 9 data was derived from. 10 If there-- it could have been collected 11 from that one, large engineering structure I told 12 you about, but-- 13 Q. That was going to be my next question. 14 A. Like I said, I wasn't sure that was your 15 farm or his farm or whose farm it was. 16 Q. Okay. Main canal sump experiment, 17 Prewitt Farm. 18 Do you know what kind of sump experiment 19 this involved (indicating)? 20 A. Main canal sump-- that is the way I 21 understand it. We have gone through these sumps 22 here-- would be one of these field ditch drainage 23 pipes-- with the pipes, I expect, because it's to 24 the main canal sump, just my interpetation of the 25 title of this table, it was-- main canal sump, where JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 150 1 the main drainage canal was enlarged and deepened to 2 help provide a reduction in the velocity, and have 3 sediment drop out in the bottom of that area. 4 Q. The results that are reported in this 5 table, indicate for total phosphorus, six 6 observations, and then for TDP and particulate 7 phosphorus, two observations, with negative 8 reductions. 9 How would you interrupt that? 10 A. Well, you have to-- I see that, and if 11 you go up to the next line, paired T-test-- 12 Q. Yes. 13 A. That is the statistical test used, and 14 those numbers being as large as they are, 15 essentially tells you you can't tell anything from 16 this data. 17 Q. Would you agree this data is essentially 18 worthless? 19 A. This is worthless. 20 Q. Let's flip to the final page, Ditch Berm 21 Experiment, South Shore Farm. 22 What is a ditch berm? 23 A. This is one we didn't see, and I don't 24 even think we saw photographs of it, but just one 25 verbally mentioned quickly. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 151 1 And essentially it was building up the 2 elevation of the field, absolutely, at the ends of 3 the field, to reduce overland flow into the ditches, 4 either with soil material on the-- over the berms, 5 or rock material in the ditch, but I don't really 6 know much about this. 7 Q. How would you evaluate the data that's 8 reported in this particular table? 9 A. Well, again, the test is extremely high, 10 which means that the data is not telling you a heck 11 of a lot. 12 Q. Let's go back very quickly to Exhibit 13 Number Eight, and we-- let me ask you, we've 14 discussed later-- have we discussed Grassed or 15 Polymerized Field Ditch Entrances to Minimize Ditch 16 Bank Soil Erosion? 17 Are you aware of how this sediment 18 control BMP works? 19 A. I think it's very similar to sodding the 20 ditch banks, or allowing the native grasses to grow 21 that we had on the ditch banks, just holds them in 22 place. 23 Q. Number 11, large sumps in main canals 24 upstream from drainage pumps. 25 I think we discussed that. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 152 1 A. I think it was one of the next to the 2 last ones that we talked about here. 3 Q. Installing risers and adjusting boards 4 to slope field ditch drainage. 5 Is that a variation on the-- discussion 6 that works the same way that installing that 7 submerged wall would work, only you're doing it in a 8 ditch? 9 A. No. The way I understand it, it's a 10 different purpose there. 11 Q. Please explain. 12 A. At the end of drainage ditch, there's a 13 culvert and riser, which you can regulate the height 14 of the outlet by putting boards, you know, in the 15 riser. 16 And you can determine to what level you 17 can draw down a field ditch about where you set that 18 board in that riser, so if you wanted to relate how 19 fast or slow a certain ditch drained, you can seat 20 those boards where you wanted to, and therefore, it 21 couldn't drain lower than the level of the top of 22 the board. 23 Q. How about rerouting water flow in fields 24 near pump stations to slow drainage? 25 What it's your understanding as to the JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 153 1 particular BMP? 2 A. Essentially, that would be blocking the 3 outlet of the field ditch, and opening it on the 4 upstream side? 5 A. So as the water level in that ditch was 6 increased, due to rainfall, the water would have to 7 go the long way around, to put it-- to-- to get to 8 the main farm canal, so you're rerouting it to go 9 the long way around, than where it eventually would 10 have been straight through to the ditch. 11 Q. How would that work to control sediment? 12 A. That would work to control sediment, 13 because a lot of times you tend-- if you have a main 14 farm pump station on the main farm canal, and 16 15 field ditches leading into that, the field ditches 16 closest to the pump station, tends to-- I think the 17 term a lot of people like to use, dewater, they draw 18 down quicker than the other-- from the other 19 station, and that last water near the bottom, when 20 you take the water down, has the most sediment load 21 in it, so if you bring the whole volume that is 22 coming off that farm down evenly, it would be 23 advantageous-- would help keep the sediment in the 24 field. 25 Q. And how about the last one, number 16, JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 154 1 construct Canal Connection Between Farms or 2 Interconnects, to Delay and Reduce Drainage 3 Discharge? 4 How does that work? 5 A. Well, that ties right back to what we 6 talked about earlier, the BMPs in the SWIM Plan, 7 about where to put the water if you need to pump 8 north and you can only go south, and you have 9 these-- you have these hydraulic connections where 10 you can move it and reroute it, based on your needs 11 at that time. 12 It gives you more options and 13 flexibility. 14 Q. Are these settlement controlled BMPs, 15 the sediment controlled BMPs that you would be 16 testifying about, if called upon to do so at a 17 hearing? 18 A. These are the ones, yes. 19 Q. Are there any others that you can think 20 of, that you would testify about? 21 A. Not that I can recall at this time. 22 MR. GAINES: Can you make a-- I don't 23 know if this is an appropriate comment or not, but 24 just as long as we're on this point on the record, 25 when you asked about number two on this list, and I JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 155 1 don't know if it was in your question or his answer, 2 and I'm not trying to coach him at all-- maybe I 3 am-- but this is-- this number two, related to field 4 ditch entrances, and I don't know if you asked it, 5 as far as field ditch banks. 6 I think there's a slight difference 7 there, and forgive me if I'm intruding-- I thought 8 the way the question came out, it may have come out 9 as banks, not entrances. 10 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 11 Q. Okay. Could you describe that particular 12 BMP? 13 You may have picked up-- 14 A. I forgot what we said, either banks or 15 edges, but the theory is the same. 16 The soil stays on there with vegetation 17 on there, better than bare soil, so regardless of 18 where it is in the farm operation, having a soil 19 covered with a vegetative layer helps hold sediment 20 in place, instead of running off, so it's the same 21 theory as some of those that we talked about. 22 Q. Doctor Coale, based on the data sheets 23 that we've gone through and the information that's 24 been made available to you about sediment control 25 BMPs, do you have an opinion as to the percentage JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 156 1 reduction in phosphorus that sediment-- any of these 2 sediment control BMPs could achieve over the-- 3 A. I think what percentage of reduction of 4 phosphorus-- it's going to be very site specific. 5 It's going to be site specific, and some 6 of them are going to be more applicable in some 7 locations than other locations. 8 A lot of these show promise for being 9 effective, and I think they could have a-- a fact of 10 having substantial reduction, promoting a 11 substantially phosphorus load downstream. 12 Q. What would you understand a substantial 13 reduction to be? 14 A. I wouldn't be surprised if these 15 sediment control BMPs, were implemented everywhere 16 they were appropriate, and they function as the data 17 has told us they can function, the preliminary data, 18 somewhere in the neighborhood of roughly ten 19 percent, I would say, reduction. 20 Q. And you're willing to make-- willing to 21 make that estimate, for-- feel comfortable making 22 that estimate, based upon the results that you have 23 reviewed here? 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. Let me-- let's move on. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 157 1 And let me go back to just before we got 2 off on the subject of sediment control BMPs. 3 Do you anticipate testifying about other 4 BMPs, other than the ones that are listed in the 5 SWIM Plan, or said the SWIM Plan sediment control 6 BMPs? 7 A. I'm trying to think of what those 8 examples might be. 9 The only other practices I've observed, 10 was-- were how they are managing the discharge water 11 from some of the mills, the sugar mills, but, again, 12 I'm not an engineer or expert in mill functioning. 13 Some of the observations we made and 14 some of the diagrams I have seen, how some of these 15 retention areas around these mills-- they seem to 16 have some promise. 17 Q. Let me ask you, then, and I don't think 18 I need to get-- first of all, have you been out and 19 seen those BMPs in the vicinity of mills on site, as 20 it were? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. Did you receive an explanation at the 23 time, as to how they were supposed to work? 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. Do you believe that the kind of BMPs JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 158 1 that were employed in the vicinity of mills, would 2 have more general application in the EAA, let's say, 3 on farms, for example? 4 A. Not-- no. I wouldn't stretch it that 5 far. 6 I would say these are just definitely 7 relating to mill discharge water. That's how it was 8 explained to me. 9 Q. Do you anticipate giving any testimony 10 on pumping practice of-- pumping practice BMPs? 11 A. On-farm pump management? 12 Q. Yes. 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. Let's take a look at-- 15 MR. GAINES: Actually, I was going to 16 chime in at this point. You asked him, do you 17 anticipate, you know, other than the ones listed in 18 the SWIM Plan-- 19 MR. MACFARLANE: Or sediment control. 20 MR. GAINES: And as far as what is 21 specifically listed in the SWIM Plan, and your 22 question is exactly what I was thinking of, and I 23 know there was something like water table 24 management, and in our minds, that includes the 25 various pumping practices. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 159 1 I don't know if it does-- we are now 2 clear on not one, but-- it would include that. 3 THE WITNESS: Earlier this morning, I 4 think I made the distinction, I consider this all-- 5 I consider this all on-farm water management. 6 MR. MACFARLANE: Let's mark these two as 7 exhibits. 8 (The documents referred to 9 were thereupon marked as 10 Coale Exhibit Numbers 11 10 and 11 for Identification, 12 copies of which are attached 13 hereto.) 14 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 15 Q. I'm going to do these backward, 16 actually, and let me ask you, Doctor Coale, showing 17 you what's been marked as Exhibit 11 first. 18 Do you recognize this document 19 (indicating)? 20 A. Yes, I have seen it. 21 Q. Have you reviewed it? 22 A. Yes, I have. 23 Q. And and what do you understand it to be? 24 A. This is essentially, the operation 25 guidelines for how a farm manager would-- of U.S. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 160 1 Sugar Corporation would manage his drainage pumps 2 after a rainfall event. 3 Q. Is it your your understanding that this 4 is a-- these are directions, if you will, that are 5 currently in practice at U.S. Sugar? 6 A. As far as I know. 7 Q. Did you discuss these-- this document or 8 the pump practices that are described here, while 9 you were visiting the U.S. Sugar research facility 10 in March? 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. And what is your understanding of the 13 operation of these pump practices? 14 A. Is that they are-- they are very rigid, 15 very rigorous, and I got the impression that if a 16 manager didn't adhere to them, he would have his 17 job-- had his pink slip. 18 They were very serious about it, but as 19 far as the actual practices, they are dependant upon 20 the amount of rainfall that has occurred in a given 21 length of time, and then relative to that, there is 22 a stage which is the elevation of water in the canal 23 for-- criterion, as far as when you can turn the 24 pumps on. There's a criteria as to how long the 25 rain event occurs, you have to wait before you turn JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 161 1 the pumps on. 2 There's a minimum water stage, when you 3 can get a certain water level, you turn them off, 4 and I guess that a-- in a nutshell, that's what it 5 involves. 