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Deposition from United States v. SFWMD, et al., Case No. 88-1886-CIV-HOEVELER |
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Deposition from United States v. SFWMD, et al., Case No. 88-1886-CIV-HOEVELER |
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** 1
UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF FLORIDA
CASE NO. 88-1886-CIV-HOEVELER
UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, et al, )
)
Plaintiffs, )
)
vs. )
)
SOUTH FLORIDA WATER MANAGEMENT )
DISTRICT; JOHN R. WODRASKA, )
EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, SOUTH FLORIDA )
WATER MANAGEMENT DISTRICT; FLORIDA )
DEPARTMENT OF ENVIRONMENTAL REGU- )
LATION; AND DALE TWACHTMANN, )
SECRETARY, FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF )
ENVIRONMENTAL REGULATION, et al, )
)
Defendants. )
___________________________________)
- - - - - - - -
DEPOSITION OF JOEL VanARMAN,
THE WITNESS, TAKEN ON
BEHALF OF THE PLAINTIFFS
- - - - - - - -
DATE: August 24, 1990
PROFESSIONAL REPORTING SERVICE
Suite 303, 324 Datura Street
West Palm Beach, Florida 33401
(407) 659-4046
** 2
I N D E X
August 24, 1990 DIRECT
JOEL VanARMAN
By Ms. Nash 5
** 3
The deposition of JOEL VanARMAN, the witness, in the
above-entitled and numbered cause, was taken before me,
DONNA McCALLEY, Registered Professional Reporter, and
Notary Public for the State of Florida at Large, at
Suite 110, 324 Datura Street, in the City of West Palm
Beach, County of Palm Beach, in the State of Florida,
beginning at the hour of 3:47 p.m., on Friday, the 24th
of August, 1990, pursuant to the Notice in said cause
for the taking of said deposition, which is annexed to
the court file herein, on behalf of the Plaintiffs in
the above-entitled action pending in the above-named
court.
The appearances at said time and place
were as follows:
UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE
Room 868, 601 Pennsylvania Avenue, N.W.
Washington, D.C. 20044-0663
Attorneys for the Plaintiffs, U.S.A.
By BEVERLY SHERMAN NASH, ESQ.
PEEPLES, EARL & BLANK, P.A.
Suite 3636, Two South Biscayne Boulevard
Miami, Florida 33131
Attorneys for the Cities of Belle Glade
and Clewiston
By JOSEPH RICHARDS, ESQ.
SKADDEN, ARPS, SLATE, MEAGHER & FLOM
1440 New York Avenue, N.W.
Washington, D.C. 20005-2107
Attorneys for the South Florida Water
Management District
By KATHARINE STOLLMAN, ESQ.
ALLISON BURDETTE, ESQ.
** 4
APPEARANCES CONTINUED:
ALSO PRESENT: Toni Lafuente
Ray Roberts
Robert Johnson
David Buker
Frank Draughn
** 5
THEREUPON:
JOEL VanARMAN,
having been first duly sworn, as hereinafter certified,
testified as follows:
DIRECT EXAMINATION
BY MS. NASH:
Q. Would you state your name.
A. My name is--is Joel VanArman.
Q. Mr. VanArman, I'm Beverly Nash. I'm
counsel for the United States in this litigation, and
we're here to understand how the water management
district computer systems are set up, how they operate,
how data is stored on computers, kinds of data, how
that data's formatted, and you're submitted here today
as a representative of the district having knowledge of
one or more areas of inquiry that we're interested in.
Have you been shown the list of
categories?
A. Yes.
Q. And do you know which categories you've
been submitted for today?
A. Not offhand, no.
Q. I will show you the list of categories and
ask you to tell me which ones you believe you have
knowledge in.
** 6
MS. STOLLMAN: You can take your time
reading it over.
THE WITNESS: Okay.
(Witness reviews document.)
Okay, could you repeat the question,
please, or was there a question?
MS. NASH: Yes.
Would you read back the question.
(Thereupon, the question at Page 5, Line
23 through 25 was read by the Reporter as
recorded above.)
A. Okay, I think I probably have some
information concerning the first category as far as an
overview of some of the--some of the equipment the
district has, the second category there as it concerns
Xerox work stations, and I think probably that's it.
BY MS. NASH:
Q. Thank you.
What is your present title or position?
A. Presently I'm a supervising professional
in the Environmental Planning Division of the Planning
Department.
Q. And what is your job description?
A. Basically I'm responsible for supervising
professionals and other staff that do a wide range of
** 7
activities within the division, so I provide some
technicians and some professionals.
Q. Would you describe this range of
activities within the division that these employees
perform?
A. The technicians I supervise provide
technical support for any of the projects or programs
that are going on within the division. They primarily
do word processing and graphics work.
The professionals I supervise, one is a
professional scientist that does technical writing in
program coordination, and the other person is a--is a
technical editor that edits reports and publications
and so forth.
Q. What is the name of the scientist you
mentioned?
A. That's Sarah Allman.
Q. And what is the name of the technical
editor?
A. John Mulligan.
Q. How long have you been supervising
professional in the Environmental Planning Division?