6 Q. Let let's make a little detour for a 7 second, and let me show you what's been marked for-- 8 marked as an exhibit, Number Ten, and could you 9 identify that document (indicating)? 10 A. That is-- by pump station specifically, 11 how these guidelines have been implemented by each 12 pump station at U.S. Sugar Corporation. 13 Q. Would it be fair to say that this chart 14 represents the instructions that you were just 15 describing? 16 A. Yes. 17 It's just the new method or the best 18 management method for operating these discharge 19 pumps. 20 Q. To your understanding, is this applied 21 at the present time at U.S. Sugar? 22 A. From what I understand-- this-- it is in 23 practice, approximately three quarters of their 24 acreage. 25 Q. Are these pumping practices, the same JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 162 1 thing as what's been called the Florida Sugar Cane 2 League pump BMP? Are you familiar with-- 3 A. I don't know that term. 4 Q. Are you familiar at all with the Florida 5 Sugar Cane League, undertaken by Huchin Engineers? 6 A. I believe there was a report in that set 7 of documents that they prepared. 8 I'm not sure who commissioned the 9 report, but I remember seeing Huchin Engineers on 10 the cover of a report. 11 Q. Do you know David Stewart? 12 A. I have never met him. 13 Q. Do you know anyone else from Huchin 14 Engineers? 15 A. No. 16 Q. Have you ever met anybody else from 17 Huchin Engineers? 18 A. No, not personally. 19 Q. Let's go back to Exhibit Number 11, and 20 let me ask you, are-- do you know whether the 21 pumping practices that are described or pumping 22 procedures that are described in this document, 23 facility pumping or slow pumping, according to the 24 approach that you used in the article that you 25 coauthored with Izuno and Bottcher? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 163 1 A. This is a different-- remember when we 2 discussed that, I said there's two tiers of water 3 management here. 4 This is main farm canal discharge. 5 Q. Okay. 6 A. Okay. All the data in that paper refer 7 to field drainage, okay, and they are not 8 comparable. 9 Q. We are talking apples and oranges? 10 A. Yes. I think we are. 11 Q. These are different pumping practices. 12 One is appropriate for pumping ditches and one, you 13 don't pump ditches. 14 Q. Drainage-- 15 A. Drainage. This is pumping main farm 16 canals. 17 MR. GAINES: We're talking about sugar 18 cane and rice in this case. 19 MR. MACFARLANE: That's a more apropos 20 metaphor. 21 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 22 Q. Out of curiosity, how do you affect the 23 speed with which you drain a ditch? 24 A. It all depends on the hydraulic head 25 difference, between canal, main part of the canal, JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 164 1 which is receiving the water, and the water level in 2 the field drainage ditch, itself. 3 Q. When you were describing in your article 4 earlier the difference between fast and slow 5 drainage, how would you actually get a farm to-- a 6 field to drain faster? 7 A. Well, I-- 8 Q. Is there a mechanical means, or is it 9 all done in the design of the ditch? 10 A. Well, in the conclusion of that 11 article-- I think we went through that this morning, 12 we said there are some-- what you need to do is 13 maximize that drainage gradient. In other words, 14 lower the main farm canal level quickly, and 15 minimize physical resistance; in other words, have 16 clean ditches that have large enough flow channels 17 to carry water off. 18 Q. Thank you for clearing that up. I'm not 19 sure I was following that. 20 Let me ask you to turn to the second 21 page of Exhibit 11, and the bottom is-- is what 22 appears to be a date, 10-1-92, and do you know 23 whether that was the date on which U.S. Sugar began 24 implementing this pumping procedure, or was it 25 simply the date this document was prepared? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 165 1 A. I have no way of knowing that. 2 Q. Do you have any idea how long U.S. Sugar 3 has been employing these pumping procedures? 4 A. I don't know when they started. 5 I-- that data that I said to-- referred 6 to earlier, involving the three calendar years, 7 involved these pumping practices, so January 1, 8 1993. 9 Q. Let me ask you to look at the last 10 paragraph on page two, and I believe the next to 11 last sentence, reads, "Also, when the schedules are 12 put into actual practice, it may become necessary to 13 revise some of the these operations." 14 Do you know whether any of these 15 operations have been revised? 16 A. Well, up here at the top of this chart, 17 on-- it says, revised, February of '93, so-- that's 18 all the information I have. 19 MR. MACFARLANE: Off the record. 20 (Thereupon a recess was taken 21 in the deposition, after which 22 the deposition continued as follows:) 23 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 24 Q. Back on the record. 25 Doctor Coale, before the break, we were JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 166 1 talking about the pumping procedure BMP employed by 2 U.S. Sugar. 3 And let me, just to be clear-- let me 4 ask you, has data been collected that you're aware 5 of, that shows the effect of this particular pumping 6 practice on water quality? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. Where would I find that data? 9 Is that part of the data that was 10 produced? 11 A. Yes, it was. 12 It should have been. I don't know what 13 was produced, but it should have accompanied all 14 this stuff. 15 Q. And-- 16 MR. GAINES: That is some of it, but the 17 big stack you showed me earlier, that is the data. 18 And I think this is analysis of the data 19 you're holding up right now. That was also 20 produced. 21 MR. MACFARLANE: Okay. 22 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 23 Q. So it's the monthly sampling data sent 24 U.S. Sugar by the South Florida Water District, 25 February of 1993, as part of your documents? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 167 1 That would be the data on water quality? 2 A. Yes. 3 MR. GAINES: I think January was in 4 there, also. 5 THE WITNESS: It was a full year, I know. 6 MR. MACFARLANE: I'll go back and check. 7 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 8 Q. Have you analyzed that data? 9 A. I have reviewed it, and spoken with the 10 scientists who were in charge of gathering it, and 11 supplying it to the Water Management District, but 12 as far as analyzing it, I'm not sure what you meant 13 there. 14 I haven't numerically crunched all the 15 numbers. 16 Q. Do you have an opinion whether this 17 pumping practice BMP, will reduce phosphorus load in 18 the EAA? 19 A. Based on the data that I reviewed, yes, 20 I do think it will. 21 Q. Do you have an opinion as to the 22 percentage reduction of phosphorus? 23 A. From this data that was-- nobody looked 24 over, they-- they had-- they could show a 50 percent 25 reduction of phosphorus. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 168 1 MR. MACFARLANE: Let's mark this as 2 Number 12. 3 (The document referred to 4 was thereupon marked as 5 Coale Exhibit Number 6 12 for Identification, 7 a copy of which is attached 8 hereto.) 9 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 10 Q. Doctor Coale, I'm handing you Exhibit 11 12, and this consists of a number of handwritten and 12 then what appear to be typewriter printed pages, and 13 finally, a data sheet for-- various calculations, 14 and the first page reads, "Example calculation of 15 flow weighted P concentration, Bourne one: January 16 1st to January 27, 1993." 17 A. Uh-hum. 18 Q. Are you familiar with this document? 19 A. Yes. I have seen it and I have reviewed 20 it. 21 Q. Did you prepare it? 22 A. No, I didn't. 23 Q. Do you know who did? 24 A. I believe that's Doctor McCray. 25 Q. Who is Doctor McCray? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 169 1 A. He's a scientist that works for U.S. 2 Sugar Corporation research department. 3 Q. Do you know what his first name is? 4 A. Mabre. 5 Q. Can you tell me, Doctor Coale, what the 6 first page of this document purports to show? 7 A. This is an example, based on the first 8 27 days of January, of 1993, of how flow weighted 9 phosphorus concentrations are calculated on a daily 10 basis. 11 Q. And there are three columns, and one is 12 flow in millions of gallons. 13 A. Right. 14 Q. For-- then for each day, you-- and 15 concentration is given in milligrams per liter? 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. And then flow time concentrations-- is 18 that correct? Is that how it's done? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. Let me ask you to skip the next page and 21 go to the third page. 22 Unfortunately, the pages-- 23 MR. GAINES: Let me-- if we're skipping 24 the next-- I think pages one and two are supposed to 25 be taken together. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 170 1 The page two is a continuation of the 2 analysis that starts on page one, just so we have a 3 clear record. 4 MR. MACFARLANE: Would you care to adopt 5 your counsel's testimony? 6 THE WITNESS: I'm not sure what-- I agree 7 that the second piece of paper is the summation of 8 the data presented on the first piece of paper. 9 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 10 Q. What does the second piece of paper 11 show? 12 A. What it shows for that time period were, 13 for the concentration values, and what the total 14 gallons flow recorded were. 15 And then what the total concentration, 16 divided by gallons, is the flow weighted average 17 concentration. 18 Q. And that flow weighted average 19 concentration, is what? 20 A. 0.116, and-- the units are left off 21 there, and-- but by going back, you can't-- I can't 22 convert that in my head. 23 We were assuming, and this is-- it would 24 be parts per million, milligrams per liter P. 25 Q. Let's flip it to the next page, which JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 171 1 has at the top, Actual Flow, Load and Rainfall 2 Information from Different Drainage Categories. 3 Can you tell me-- 4 A. Can you pause for a second? 5 Q. Yes. Sure. Go ahead. 6 A. Without recalculating, I want to go back 7 and say, I can't tell whether it's parts per million 8 phosphorus, the equivalent of milligrams per liter, 9 or what that number is. 10 I'm just guessing, because I don't have 11 the units to determine that. 12 Q. I appreciate the clarification. 13 The next page, can you tell me what this 14 purports to be? 15 A. This is an example of the data that's 16 used in the following calculation, I believe. 17 Q. Okay. Can you relate these various 18 categories-- categories here, to the data that 19 appears on the succeeding pages, and basically, what 20 I'm trying to figure out here, is how these things 21 work (indicating). 22 A. Well, on this-- on the pages that 23 follow, these are just acreages per-- the numbers in 24 parentheses, are just acres in that-- certain areas. 25 Q. Okay. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 172 1 A. For the next one, one, two, three-- 2 several pages. It just keeps going, just a list of 3 farms or drainage units. 4 I don't know what these are called, 5 but-- how big each one is. 6 Q. And can you tell me how these-- the page 7 that reads Actual Flow, Load and Rainfall 8 information at the top, has these different 9 categories; period flow, cumulative, yearly flow, 10 phosphorus load, so forth-- can you tell me where I 11 would find this information for each of these 12 categories in the succeeding pages, or would I find 13 them in the succeeding pages? 14 A. In the printout portion, and it's been a 15 while since I looked at this-- the part that looks 16 like it's computer generated. 17 Q. Toward the back of the documents? 18 A. Yes, and the drainage summary report-- 19 see across the top, a lot of those same headings. 20 Q. Looking at the printout page, page one 21 of the printout page that's stapled to the back of 22 this exhibit, on the left-hand column, it gives the 23 name of Bourne One, hand checks, so forth. 24 A. Right. 25 Q. Are those particular fields or farms? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 173 1 A. I believe they correspond to drainage-- 2 I mean pump stations at discharge stations, which 3 would be the same as this-- there's no page numbers, 4 but this time, you see what I'm pointing to, we have 5 these different names-- current south, current 6 north, so forth. 7 Q. Let me ask you, staying on the page that 8 you just pointed to-- it's the page that begins, 9 with one cane base line, and then in parenthesis, 10 21,947 acres-- 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. What is the meaning, if you understand 13 it, of cane base line? 14 A. The way I understand it, those are the 15 areas that list one, two, three, four, five, six, 16 seven, eight-- eight units, parcels of land, shall 17 we say, are the areas that are still being managed 18 under non-BMP conditions. 19 Q. Okay, and is that also the case for the 20 next group of pump stations he did, vegetable base 21 line? 22 A. I believe it is. 23 Q. All right. Then flipping the page to 24 three, where it says three, BMP cane, with southern 25 unit two and-- JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 174 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. What do you understand those BMP 3 stations to-- 4 A. Those are, from what I understand, are 5 areas of sugar cane production areas that are being 6 managed with the BMP pump water management, BMP 7 practices, and the fertilizer management, BMP water 8 management that are in place. 9 Q. Can you tell me which particular group 10 of BMPs are being used on these, I guess, farms? 11 A. Farms is a good term. 12 From what I understand, all these farms 13 are receiving the same package of BMPs. 14 Q. And what is the package? 15 A. That package is the BMP, control, or 16 water management package of that chart. 17 Q. That is reflected in Exhibits 10 and 11? 18 A. Exactly, that one, and also adhering to 19 the fertilizer management BMPs that are outlined in 20 the SWIM Plan. 21 That's the way I understand it. 22 Q. Any other BMPs as part of that 23 particular package? 24 A. Not that I know of. 25 Q. And so if I wanted to look up the water JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 175 1 quality sampling data for these particular farms, I 2 could turn to the printout at the back, and put them 3 down in the left-hand column and read the water 4 quality data? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. Okay. Number four, BMP cane, without 7 southern unit two. 8 Is-- what do you understand that to be? 9 A. We had quite some discussion about that. 10 Apparently, southern unit two is an 11 operation management unit, that most of it is in 12 sugar cane, but part of it is in native unimproved 13 swampy, range land, intermittent swamp, whatever. 14 I have never been there. I haven't seen 15 it, but that's the way to describe it. 16 And it was number four, it was separated 17 out, because they didn't know what influence that 18 portion of that section, being non-sugar cane 19 production line, would however skew the data set, so 20 this is-- but part of southern unit two, it does 21 have sugar cane in it, under BMPs, so it's with that 22 and without that section, not knowing what the 23 impact of that non-sugarcane land is, by default, 24 included in there. 25 Am I correct in understanding you that JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 176 1 that part of unit four that is planted in sugar 2 cane, it is planted in-- employing the same BMPs as 3 are employed in unit three? 4 MR. GAINES: You mean category three 5 and-- 6 MR. MACFARLANE: Yes. 7 THE WITNESS: Okay. 8 MR. GAINES: You're-- 9 THE WITNESS: Yes, the sugar cane in 10 southern unit two, is BMP managed sugar cane. 11 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 12 Q. Okay. It's just that in number four, we 13 have some other things as well, and those aren't-- 14 A. We don't know how that clouds the 15 picture. 16 Q. What about number five, the next page? 17 BMP acres, including mixed area-- 18 A. I-- 19 Q. BMP veg, and base veg? 20 A. Base, we just read-- that's combination 21 of different areas, different production practices. 22 I think that's pretty-- 23 Q. Number six? 24 A. Number six is west section 34 Weth, 25 section three-- JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 177 1 Q. Would that be Wetherald? 2 A. I believe it is. I think it's shorthand 3 for Wetherald. 4 Vegetable base-- I believe from our 5 discussion, that is the vegetable production area, 6 exclusively production-- vegetable production area, 7 managed under non-BMP conditions. 8 Q. Number seven, EAA permit-- what's your 9 understanding of that? 10 A. I think it's a combination of, 73,000 11 acres, so it's a combination of-- preceding 12 categories. 13 I think that's, again, I-- I don't-- let 14 me just-- it's a combination of a lot of these 15 different subgroups. 16 Q. So the fields that are listed under 17 number seven, might also some of them be previously 18 listed? 19 A. I believe so. Look at number one, 20 occurring south and north of-- 21 Q. Okay. 22 A. Look at number two, occurring south and 23 north. 24 Q. Okay. What significance, if any, do you 25 attach to the EAA permit title at the top of this JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 178 1 column (indicating)? 2 A. For me, none. 3 I think what really-- permitting process 4 with the South Florida Water Management Distict, I 5 feel they are looking for specific permits. 6 Q. Finally, the next page, number eight? 7 A. EAA permit, plus Pahokee Two 8 (indicating). 9 Is that simply adding another area? 10 A. Yes. I think from our discussion, 11 Pahokee Two is on a different permit, for some 12 reason, than the rest of this land is. 13 I don't know why. I just remember it 14 being mentioned, it's different. 15 Q. When you refer to our discussion, are 16 you referring to the talks you have had at U.S. 17 Sugar in March? 18 A. Right, with the gentleman who prepared 19 these (indicating). 20 Q. Going to the next page, comparison of P 21 load into District canals from various components-- 22 can you explain what is being supplied on this page? 23 A. There's numbers nine through 16, and if 24 you go down below it on the second half of the page, 25 it describes what number six is and number ten is, JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 179 1 and nine is the data that came from the farms, I 2 think you told me-- farms, that's right listed under 3 category number one. 4 MR. GAINES: That's why he's the expert. 5 THE WITNESS: Technical terms, these 6 farms. 7 Number ten, comes from the group, number 8 four, in the preceding pages, and-- and let's see. 9 11 and 12 I guess are self-explanatory, the BMP 10 vegetable acres, so forth, and number 13-- just 11 describes where these came from. 12 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 13 Q. I notice in the inner portion of the-- 14 period phosphorus, load per acre, and then load per 15 acre-- 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. Do you know why there were no numbers 18 for those? 19 A. Again, I think those are just for 20 example purposes of the type of data they were 21 collecting. 22 We haven't gotten the data in yet, but 23 just the framework of their data collection. 24 Q. Next page, we have number 12 and 11 25 calculation, and can you just explain to me what JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 180 1 number 12 calculation is? 2 A. Go back on the page preceding, number, 3 BMP vegetable. 4 That's as we're taking the data from 5 those three farms that are listed, and Prewitt One, 6 Wetherald Two, and J.C. Ranch, and the data that 7 yields a total phosphorus load. 8 And then-- he has that designated as 9 12-A. 10 Q. Where would I find data number 12-A? 11 A. You would sum the load from those three, 12 and-- those three named farms out of this list, out 13 of these farms, and-- 14 Q. So you would go and find the farms on 15 the printout; is that correct? 16 A. Right, and you would add up those three, 17 Prewitt One, Wetherald Two and J.C. Ranch, and that 18 gives you a total load from all of your, whatever 19 number 12 is-- all your BMP vegetable land, and that 20 generates 1-A. 21 Q. I understand. Is there a calculation for 22 12-A in this document, that you're aware of? 23 A. Yes. I believe at the end, that-- oh, 24 for 12-A? 25 Q. Yes. Well, actually, for the-- JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 181 1 A. Bottom line. 2 Q. Yes, for number 12, bottom line. 3 A. I don't think the interim numbers-- 4 right here at the end. This is the-- what I have is 5 the next to the last page (indicating). 6 MR. GAINES: This looks like an extra 7 page on here, Steve (indicating). 8 MR. MACFARLANE: Yes, it shouldn't be 9 there. 10 MR. GAINES: You want us to excise that 11 (indicating)? 12 MR. MACFARLANE: Yes, if you wouldn't 13 mind. 14 THE WITNESS: Now this is the last page. 15 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 16 Q. Now the last page. 17 A. Okay. I see it now, okay. And this is 18 the-- these are the bottom line numbers from all of 19 these girations, so forth. 20 Q. All right. 21 A. Machinations. 22 Q. And just so we're clear, I can-- if I go 23 through the same steps, I could figure out how the 24 calculation for number 11 was put together? 25 A. I believe so. I believe those are all in JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 182 1 here. 2 Q. And if we flip over to the page that 3 looks like it was done on a typewriter, title, 4 percentage reduction calculations-- 5 A. Right. 6 Q. Does that work the same way? 7 A. Yes, I believe it does. 8 Q. So number 17-A, number 17-B and number 9 17-C would be where? 10 A. Well, back to 17-A, it says number nine, 11 times that 67,166, equals 17-A, so they have to go 12 back and find out what number nine was, plug it in 13 and multiply it by that, and get 17-A. 14 Q. Now, what do these-- are these basically 15 equations for determining percentage phosphorus 16 reductions from different groups of-- 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. Groups of farms? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. And then let's turn to the printout and 21 look at that. 22 You-- I agree that there's some marginal 23 comments on the printout, and I take it these are 24 not your marginal comments? 25 A. No. I made no comments on this JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 183 1 (indicating). 2 Q. Is it your understanding that this is 3 Mr. McRay's? 4 A. I-- 5 Q. It appears to be the same handwriting. 6 This is his bailiwick, if you will, 7 and-- I suspect the alterations were his doings. 8 Q. And am I correct in that the data 9 reported on this particular printout, are data for-- 10 let me ask you, just-- it says drainage summary 11 report, and is this for one month or one year? 12 A. Well, they are both on here 13 (indicating). 14 MR. GAINES: What page? 15 MR. MACFARLANE: The first page of the 16 computer printout. 17 THE WITNESS: Apparently they generate 18 one of these each month, and this happens to the one 19 for December, so it also had the full year. 20 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 21 Q. And where would you find the-- 22 A. Oh, year to date. 23 I would assume, also, simply the column 24 headed phosphorus load, would, in fact represent the 25 entire year? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 184 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. Let's go to the final page, the-- which 3 sums up, and I would appreciate it, Doctor Coale, if 4 you could take me through, line by line, and just 5 explain-- give me your understanding of what this 6 table shows. 7 Let's start with number nine, base 8 cane-- 9 A. Yes. 10 MR. GAINES: We're starting with number 11 nine, not number one? 12 That's fine. 13 MR. MACFARLANE: There is no number one. 14 Oh, I'm sorry, there is. I apologize. 15 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 16 Q. Let's start with number one. 17 A. I-- 18 Q. I just need to-- you can just go over 19 how the table works, in fact. 20 A. Well, the first eight are the one 21 format, and nine through 16 are on another format, 22 and 17 through 21, another format. 23 Q. Let's try to understand how these 24 formats differ. 25 A. We start with number one. That's your JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 185 1 cane base line data, refers back to data set number 2 one as identified earlier, and across the top of the 3 table, we have data for millions of gallons that 4 were pumped or drained, on a period which is for the 5 month, December of '93, or for the yearly-- the 6 first two columns. 7 The next set of four columns is the 8 period, phosphorus load. That is the phosphorus load 9 for December of '93, in pounds, in kilograms, in 10 pounds per acre and kilograms per acre, and then we 11 have the same four pieces of data, for year to date 12 phosphorus load. 13 Q. So for the cane base line District, the 14 year to date would be what, approximately? 15 A. Year to date what? 16 Q. In pounds. I'm-- 17 A. Phosphorus load? 18 Q. Yes. 19 A. Pounds per acre, 2.32. 20 Q. With a total of 50,000-- 21 A. Yes, divided by however many acres are 22 in that category. 23 Q. Okay. 24 A. The next two columns is period and flow 25 weighted phosphorus concentrations. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 186 1 Again, I believe that Doctor McCray told 2 me at the time, it does not indicate on here, these 3 are-- these are-- the numbers look about right, so I 4 believe that's probably true, but it doesn't say 5 so. 6 Q. It doesn't say so? 7 A. No. 8 The rainfall data over that period, are 9 that same, monthly or annual period. 10 And for the first eight listed here, 11 there's all the same data entries, for all of them. 12 Q. Now, before we go on to the next format, 13 am I correct, is-- are the data that is summarized 14 here, the same data that is reflected in the data 15 that was sent to the Water Management District? 16 Is that your understanding? 17 A. My understanding is that's true. 18 I haven't gone through the raw data, 19 step by step. 20 Q. This is the raw data? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. And this is the summary? 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. So in this first format, it-- we have 25 the first eight categories or groups of farms; is JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 187 1 that correct? 2 A. Yes. That's correct. 3 Q. And then we go to the categories nine 4 through sixteen, and-- 5 A. Right. 6 Q. Do you know why these are presented in a 7 different format than the preceding group? 8 A. Let me look at them for a second. I 9 believe it's a-- let me check it before I go on. 10 Well, if you go back-- I think-- I 11 wanted to hesitate there and make sure I was 12 straight. 13 These numbers are what-- these were-- 14 Q. Yes. 15 A. Were mathematical manipulations of one 16 through eight, based on what we went through earlier 17 about what number nine, ten, eleven is, and 18 therefore, there's no reason to reproduce all this 19 raw data again. 20 Q. Would that also be true for 17 through 21 21 (indicating)? 22 A. Yes. I believe that's true. 23 Well, 17 through 21 is starting to show, 24 actually comparing two of the treatments, and-- like 25 nine through sixteen tells you what the values are JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 188 1 for those situations are, and 17 through 21 is a 2 comparison of two situations. 3 Q. So from 17, load percent reduction 4 estimated with 100 percent BMP, 100 percent using 5 internal vegetable base loads, EAA permit. 6 A. Right. 7 Q. Would you translate that? 8 A. That's a tough one. 9 I would go back to probably-- the 10 definition is-- how it was derived, as we-- the 11 typewritten page-- 12 Q. Yes. 13 A. On how 17 was derived, based on data 14 from-- there were some corrections made for-- you 15 know, for data, subtracting the load from number 16 seven, and corrected form number of acres in each 17 one, gives you a percent reduction as expressed in 18 17. 19 Q. Is that, then-- are we talking in number 20 17, where it says period-- 21 A. Yes. That's for December of '93. 22 Q. Are we talking about 154.51 percent? 23 A. We had a long discussion about this, and 24 I think what it does, it shows you how you need a 25 long term data base to make these decisions. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 189 1 Some of the data we published and we-- 2 from event to event, it changed drasticlaly, time 3 period to time period, and the longer time period 4 you have to integrate this information, the better 5 your estimate, so therefore, just-- these-- these 6 things can be more than one series. 7 Q. Right. The reduction from-- BMP 8 vegetable-- these down here, for-- we have a reading 9 of 400 percent. 10 A. Statistically, all that is telling you 11 about is the variation there is from month-to-month, 12 and over an infinite number of months, these numbers 13 would be the same, the year to date, and-- not the 14 year to date, but infinity, you know, dated to 15 infinity-- and the period would be the same, and so 16 the longer period, to integrate the variation-- the 17 more accurate your predictions are going to be. 18 Q. Do you know how long this data has been 19 collected and reported? 20 I know you have produced data for 1993, 21 but do we go-- do you know if U.S. Sugar has been 22 reporting data before 1993? 23 A. I don't know. 24 If they have, the District should have 25 it. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 190 1 I don't know. This is the only data I 2 have had a chance to look at. 3 Q. Let me ask you, for number 17 on the 4 final page, where it says 154.51 percent-- 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. I infer from what you said, that you 7 don't think that is a believable figure. 8 A. I agree. 9 Q. Should we have similar scepticism with 10 the figures about the year to date, the 86.6 percent 11 reduction? 12 A. No. I think that's based on 12 times as 13 much data than that monthly figure. 14 We have seen the-- you have that many 15 number of entries into a data set, it cleans it up 16 quite a bit. 17 Q. Do you know how often sampling was done? 18 A. I-- 19 Q. That went into this data set? 20 A. There was data entered every day, so-- 21 Q. We're talking about days-- 22 A. Some days-- some days, when there's no 23 drainage going on, it was zero, but entries every 24 day. 25 Q. In your opinion, does daily sampling JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 191 1 make for more reliable data, than, let's say, 2 biweekly or weekly sampling, sampling, you know, not 3 on a daily basis, but on a regular, periodic basis? 4 A. I don't know if I can answer that or 5 not. 6 Subsequently, the more independent 7 measurements you have in a data set, the stronger 8 your conclusions can be from that data set. 9 As far as in this example, their water 10 quality data is a composite over a period of 14 11 days, something like that, then-- so they are 12 looking at two week intervals for water quality to 13 be measured, and that's a lot of data in a year. 14 That is giving you a pretty good data base to be 15 relied upon. 16 Q. How long a period of time, and I guess 17 I'm speaking now in terms of years-- would you feel 18 comfortable with, in-- against sampling data on a 19 daily basis, to know where the year to date 20 reduction is reported on this table, are, in fact, 21 what one could expect to see over the long run? 22 A. I can't give an answer to that. 23 I don't know how long it would take, but 24 there are statistical methods to let you know. 25 Q. Do you know if those statistical methods JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 192 1 have been applied in this case? 2 A. I don't know. 3 Q. I just want to go back over, generally, 4 the-- we've talked about SWIM Plan BMPs, and within 5 that, I guess, a subset, I guess what we could call 6 the water management BMPs, also extended to include 7 the pump practices. 8 A. Right. 9 Q. We have talked in detail about sediment 10 control type BMPs. 11 Does that pretty much exhuast the BMPs 12 that you would be prepared to testify about at the 13 final hearing? 14 A. That's by far the bulk of them. 15 I think I mentioned earlier, I was given 16 a little discourse about what they have done around 17 the sugar mills for discharge, but I'm not an expert 18 in that area. 19 Just what I have learned from 20 observations and discussions with people. 21 Q. Do you anticipate giving any testimony 22 about lime rock sorption, for example? 23 A. I don't anticipate it. 24 Q. Do you consider lime rock sorption to be 25 practical as an on-farm BMP? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 193 1 A. In theory it makes sense, in some cases, 2 but I haven't seen any data. 3 Q. What is your understanding of lime rock 4 sorption? 5 A. There's-- the limestone rock has a 6 chemical affinity, for lack of a better term of 7 mixing with dissolved phosphorus in water sometimes, 8 and essentially, making it no longer dissolved, no 9 longer mobile, decrease the mobility, but I haven't 10 seen much data on lime rock sorption. 11 Q. Am I correct in understanding that most 12 of the phosphorus controlled BMPs that you focused 13 on, you're most familiar with, are BMPs to-- 14 designed to reduce phosphorus in a particular form, 15 as opposed to dissolved phosphorus, or is that-- 16 A. No, not necessarily. 17 Q. Are you aware of any places in the EAA, 18 where lime rock sorption has been put into practice? 19 A. No. Not that I can recall, no. 20 Q. Do you-- would you recommend lime rock 21 sorption as an on-farm BMP? 22 A. Not without reviewing any data that 23 shows its of use. 24 Q. How about on-farm chemical treatment? 25 Would you be expected to testify about JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 194 1 that? 2 A. Could you define chemical treatment? 3 Q. Building a-- for example, building a 4 small facility on a farm in which a precipitator or 5 coagulator is added to farm drainage water, to 6 produce a precipitant that-- 7 A. No. 8 Q. Are you aware of any on-farm chemical 9 treatment being tried in the EAA, on an experimental 10 basis? 11 A. Experimental basis, I have seen a 12 project underway. 13 I don't know what the results of that 14 project turned out to be. 15 Q. Do you know where that project is? 16 A. I know where it was. 17 Q. Where was it? 18 A. It was at the Everglades Research and 19 Education Center. 20 Q. But you don't know whether any hard data 21 has been produced? 22 A. I haven't seen any. 23 Q. How about algal turf scrubbers? 24 A. I have heard of them, but I haven't seen 25 them. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 195 1 Q. Are you aware of algal turf scrubbers 2 being used to treat agricultural runoff? 3 A. On a commercial-- all I heard-- I never 4 saw-- there was a triosize facility somewhere in the 5 EAA, and I think the Smithsonian Institution had 6 something to do with it, and I-- but you never saw 7 it, never saw the data. 8 Q. Algal turf scrubbers wouldn't be a BMP 9 that you would be able to recommend? 10 A. I wouldn't be able to talk about it, one 11 way or another. 12 Q. Sediment dredging-- are you aware of-- I 13 know we have talked about sediment control BMPs, but 14 are you aware of sediment dredging, a separate type 15 of BMP, or just another example of sediment control, 16 generic BMP? 17 A. Are you referring to hydraulic dredging 18 of canals? 19 Q. Yes, something like that. 20 A. I have heard of it. 21 I never seen it. I think it's a good 22 idea, it makes sense, but I couldn't testify as to 23 its efficacy. 24 Q. How about ASR wells? 25 A. I know nothing about them. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 196 1 Q. Rock pits? 2 A. For rocks? 3 No. 4 Q. Just taking the group of BMPs, on-farm 5 BMPs-- let me back up. 6 Have we pretty much exhausted the 7 on-farm BMPs that you would be prepared to testify 8 about? 9 A. I believe we have covered it. 10 Q. Taking those on-farm BMPs, do you have 11 an opinion whether implementation of those BMPs, 12 could meet State water quality standards for water 13 discharged from the EAA to the-- 14 A. What-- 15 Q. You're unaware of the State water-- 16 A. Let me interrupt your question. 17 Are we talking about the reduction 18 stated in the SWIM Plan, the 25 percent reduction 19 in-- are those the standards? 20 Q. I'm interested in what your 21 understanding it, if you have one. 22 MR. GAINES: He's not listed as an expert 23 as to State water quality standards. 24 He can give testimony about what is 25 going to come out of the EAA, but where that fits JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 197 1 into the universal State water quality standards, I 2 think is outside of his field. 3 MR. MACFARLANE: I believe he is listed 4 as being prepared to give an opinion, as to whether 5 State water quality standards could be met. 6 We'll get to that, but I'll just-- I was 7 interested in-- 8 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 9 Q. Do you have any idea what, for example, 10 the class three water quality standards are for the 11 water conservation areas? 12 A. No. 13 Q. Let me ask you a hypothetical. 14 If it were shown that long term weighted 15 average concentrations of phosphorus in excess of 16 ten parts per billion would cause an imbalance of 17 flora and fauna in water conservation area one, for 18 example, do you think that the on-farm BMPs, alone, 19 could reduce phosphorus levels to reach that low a 20 concentration of phosphorus, ten parts per billion? 21 MR. GAINES: Let me object to the form of 22 the question. 23 I don't know what the first half of the 24 question has to do with the second half of the 25 question, and also, I would like to know, what JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 198 1 hydroperiod changes and manipulations-- are you 2 talking about the current, unnatural hydroperiod 3 that's been imposed by the federal project, or 4 natural hydroperiod, or what? 5 I think-- 6 MR. MACFARLANE: Let's hold the 7 hydroperiod constant, and just let me ask you. 8 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 9 Q. Do you think that the on-farm BMPs, with 10 which you're familiar or prepared to testify about, 11 could reduce phosphorus loading of the-- a 12 sufficient magnitude to meet ten parts per billion 13 contraction? 14 A. No. 15 Q. Do you think that the on-farm BMPs about 16 which you're prepared to testify-- could those, by 17 themselves, produce an 80 percent reduction in 18 phosphorus discharged from the EAA into the water 19 conversation areas? 20 MR. GAINES: Are you talking about from 21 the historic 1979 to 1988 base line? 22 MR. MACFARLANE: Yes. We'll assume that 23 base line. 24 THE WITNESS: I think 80 percent is 25 high. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 199 1 I don't think they can do 80 percent. 2 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 3 Q. Out of curiosity, do you have an opinion 4 as to maximum practicable phosphorus load reduction 5 can be achieved just from the implementation of the 6 on-farm BMPs that you're familiar with? 7 A. I would think that a practical-- you 8 could get reduction in the neighborhood of about 50 9 percent. 10 Q. And would those-- would it be-- well, 11 let me ask you first, is that opinion based upon the 12 data that you have reviewed and we've discussed 13 today? 14 A. That's part of it, in my opinion. 15 Q. What else would it be based on? 16 A. My experience I have had working in the 17 area and its diversity. 18 Q. Do you have an opinion whether a 50 19 percent reduction, and we're taking about-- when I 20 say 50 percent reduction, I'm talking about 21 basinwide-- would be cost effective? 22 A. I don't have an opinion. I don't. 23 I don't make any dollars and cents 24 judgements. 25 Q. So would it be your testimony, then, JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 200 1 that to achieve an 80 percent or an 85 percent 2 reduction in phosphorus load over the 1979 or 1988-- 3 to '88 base line period, some additional technology 4 over and above on-farm BMPs, would have to be 5 employed? 6 A. If a mandatory 80 or 85 percent-- I 7 believe so. 8 Q. Do you-- and I believe you have already 9 answered this, but let me just-- do you anticipate-- 10 MR. GAINES: I object. 11 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 12 Q. You don't anticipate testifying about 13 basinwide or EAA wide alternatives to STAs? 14 A. No. 15 Q. Let me ask you, have you reviewed or 16 been asked to review-- 17 A. Can I stop? 18 Q. Yes. 19 A. I said no, I wanted to make sure-- I'm 20 trying to cover my terminology. 21 As an alternative-- getting us back to 22 the very-- 23 Q. Let me ask you, basinwide or EAA wide 24 alternatives. 25 A. But on-farm BMPs are or are they not, an JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 201 1 alternative? 2 MR. GAINES: Maybe I can help. 3 When you're asking about basinwide 4 alternatives to STAs, you're referring to 5 technologies, essentially treating on a basinwide 6 scale, probably associated with the four pump 7 stations-- 8 MR. MACFARLANE: Yes. I'm distinguishing 9 basinwide from on-farm. 10 THE WITNESS: Okay. I've be talking 11 on-farm practices. 12 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 13 Q. Only? 14 A. Yes. 15 Q. Let me ask you, Doctor Coale, have you 16 reviewed or been asked to review, any report by 17 Burns and MacDonald, published on or about February 18 4, 1994? 19 A. I don't recall the name, Burns and 20 MacDonald, at all. 21 Q. Have you ever reviewed any reports by 22 Burns and MacDonald, produced for the South Florida 23 Water Management District? 24 A. I'm hesitating, because the names of the 25 different authors haven't stuck with me that JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 202 1 tightly. 2 I don't recognize Burns and MacDonald. 3 Maybe they had a topic matter that I might be more 4 familiar with. 5 I don't remember Burns and MacDonald. 6 Q. Have you read a report entitled 7 Everglades Protection Project, Adjustment to EAA 8 Discharges Due to Implementation of Best Management 9 Practices, dated February 4, 1994, and I'll just 10 show it to you? 11 I don't want to make it an exhibit. If 12 you haven't read it, I don't want to ask any 13 questions about it. 14 A. No. I don't believe I have read that. 15 Q. Do you anticipate you might have 16 occasion to read it before the final hearing? 17 A. I don't have a copy of it. 18 MR. MACFARLANE: Let's take a break. 19 (Thereupon a recess was taken 20 in the deposition, after which 21 the deposition continued as follows:) 22 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 23 Q. Back on the record. 24 Doctor Coale, let me just ask you if you 25 have come across another report or had occasion to JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 203 1 read a report, called Historical Phosphorus Loads 2 for the EAA. 3 Does that ring a bell, another Burns and 4 MacDonald report? 5 A. I don't believe so. 6 (The document referred to 7 was thereupon marked as 8 Coale Exhibit Number 9 13 for Identification, 10 a copy of which is attached 11 hereto.) 12 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 13 Q. Doctor Coale, you've just been handed 14 what's been marked as Exhibit Number 13, which is a 15 draft report entitled Evaluation of On-farm Best 16 Management Practices, submitted to the South Florida 17 Water Management District on February 18, 1993, by 18 Brown and Caldwell, Consultants. 19 Are you familiar with this report 20 (indicating)? 21 A. Yes, I am. I have seen it and read parts 22 of it. 23 Q. You have read parts of it? 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. Can you give me an idea from the table JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 204 1 of contents, for example, what parts you have read? 2 A. It looks like-- as far as I can 3 remember, it's been some time, one, two, three-- I 4 believe chapter four has got-- let me back up a 5 second. 6 Not in its entirety. 7 I can tell you, any time we got into 8 discussion of cost of implementation, dollars and 9 cents, I skipped over it. 10 I told every one up front, I'm not going 11 to do any economic analysis. 12 Q. You don't anticipate offering any 13 testimony as to the cost effectiveness of the BMPs 14 or other on-farm practices on which you would be 15 called to testify? 16 A. Right. 17 Q. And you've done-- have you-- let me ask 18 you this: Have you ever done any cost analysis of 19 any BMP, on-farm BMP? 20 A. No. 21 Q. You don't consider yourself an expert in 22 that field, for-- 23 A. No. Not at all, no. 24 Q. Well, let me ask you a few questions 25 about this report, and before I do that, let me ask JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 205 1 you, would you be relying on anything contained in 2 this document as part of your testimony? 3 A. There's nothing novel-- let's see. I 4 won't be relying on anything that is solely in this 5 document. 6 I read through it. I didn't go over all 7 the dollars and cents issues. 8 Q. Would I be correct in thinking that to 9 that extent that you would rely on this document or 10 this document would form your testimony, it would 11 rest on the question of whether a particular BMP 12 worked and how well, in terms of reducing 13 phosphorus? 14 Would that be a fair statement? 15 A. Based on their evaluation as presented 16 here? 17 Q. Yes. 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. Fair enough. 20 Let me ask you to turn to page two-three 21 (indicating). 22 A. (Witness complies.) 23 Q. And in the second paragraph, it says, 24 "In addition to a review of the work by Bottcher 25 and Izuno," and I believe that would include some of JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 206 1 the work that you're familiar with-- 2 A. Uh-hum. 3 Q. Members of the Brown and Caldwell 4 project team held discussions with other IFAS 5 researchers and local representatives of the IFAS 6 extension service and soil conservation service, to 7 obtain their input on past and present farm 8 practices in the EAA. 9 My question, Doctor Coale, were you 10 among the people who had discussions with Brown and 11 Caldwell? 12 A. Not that I recall. 13 Q. This report was produced, I believe, 14 prior to July of 1993, when you left? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. When you left the University of Florida? 17 A. Right. 18 I don't recall-- of course, I talked to 19 so many people, that-- 20 Q. You have no specific recollection of 21 having had your views solicited by anyone from the 22 firm of Brown and Caldwell? 23 A. No. 24 Q. Let's go to page 3-3, and I call your 25 attention first to the-- it's a little hard to read, JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 207 1 but the marginal comment (indicating). 2 Do you recognize the handwriting to the 3 extent you can read it (indicating)? 4 A. I can't read it at all on my copy. 5 Q. I have the copy, that-- from which that 6 copy was made, and I have a hard time reading it, 7 too, but do you recall making any markings in the 8 copy that you reviewed? 9 A. I-- 10 Q. Would this be your handwriting, for 11 example, to the extent that one can read it? 12 A. I don't recall making any marginal 13 comment, and I don't think-- I usually don't write 14 that small. 15 Q. All right. 16 A. I continued to use-- not to use 17 highlighters, instead of-- 18 Q. Let me direct your attention to the 19 second paragraph from the bottom, "The effectiveness 20 of sediment control BMPs, may also be reduced by 21 implementation of the pump schedule BMP." 22 Do you understand that to be the same 23 pump practice BMP that we were discussing earlier? 24 A. I-- 25 Q. If you look over to table 3-1 on the JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 208 1 previous-- on this table, three-one, without 2 dissecting it, is the same one we looked at, from 3 the-- 4 A. I'll accept that qualification. I 5 believe that it is. I'm not-- 6 Q. We'll assume that it is. 7 A. Okay. 8 Q. "The effectiveness of sediment control 9 BMPs may also be reduced by implementation of the 10 pump schedule BMP." 11 Accepting that qualification, do you 12 believe that's a true statement? 13 MR. GAINES: Accepting-- 14 MR. MACFARLANE: The qualification that 15 we're not certain that the Florida Sugar Cane League 16 modified pumping practices, is the identical to the 17 one we talked about today. 18 MR. GAINES: For purposes of this 19 question, you're referring to the sediment control 20 BMPs, that were talked about in the pump schedule, 21 BMPs-- 22 MR. GAINES: Right. 23 MR. MACFARLANE: Yes. 24 MR. GAINES: Okay. 25 THE WITNESS: Let me, then-- JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 209 1 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 2 Q. You can reread the statement, and my 3 question is, do you agree with that? 4 A. Yes. That's a possibility. 5 Q. And I'll finish the paragraph, just so 6 we're-- I'm not reading stuff too much out of 7 context. 8 "With improved water table management, 9 the quantity of sediment being displaced from farm 10 fields, ditches and canals into the District canals, 11 will be reduced. Therefore, there will be less 12 potential for sediment control practices to further 13 reduce phosphorus load." 14 Would you agree with that (indicating)? 15 A. That statement makes sense. 16 It doesn't-- I can't stretch it to mean 17 that it would render any-- effective, ineffective, 18 any sediment control BMPs. 19 MR. GAINES: By the way, that's my 20 marginal comment. 21 THE WITNESS: What does it say? 22 MR. GAINES: It says, "Not well worded." 23 I thought I would throw that in. 24 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 25 Q. Let me ask you to turn to the tables JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 210 1 that follow, page 3-37, and let me, in particular, 2 direct your attention to table 3-16, and let me ask 3 you to look at section D of that table, entitled 4 Sediment Control (indicating). 5 A. Uh-hum. 6 Q. And ask you to look over on the far 7 right-hand column, where it's headed, Phosphorus 8 Reduction on eAA Sugar Cane Land Percentage, and ask 9 you whether you agree or disagree with the 10 percentage reduction figures given in that table, 11 and take your time, and please-- please take your 12 time and review it. 13 A. (Witness complies.) 14 MR. GAINES: Just for my clarification, 15 you're asking him about the final column, as opposed 16 to the ranges? 17 MR. MACFARLANE: I'll also ask him about 18 the ranges, as well. 19 MR. GAINES: All right. 20 THE WITNESS: Okay. I would have to go 21 back and look at what their grouping-- I would 22 like-- maybe that wouldn't be necessary. 23 Overall, compared to the numbers I saw 24 that were generated, that we talked about, these 25 look very low, compared to the numbers that they JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 211 1 generated. 2 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 3 Q. Would it be your opinion that these 4 numbers are too low, or to flip it around, that it 5 would be likely that sugar cane farmers could do 6 better than those numbers on sediment control BMPs? 7 A. I don't think I can say that, but I 8 don't know and I don't recall how much was presented 9 here, and how those were generated. 10 All I can say, there's a big different 11 between these numbers and the sediment control 12 practices, the data collected that I was familiar 13 with. 14 Q. Let me ask you to flip back to page 15 3-35, which has the bottom paragraph, which has 16 lines around it for-- let me read this, and again, 17 my question will be, again, would you agree or 18 disagree; "The effectiveness levels for the sediment 19 control BMPs used in this evaluation are necessarily 20 judgemental, due to the lack of available 21 performance data on which to prepare documentable 22 estimates," and my question about whether you agree 23 or disagree, really goes to the statement about the 24 lack of available performance data. 25 Do you believe that there's a lack of-- JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 212 1 do you agree that there's a lack of available 2 performance data on which to prepare documentable 3 estimates? 4 MR. GAINES: Object to the form. 5 You mean as to what Brown and Caldwell 6 had available when it came to this report? 7 MR. MACFARLANE: Yes. 8 MR. GAINES: If you know. 9 THE WITNESS: I don't know what they had 10 available. 11 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 12 Q. Do you believe that the data that's been 13 produced and that you produced for your deposition, 14 since February of 1993-- well, let me withdraw that 15 question. 16 Do you believe that the data that you 17 reviewed from United States Sugar, presented to you 18 prior to you visiting in March of 1994, would 19 satisfy you as to the adequacy in calculating or 20 estimating a range of phosphorus reduction from 21 sediment control BMPs? 22 MR. GAINES: Object to the form. 23 You can answer. 24 THE WITNESS: I think we've already gone 25 over some of the limitations of that data, and I JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 213 1 think, like I stated before, there are strong 2 indications there's great potential there, but we 3 need to flush it out with as much information as we 4 can get. 5 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 6 Q. I apologize, and should have asked you 7 to review the sediment control BMPs listed in table 8 3-13, which appears on 3-33, and let's be sure on 9 what we're considering here. 10 Would you review, just quickly, those 11 sediment controls and the way that Brown and 12 Caldwell had categorized them, into field erosion 13 control, ditch sediment and canal sediment control, 14 and my question is, do you understand this list of 15 BMPs to be the same as these we reviewed earlier 16 this afternoon? 17 A. It looks like a very similar list. 18 Q. So back back to table 3-16-- 19 A. 3-16? 20 Q. Yes. Looking at the sediment control, 21 understanding now what they considered for field 22 erosion, ditch sediment control and canal sediment 23 control in section D of this table-- 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. Your testimony is that the ranges-- if JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 214 1 these sediment control BMPs were fully implemented-- 2 A. Okay. 3 Q. The ranges, for example, of field 4 erosion control from two to fifteen percent 5 reduction in phosphorus, could be improved upon? 6 A. Yes. 7 Q. My question to you, Doctor Coale, is in 8 the data sheet that we reviewed earlier today, do 9 you recall reading percentage reductions in 10 phosphorus, as opposed to percentage reductions in 11 sediment or soil? 12 MR. GAINES: This was referring to all of 13 the data sheets? 14 MR. MACFARLANE: The data sheets having 15 to do with field erosion control. 16 THE WITNESS: I would have to go back and 17 review it. 18 Most of the sediment load, and some of 19 the practices had data on phosphorus load 20 reductions. 21 MR. MACFARLANE: I'm not sure which ones 22 were which at this point. 23 I have to go back and look at them. 24 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 25 Q. Do you recall having reviewed any data JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 215 1 from U.S. Sugar on phosphorus reduction potential, 2 for each of the field erosion control BMPs? 3 A. I don't believe that data was available 4 for each one of them. 5 Q. How about ditch sediment control? 6 Working back and referring-- 7 A. Some of them had some phosphorus 8 numbers, and some didn't. 9 Q. I understnad. I'm not trying to stump 10 you. It's been a long afternoon. Let's make sure we 11 aren't comparing apples and oranges or rice and 12 sugar cane. 13 MR. GAINES: Let's make sure we're not 14 doing that, but-- 15 THE WITNESS: It's probably easier to see 16 which is-- 17 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 18 Q. Could you identify which of these data 19 sheets provides phosphorus data? 20 A. I'm looking at both sets here 21 (indicating). 22 Vegetative ditch banks, there's 23 phosphorus data for. 24 Q. All right. That would be a-- that's a 25 field practice, I believe, under this JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 216 1 categorization. 2 Cover crops, there is phosphorus data, 3 field cover crops, field ditch sumps-- there is 4 phosphorus data on those. 5 Parallel canal system, there's 6 phosphorus data. 7 Sediment trap, there's phosphorus data; 8 and ditch cleaning, there's phosphorus data. 9 That's all out of Exhibit Number Eight 10 (indicating). 11 Exhibit Number Nine, again, the grass 12 ditch bank, there's phosphorus data. 13 Q. And, in fact, I think we can agree that 14 all of the data sheets in Exhibit Number Nine, give 15 those. 16 A. Okay. 17 Q. Reduction data, so would it be correct 18 to say that your opinion that the data ranges in 19 table 3-16 in the Brown and Caldwell report, your 20 opinion that these data ranges are too low, would be 21 based upon the data that you have reviewed, in 22 exhibits-- what was it-- eight and nine, as to where 23 those data sheets give those reductions? 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. Would that-- JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 217 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. Would you be relying on any other data 3 as to phosphorus reduction to dispute the accuracy 4 of these estimates in table 3-16, the Brown and 5 Caldwell report? 6 Have you seen any other data? 7 A. No. None. 8 Q. Let me ask you, Doctor Coale, I know you 9 said you haven't reviewed or you stayed away from 10 the cost estimates that appear in chapter four of 11 the Brown and Caldwell report-- 12 A. Also, the cost estimates-- 13 Q. I understand that there were some in the 14 beginning, too, but let me ask you, did you review 15 at the beginning-- let me see. On page 4-5, there 16 are-- there's an evaluation-- 17 I'll wait till you find it. 18 A. Okay. 19 Q. There's an evaluation of BMP 20 reliability. 21 Did you evaluate that evaluation? 22 A. No, I don't believe I did. 23 Q. So you have no opinion as to the 24 evaluation that's presented here (indicating)? 25 A. That's true. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 218 1 Q. And do you have an opinion as to the 2 reliability factors that are summarized in tables 3 4-4? 4 A. No. 5 Q. Do you recall having reviewed that 6 table? 7 A. No. 8 Q. Let me ask you to turn back to page nine 9 in the executive summary portion. 10 A. (Witness complies.) 11 Q. And let me read under effectiveness of 12 sediment control BMPs, the first paragraph, which 13 reads, limited data exists to document the 14 effectiveness of sediment control practices in 15 reducing phosphorus load from farms in the EAA. 16 A. Can you hold on one second? 17 Okay. I was on the wrong paragraph. 18 Q. I believe we have-- you have already 19 commented on that point, when it appeared later on. 20 I'll continue. "The Florida Sugar Cane 21 League has suggested that as much as 50 percent of 22 the total phosphorus pumped out of the EAA, may be 23 in the particulate form, based on its analysis of 24 historical water quality data from the District's 25 pumping stations." JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 219 1 My question to you is, have you done an 2 analysis of historical water data from the 3 District's-- 4 A. No. 5 Q. Would you agree with that statement? 6 A. I think I used that 50 percent, too. 7 Q. It was different. You were talking about 8 50 percent phosphorus reduction-- 9 A. No. It was particulates. 10 Q. So would you agree with this statement? 11 A. I think 50 percent particulate and 50 12 percent dissolved phosphorus, fractions of totaling 13 phosphorus, is a ballpark average. 14 Q. And then to continue, "In theory, 15 retention of soil and sediments on-farm, should 16 reduce sediment buildup in the District's canals, 17 and eventually should result in reduced discharge of 18 particulate phosphorus out of the EAA. However, 19 there is no data to support a definitive statement 20 for those reductions resulting from sediment control 21 BMPs, either individually or as an aggreagate." 22 Do you agree or disagree with that 23 statement? 24 MR. GAINES: Again, are you asking him 25 whether-- JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 220 1 MR. MACFARLANE: I'm asking whether he 2 disagrees or agrees with the last sentence. 3 MR. GAINES: I know. My question is, are 4 you referring to whether he agrees that Brown and 5 Caldwell had no data or whether as he sits here 6 today, there's no data? 7 MR. MACFARLANE: Well, I'm not going to-- 8 MR. GAINES: Or something else. 9 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 10 Q. Do you-- well, do you know whether Brown 11 and Caldwell had any data to review? 12 A. I have no way of knowing that. 13 Q. I didn't think so. 14 I assume as you sit here today, would it 15 be fair to say that you would disagree with that 16 statement? 17 A. I have seen sediment control BMP data. 18 Q. Do you know whether that data reflects a 19 definitive estimate of phosphorus reduction 20 resulting from sediment control BMPs? 21 A. No. 22 As I mentioned earlier, I think it 23 indicates the potential usefulness of these sediment 24 BMPs. 25 Q. So you would agree with that statement, JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 221 1 would you know not, the last sentence? 2 A. There's the data-- 3 No, I can't agree with that, as it's 4 there now. 5 Q. You cannot agree with it? 6 A. No. 7 Q. Let me skip over the next paragraph, and 8 ask you to look at the next paragraph, and-- in our 9 opinion, ditch and canal sediment control practices, 10 can reduce phosphorus loads by as much as 15 percent 11 on some highly erosive farms. 12 Do you agree or disagree with that? 13 A. That's in line with the estimate I gave 14 earlier for the EAA, as a whole, but however, we 15 assume that the load reduction potential is less 16 than ten percent. 17 There's no specific performance data on 18 which to base these estimates, and I agreed-- 19 Q. And I would imagine that you are-- would 20 you agree or disagree with this? 21 MR. GAINES: With which sentence? 22 MR. MACFARLANE: The third sentence in 23 the paragraph. 24 THE WITNESS: I believe now there is some 25 performance data. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 222 1 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 2 Q. Do you believe the performance data that 3 you've seen, is adequate on which to base a 4 definitive estimate of the performance of sediment 5 control BMPs? 6 MR. GAINES: Objection. 7 This has been asked and answered several 8 times now. 9 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 10 Q. Do you want to answer it one more time? 11 MR. GAINES: I am not instructing him not 12 to answer, but I think we have gone over the same 13 testimony a few times. 14 Go ahead and say it again. 15 THE WITNESS: I reitterate, unless 16 there's strong indication-- there's some great 17 potential there that needs to be further explored. 18 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 19 Q. I want to shift gears a little bit, and 20 ask you, Doctor Coale, have you ever studied or 21 reviewed data on the water quality in the-- water 22 quality in the water conservation areas? 23 A. No. 24 Q. Do you know if the BMPs that you're 25 prepared to testify on the final hearing, would JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 223 1 reduce load of other nutrients, other than 2 phosphorus; for example, nitrogen? 3 A. They have a potential, too. 4 Q. Have you-- are you aware of any data 5 that has analyzed the effect of any of the BMPs on 6 which you would testify, any other nutrient, other 7 than phosphorus? 8 A. The only data I'm familiar with, would 9 be some nitrogen data that's incorporated into one 10 of the manuscripts we wrote last year. 11 Q. One of the three published papers that 12 you provided us? 13 A. Right. 14 Q. Do you know whether the BMPs on which 15 you're prepared to testify, would treat metals that 16 might be found in water flowing off the EAA? 17 A. How do you define metals? 18 Q. Any metallic compound, such as iron, for 19 example, and mercury-- 20 A. Can you repeat the question, now that I 21 know what metals are? 22 Q. Do you have any opinion as to whether 23 the BMPs that you're prepared to testify on, would 24 reduce concentrations of metals, those metals in 25 water flowing out of the EAA? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 224 1 A. I haven't seen any data relative to 2 that. 3 Q. How about pesticide? 4 A. I haven't seen that data, either. 5 Q. Have you ever been to the Everglades? 6 A. Uh-hum. 7 Q. Have you been to the-- 8 MR. GAINES: I thought you were asking 9 for a-- 10 Off the record. 11 (Discussion off the record.) 12 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 13 Q. Have you been to, let's say, the 14 Loxahatchee National Wildlife Refuge? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. When? Do you recall? 17 A. Several occasions when I was living in 18 South Florida. 19 Q. How about Everglades National Park? 20 A. I have never been there, no. 21 Q. Have you ever been to the interior 22 marshes of Loxahatchee? 23 A. No. 24 Q. Did you go on an air boat ride? 25 A. No. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 225 1 MR. MACFARLANE: I assume that Doctor 2 Coale would lawfully obtain a use permit to go and 3 undertake research, and not trespass. 4 MR. GAINES: I thought you were going to 5 try to get him arrested. 6 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 7 Q. Do you have any understanding of the 8 Everglades, or to be more precise, the Loxahatchee 9 National Wildlife Refuge, as an oligotrophic 10 ecosystem? 11 MR. GAINES: Wait a minute. You're 12 asking him questions about whether the Loxahatchee 13 is oligotrophic? 14 MR. MACFARLANE: I asked if he has an 15 understanding of that. 16 MR. GAINES: Why don't you ask him how he 17 thinks the Marlins are going to do this year. 18 That has nothing to do-- 19 MR. MACFARLANE: Actually, I want to know 20 whether he has any understanding of the water 21 quality in which EAA waters are discharged, and if 22 that helps your-- to let you know where I'm coming 23 from, let me restate the question. 24 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 25 Q. Do you-- would you agree that the JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 226 1 Everglades is an oligotrophic ecosystem? 2 MR. GAINES: Same objection. 3 I think it's outside his scope of expert 4 testimony. 5 MR. MACFARLANE: Are you instructing him 6 not to answer? 7 MR. GAINES: There are ample experts in 8 this case that have an opinion and have been asked 9 to form an opinion on that very issue. 10 MR. MACFARLANE: I understand that. I'm-- 11 I just want to know if he knows, or if he has any-- 12 MR. GAINES: If he feels comfortable 13 offering an expert opinion in that area-- 14 MR. MACFARLANE: I am not asking if he 15 has an expert opinion in that area. I'm asking if he 16 has an opinion or if he agrees with the statement. 17 MR. GAINES: Well, if you're asking him 18 for an opinion and it's not expert opinion, then I 19 would instruct him that he's not here to give 20 non-expert opinions, and I don't think you should be 21 going into those kinds of questions. 22 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 23 Q. Do you have any understanding of the 24 ecosystem of the water conservation areas? 25 MR. GAINES: Object to the form. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 227 1 His understanding? 2 THE WITNESS: I'm not an ecosystem 3 biologist, so I would say no, by any stretch of the 4 imagination. 5 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 6 Q. Do you have any understanding as-- of 7 the phosphorus requirement for the receiving waters 8 below the EAA? 9 MR. GAINES: I'm just going to continue 10 to object to any question, and maybe you'll give me 11 a continuing objection, any question that has, do 12 you have any understanding, in it. 13 I object to that. 14 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 15 Q. Do you have any knowledge of the 16 phosphorus requirements of the receiving waters 17 below the EAA? 18 MR. GAINES: Same objection. 19 THE WITNESS: I don't know what you mean 20 by receiving waters. 21 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 22 Q. The waters into which the water 23 discharged out into the EAA. 24 A. No. 25 Q. Okay. Let me ask one last thing. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 228 1 Well, let's have this marked 2 (indicating). 3 (The document referred to 4 was thereupon marked as 5 Coale Exhibit Number 6 14 for Identification, 7 a copy of which is attached 8 hereto.) 9 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 10 Q. Doctor, I'm handing you what's been 11 marked as Exhibit Number 14 (indicating). 12 And this is a document entitled, 13 Pretrial Disclosure of Issues and Witnesses. 14 Have you ever seen this document before, 15 Doctor Coale (indicating)? 16 A. I don't believe I have. 17 Q. I'll represent to you that this document 18 consists of a series of numbered assertions by 19 petitioners, Florida Sugar Cane League and United 20 States Sugar, with the names and addresses of 21 witnesses who are to give testimony about these 22 assertions. 23 A. Uh-hum. 24 Q. And let me ask you if you would turn to 25 page four, and to look at assertion number three, JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 229 1 and I would just like you to flip the page to page 2 five (indicating). 3 Do you recognize your name on the-- 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. My question is, assertion-- the 6 numbered-- assertion number three, is whether the 7 SWIM Plan correctly identifies, evaluates the 8 impacts of and assigns remedies for all sources of 9 phosphorus loading into the EPA, and my question to 10 you, Doctor Coale, is do you anticipate giving 11 testimony on that assertion? 12 A. Well-- 13 MR. GAINES: Wait a minute. Let me 14 object. 15 You said EAA, and I think you meant 16 EPA. 17 MR. MACFARLANE: I'm sorry. That's my 18 mistake. 19 MR. GAINES: This is essentially a legal 20 document, and I think you're asking him to interpret 21 legal issues, and it's not for him to do that. 22 This was a document that was put 23 together by the attorneys, and I'm not sure that 24 he's the appropriate party to interpret the legal 25 ramifications or issues that are set forth in this JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 230 1 document, so I would object to that. 2 Just, for example, on this number 3 three-- we'll let him answer the question, and if I 4 have a different answer, I'll let you know. 5 THE WITNESS: Okay. Your question is 6 what? 7 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 8 Q. My question is, do you anticipate 9 testifying on any of the aspects or parts of that 10 assertion, which may be a different question, 11 actually? 12 A. That's not the way I would categorize 13 what I'm going to testify to. 14 MR. GAINES: And just so we're clear, I 15 think that his testimony would fall within that 16 description, or at least a portion of that 17 description, and this is the problem with him-- 18 asking him to go through this legal document. 19 MR. MACFARLANE: Let me break it down, 20 then, because I don't want to mislead him or-- I'm 21 not looking for his views on legal conclusions. 22 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 23 Q. Do you anticipate testifying whether the 24 SWIM Plan correctly identifies, evaluates the 25 impacts of or-- let me back up. Correctly identifies JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 231 1 all sources of phosphorus loading into the EPA? 2 A. No. 3 Q. Do you-- do you anticipate testifying on 4 whether the SWIM Plan correctly evaluates the impact 5 of all sources of phosphorus loading into the EPA? 6 A. No. 7 Q. Do you anticipate testifying whether the 8 SWIM Plan correctly assigns remedies for all sources 9 of phosphorus loading into the EPA? 10 A. I'll be addressing some of the potential 11 remedies. 12 Q. As we discussed today? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. That's what I wanted to know. 15 Let me ask you to turn to page eight 16 (indicating). 17 A. Whatever that meant. 18 I-- 19 Q. I'm sorry, page seven and assertion 20 number eight (indicating). 21 The assertion is whether excessive 22 over-drainage caused by the federal project and not 23 addressed in the SWIM Plan, has resulted in more 24 vegetative and ecosystem damage and nutrients. 25 Doctor Coale, you're listed as a witness JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 232 1 who will testify on that subject. 2 MR. GAINES: Where is he listed? 3 Oh, I'm sorry. Yes, he is. 4 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 5 Q. Do you know what the federal project is 6 that refers to? 7 A. No, I don't. 8 Q. I'll represent to you that is the 9 Central and Southern Florida project for flood 10 control and other purposes. 11 Do you understand what that is? 12 A. Not really, no. 13 Q. Do you anticipate giving any testimony 14 concerning excessive over-drainage? 15 A. Or drainage of what? 16 A. Over-drainage-- I think I'll just maybe 17 leave it. 18 Do you anticipate giving any testimony 19 as to vegetative or ecosystem damage? 20 MR. GAINES: I can just tell you, for the 21 record, I don't believe his name should be listed 22 under that one. 23 I don't believe-- 24 MR. MACFARLANE: I'll accept that 25 representation, counsel, and move on. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 233 1 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 2 Q. To the next page, number nine, the 3 assertion is whether flooding or excess pooling 4 caused by the federal project but not addressed in 5 the SWIM Plan, has caused more vegetative or 6 ecosystem changes than nutrients. 7 Do you anticipate giving any testimony 8 on any of-- aspect of that? 9 A. No. 10 Q. You do-- 11 A. Not as far as I understand what it says. 12 Q. Do you see your name listed there? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. I would like to ask you to turn to page 15 19 (indicating). 16 A. (Witness complies.) 17 Q. Let me ask you to look at assertion 18 number 22. 19 This states whether the SWIM Plan fails 20 to identify, evaluate and consider reasonable 21 practical and less costly alternatives to STAs. 22 Let me ask you first, Doctor Coale, do 23 you anticipate giving any testimony as to whether 24 the SWIM Plan fails to identify, evaluate and 25 consider reasonable alternatives to STAs? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 234 1 A. Again, alternatives, including on-farm-- 2 Q. Is that-- 3 A. Alternatives, including on-farm 4 management practices, yes, about the reasonableness, 5 about the practicality, and not about the cost. 6 Q. And the opinion testimony you would give 7 at the hearing, would be what essentially we have 8 gone over today, correct? 9 A. Yes. 10 Q. Have you reviewed any documents, 11 including the SWIM Plan, the passages in the SWIM 12 Plan, that discuss STAs? 13 A. Can you repeat that? 14 Q. Have you reviewed any documents 15 concerning STAs, and I include the SWIM Plan? 16 A. Excluding the Palm Beach Post, Miami 17 Herald? 18 Q. Is that the limit of---- 19 A. That's about the extent of it. 20 Q. Let me ask you to look at the bottom on 21 page 19, assertion number 23, and if you look, 22 you'll see your name mentioned as giving testimony 23 in this area. 24 The assertion is, whether and to what 25 extent STAs are necessary to meet or will result in JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 235 1 compliance with State water quality standards. 2 A. No. 3 MR. GAINES: I would say yes, and this, 4 again, is the problem with having this witness 5 interpret this document, to the extent that his 6 testimony would be that the SWIM Plan underestimates 7 the effectiveness of the BMPs, then I think it would 8 tend to go to the extent that-- STAs are necessary 9 to the extent they are called for in the SWIM Plan, 10 to do anything. 11 No-- 12 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 13 Q. Doctor Coale, was that an accurate 14 statement of your understanding of what you would be 15 testifying to? 16 A. I'm not going to testify on what the 17 implication is-- the efficacy of BMPs are. 18 If they are construed to impact STAs or 19 not, that's what I'm going to talk about. 20 Q. Let me ask you, do you-- you don't 21 anticipate giving any testimony as to State water 22 quality standards? 23 A. No, I don't. 24 MR. MACFARLANE: Off the record. 25 (Off the record discussion.) JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 236 1 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 2 Q. Back on the record. 3 After the brief interruption, let me ask 4 you to turn to page 22, and look at assertion 27 5 (indicating). 6 A. Yes. 7 Q. Do you anticipate testifying on whether 8 farm BMPs, or on-farm practices or alternative 9 technologies will reduce or eliminate the need for 10 the STA program. 11 A. Again, my same answer I gave to the last 12 question, that-- I will testify as to my opinions on 13 the efficacy of on-farm BMPs and how they want to be 14 used after that, is out of my area. 15 Q. So you have-- you do not intend to give 16 any opinion testimony as to the STA program as 17 defined if the SWIM Plan, or any other-- 18 A. That is true. 19 MR. GAINES: That is true. I can tell 20 you that. 21 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 22 Q. Page 24, number 31 (indicating). 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. And if you flip the page, you'll see 25 your name listed under there (indicating). JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 237 1 The assertion whether it is premature to 2 design and construction STAs, given the present 3 level of uncertainty surrounding both the STAs 4 design criteria and underlying factors that will 5 determine STA performance, and the lack of any 6 comparable project or field result. 7 To the extent that's-- well, that would 8 be-- 9 MR. GAINES: It sounds like a true 10 statement to me. 11 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 12 Q. Do you-- to the extent that that is an 13 intelligent statement, Doctor Coale, do you 14 anticipate giving any testimony in that area? 15 A. I have no information about STA design 16 or uncertanties. 17 I think there's a lot of unanswered 18 questions regarding the effectiveness of BMPs 19 on-farm, and if that impacts design and function of 20 STAs, maybe it is-- if the unknown performance of 21 BMPs on-farm will impact STAs-- well, I don't know 22 if it does or not, then maybe it is time to go ahead 23 with the design of those STAs. 24 Q. Page 25, and again, I'm looking at 25 assertion 32 (indicating). JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 238 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. And if you'll flip over to 26, you'll 3 see your name here again, and the assertion is-- I 4 hope you're trying-- I'm not trying to put words in 5 your mouth, Doctor Coale. 6 The assertion here is whether the 7 District has determined correctly a phosphorus 8 budget for the planning area of the SWIM Plan. 9 My question to you is, do you intend to 10 offer any testimony on the phosphorus budget for the 11 EAA? 12 A. No. 13 Q. Are there any phosphorus budgets for the 14 EAA? 15 A. Not that I reviewed. 16 Q. Have you reviewed any phosphorus budgets 17 at all, for the South Florida area? 18 MR. GAINES: Ever? 19 MR. MACFARLANE: Yes, ever. I believe 20 there was some phosphorus budgets generated on 21 experimental plots. 22 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 23 Q. Okay. 24 A. That I've seen and reviewed, but nothing 25 on a production scale. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 239 1 Q. And these experimental plots, would they 2 be in either EREC or IFAS experimental plots? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. But you haven't reviewed any phosphorus 5 budgets for the water conservation areas, for 6 example? 7 A. No. 8 Q. Page 30, and assertion number five, and 9 if you'll flip the page over to number 31, you'll 10 see your name there, and the assertion is whether 11 the SWIM Plan or the implementation thereof, 12 balances environmental benefits with threats to 13 urban and agricultural areas, consistent with the 14 legislative intent of the SWIM Act, as set forth in 15 Section 373.451 (2)(a)(d), Florida Statutes, 1993. 16 Let's break this down. 17 Have you ever looked at that provision, 18 Doctor Coale? 19 MR. GAINES: Wait a minute. 20 MR. MACFARLANE: He is listed as a 21 witness who will offer testimony in that area. 22 MR. GAINES: Right, but this petition 23 also seeks resolution of the law and ultimate facts, 24 and again, even more strenuously here, I would 25 object to him being asked to make a legal JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 240 1 determination, about what legal issues-- 2 MR. MACFARLANE: I'm not-- 3 MR. GAINES: Let me finish my objection. 4 To make a legal determination as to what 5 issues, what legal issues his testimony could 6 potentially be used to address. 7 MR. MACFARLANE: I understand, but that 8 wasn't my question. I'm not asking for any-- for you 9 to speculate about any legal conclusion. 10 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 11 Q. My question is very simple. Have you 12 ever looked at that section of the Florida Statutes? 13 A. No. 14 Q. Do you anticipate giving any-- 15 A. Let me back up and say, not that I know 16 of. 17 Q. Fine. I'll accept that. 18 Do you anticipate giving any testimony 19 about balancing environmental benefits with threat 20 to urban and agricultural areas, as addressed or not 21 addressed in the SWIM Plan? 22 MR. GAINES: Same objection as before. 23 MR. MACFARLANE: You can answer, if you 24 feel you can. 25 THE WITNESS: I don't think I am. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 241 1 MR. GAINES: And let me just state for 2 the record, I believe Doctor Coale is appropriate 3 listed under this categories, and should remain 4 there. 5 MR. GAINES: Which again, illustrates the 6 difficult to trying to get him to look at a legal 7 docoument. 8 MR. MACFARLANE: It puts us in a 9 difficult position, John, because we're trying to 10 figure out what your witnesses are going to testify 11 about, and there's a real distinction how they are 12 listed in the document, and how they-- 13 MR. GAINES: If there's areas he was 14 listed in inappropriate areas, I'll tell you that. 15 MR. MACFARLANE: But that necessitates 16 that I go through these. 17 MR. GAINES: I understand. 18 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 19 Q. Let me ask you, with respect to number 20 five, Doctor Coale, do you have any opinion as to 21 whether the implementation of the SWIM Plan, would 22 threaten urban or agricultural areas? 23 MR. GAINES: To that extent that you're 24 asking him in relationship to the statutes that are 25 referenced-- JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 242 1 MR. MACFARLANE: I'm not asking him that. 2 I don't want to get into that. 3 I'm just asking him generally as a 4 citizen, do you have any opinion. 5 THE WITNESS: Now, let me say that the 6 SWIM Plan, the provisions of the SWIM Plan, are to 7 create these STAs, which I know nothing about, other 8 than from the Palm Beach Post and Herald, and they 9 will impact both, because they both are-- they are 10 altering the use of the plan, which alters the 11 community we're living in. 12 Q. Do you perceive that as a complete 13 threat? 14 A. As a threat? 15 Personally, I'm not threatened by it. 16 Q. Page 33, number ten, whether the 17 District adequately considered and addressed adverse 18 effects the SWIM Plan, or its implementation, will 19 have on the agricultural resources of the EAA and 20 the State, and correctly determined that such 21 adverse effects do not exceed the beneficial effects 22 on these resource pursuant to Section 373.455 (5), 23 Florida Statutes, 1993. 24 And my question is, again, Doctor Coale, 25 have you ever, that you can recall, reviewed that JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 243 1 section of the Florida Statutes? 2 A. Not that I can recall. 3 Q. Do you have any opinion whether the 4 District adequately considered and addressed the-- 5 well, let me back up. 6 Do you know that the SWIM Plan or its 7 implementation, will have an adverse effect on the 8 agricultural resources of the EAA? 9 MR. GAINES: I think that was just 10 answered. 11 THE WITNESS: It will all-- if it alters 12 the use of marsh land, yes, it will have some 13 effect. 14 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 15 Q. You know, I emphasized the word 16 adverse. 17 A. On the agricultural resources of the 18 EAA. 19 Q. And what is your answer? 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. And that answer is simply based upon 22 changing land use? 23 A. Land available for agricultural 24 production, if it's no longer available for 25 agricultural production, then it has impacted the JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 244 1 agricultural resources. 2 Q. Let's go over to page 34, and I believe 3 this is the last one (indicating). Number 12, where 4 the District adequately considered and addressed the 5 adverse effects of the SWIM Plan or its 6 implementation will have on local resources, and 7 correctly determined that such adverse effects do 8 not exceed the beneficial effects on these 9 resources, as required by Section 373.455(7), 10 Florida Statutes, 1993.. 11 Again, Doctor Coale, have you ever, that 12 you can recall, reviewed that section of the Florida 13 Statutes? 14 A. Not that I can recall. 15 Q. Do you have any opinion as to whether 16 the SWIM Plan or its implementation will have an 17 adverse effect on local resources? 18 A. Local resources, includes what? 19 Q. What would you understand that to be? 20 Do you have my understanding of the 21 term, local resources? 22 MR. GAINES: Well, he's already testified 23 he hasn't seen this document before. 24 THE WITNESS: I would need a definition 25 of that, before I can answer that question. JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 245 1 MR. MACFARLANE: Okay. That's fair. I 2 think we're just about done. 3 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 4 Q. Let me ask you, just to make sure we're 5 all clear here, are there any other areas on which 6 you anticipate giving testimony at the final 7 hearing, other than the ones we've covered today? 8 A. No. I don't anticipate any other areas. 9 Q. Do you anticipate being asked to review 10 other documents, that-- in other areas between now 11 and final hiring? 12 A. Not that I'm aware of at this point. 13 Q. Do you anticipate or-- do you anticipate 14 being asked to review, or have you been asked to 15 review any documents or additional materials on the 16 areas which you do anticipate giving testimony, 17 between now and final hearing? 18 A. Not that I'm aware of now. 19 Q. Doctor Coale, this is a question that 20 invariably gets asked at these depositions, but 21 we're entitled to ask it. 22 We started out by-- I started out by 23 asking you if you were-- if you had an agreement 24 with the firm of Earl, Blank, Kavanaugh and Stotts, 25 and I believe you answered yes? JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 246 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. It's a written agreement? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. Are you receiving compensation? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. Can you tell me what your compensation 7 is? 8 A. Not enough. 9 Well-- 10 MR. GAINES: Good answer. 11 THE WITNESS: It depends on the work I'm 12 doing. 13 If it's an hourly basis, it's $125 an 14 hour. 15 BY MR. MACFARLANE: 16 Q. Does that include expenses? 17 A. No, strictly hourly work. 18 Q. So what would that-- what would you 19 charge or bill for on an hourly basis? 20 A. Well, on an hourly bases, my time. 21 Q. Reviewing documents? 22 A. Yes. 23 Q. Sitting in the deposition? 24 A. Right. 25 Q. Are you receiving compensation on any JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 247 1 other basis, in connection with this litigation? 2 A. Expenses of travel, when I came. 3 That's it. 4 Q. That's it? 5 A. Yes. 6 MR. MACFARLANE: Okay. I think I have 7 nothing further, except to note that we wish to be 8 informed in the event that Doctor Coale is asked to 9 review any additional materials in connection with 10 his anticipated testimony at the final hearing, and 11 would research our right to conduct a brief 12 deposition of Doctor Coale concerning those areas, 13 and apart from that, are you-- do you waive or do 14 you wish to read? 15 MR. GAINES: We will read. 16 We don't necessarily agree to an 17 additional deposition on this record, and we will 18 read. 19 (Thereupon the deposition was concluded.) 20 21 22 23 24 25 JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 248 1 CERTIFICATE OF REPORTER 2 3 4 5 STATE OF FLORIDA: 6 COUNTY OF DADE: 7 8 I, Stan Seplin, Certified Shorthand Reporter, 9 certify that I was authorized to and did stenographically report the foregoing deposition; 10 and that the transcript is a true record of the testimony given by the witness. 11 I further certify that I am not a relative, employee, attorney, or counsel of any of 12 the parties nor am I a relative or employee of any of the parties' attorney or counsel connected with 13 the action, nor am I financially interested in the action. 14 Dated this 13th day of April, 1994. 15 Stan Seplin, CSR 16 ACKNOWLEDGMENT 17 STATE OF FLORIDA 18 COUNTY OF DADE The foregoing certificate was acknowledged 19 before me this 13th day of April 1994, by Stan Seplin, CSR, who is personally known to me. 20 21 ___________________________ 22 23 24 25 JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 249 1 READING AND SIGNING 2 3 4 I have read the above transcript, pages 1 5 through 247, and I find: (MARK ONE) 6 7 ( ) The transcript is true, correct, and completely 8 accurate. 9 10 ( ) The transcript is true, correct, and accurate, 11 except as set forth in my List of Corrections 12 attached hereto, citing page and line and reason for 13 the correction realizing that, for this purpose, I 14 am still under oath. 15 16 _______________ _________________________ 17 (DATE) Doctor Frank Jay Coale 18 19 20 Sworn to and subscribed before 21 me this______day of____________, 1994. 22 ___________________________ Notary Public 23 My Commission expires: 24 25 JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537 250 1 TO BE EXECUTED BY THE NOTARY IF THE DEPONENT DOES 2 NOT SIGN: 3 4 5 6 I hereby certify that a letter with reference to 7 reading and signing deposition was mailed to the 8 witness through his attorney, on 9 ___________________, 1994, and that the witness 10 ( ) Witness refused to sign, giving the following 11 reason: 12 ( ) Neither the witness nor his attorney has 13 responded to request to read and sign. 14 15 16 _______________ ___________________________ 17 (DATE) Notary Public 18 MY COMMISSION EXPIRES: 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 JACK BESONER & ASSOCIATES 150 WEST FLAGLER STEET, MIAMI, FL 33130 (305) 371-1537