A. Well, the Environmental Planning Division
has been--I guess in existence for almost one year.
Q. Have you had a prior position with the
** 8
water management district?
A. I was a supervising professional in the
Water Quality Division of the Resource Planning
Department.
Q. Have your responsibilities changed from
the time you were a supervising professional in the
Water Quality Division of Resource Planning to the
position you now have?
A. I don't think so.
Q. And how long were you a supervisinging
professional in the Water Quality Division?
A. I think it was about one year.
Q. Have you had any prior positions to that
with the water management district?
A. Yes.
Q. What position was that?
A. Prior to being the supervising
professional in the Water Quality Division, I was a
senior environmentalist in the Water Quality Division.
Q. How long were you a senior
environmentalist?
A. I think I was one year in that job.
Q. And what were your job responsibilities?
A. At that point, I was primarily responsible
for putting--putting together the information necessary
** 9
to write SWIM plans.
Q. Did you have a position prior to that in
the water management district?
A. I think prior to that I was a technical
program coordinator in the Water Use Management
Planning Division, of the Resource Planning Department.
Q. And how long were you a technical
coordinator?
A. I would--I would have to guess at that,
but I'd say it was about four or five years or so.
Q. And what were your your job
responsibilities as a technical coordinator?
A. What I was doing there was working with
developing local government assistance data books for
the various--various counties.
Q. What is your educational background?
A. I've got a Bachelors degree in biology
from Florida Atlantic University and a Master's degree
in marine biology from Florida Atlantic University.
Q. Who's your supervisor?
A. Tony Federico.
Q. You've mentioned a scientist and a
technical editor that works for you. Are there other
people that work for you?
A. There's two technicians.
** 10
Q. What are their names and job functions?
A. Sandra Formante and Debbie--Debbie Burns.
I'm sorry, there's three technicians. There's also
Lynn Gullick.
Q. What are their job responsibilities?
A. They provide technical support for the
division doing word possessing, compiling data and
doing graphics work for reports.
Q. What computers are being used in the
Environmental Planning Division?
A. I certainly don't know all of them. I
think the majority of people probably use IBM PC's, and
there's a number of Xerox work stations. There are
some GIS work stations that I think are Suns, Sun micro
system, and I think we have at least two DEC work
stations.
Q. Do you know what work is done on the DEC
work stations?
A. I don't think presently there's any work
being done on them.
Q. And you mentioned, I believe, Sun micro
systems?
A. (Witness nods.)
Q. What work is being done on the Sun micro
systems?
** 11
A. I think those are being used primarily for
the geographic information system.
Q. Do you personally do any work on the sun
micro system?
A. No.
Q. What work is being done on the Xerox work
stations?
A. The Xerox work stations are used primarily
for word--word processing and preparation of graphics
materials for reports.
Q. Do you know what software packages are
utilized on the Xerox work stations?
A. Basically we've got three kinds. There's
Viewpoint software, which is the word processing
environment. And at various times, the district has
also tested the XTE software, the Xerox development
environment and also the Xerox Artificial Intelligence
software.
Q. What use is made of the Xerox Artificial
Intelligence software?
A. We did some evaluation of that back in
1986, and at that point, it was being looked at as a
possibility for writing some expert systems
applications, but that--that apparently didn't--didn't
work out and we let our license lapse on that software,
** 12
so it's not currently being used.
Q. What about the XTE software?
A. XTE is used for writing applications
software for the Xerox computer if we were going to
write the special programs and that sort of stuff, and
it also has some monitoring tools for keeping track of
traffic on the Xerox network.
Q. And you indicated that the Viewpoint
software is used as the word processing tool?
A. That's right.
Q. Any other use made of Viewpoint?
A. It does word processing and graphics. It
has capabilities for mailing information back and forth
from one work station to another, has calendars,
clocks, calculators. It's a desktop environment.
Q. Are there any other software that you're
aware of that your division uses on the Xerox?
A. No.
Q. What use is made of the IBM PC's?
A. My understanding, from what I've seen, is
that people are using them for word--word processing
and running statistical packages and so forth.
Q. Do you know what software is utilized on
the IBM PC's?
A. Word Perfect for word processing. And
** 13
most people are using Symphony as a spread sheet. I
think the statistical work, they're using either SAS or
Sat Graphics.
Q. Are you aware of anyone in the
Environmental Planning Division that utilizes their own
software packages other than these you've mentioned?
A. There's a number of other specialized
software packages that are being used probably on the
computers. I think each person probably uses something
a little bit different for their own purposes, but I am
not aware of any specific.
Q. Do you utilize any software packages other
than those you've mentioned?
A. My computer basically has the Viewpoint
software on it, and that's all I--I use.
Q. And that's on the Xerox work station?
A. That's right.
Q. Do you transfer files to your Xerox work
station from other computers in the water management
district?
A. Yes.
Q. From which computers?
A. Basically the--the transfer that's most
commonly used is using a floppy disk so we can take a
floppy disk from a IBM PC and then transfer it over to
** 14
the Xerox. They also have a transfer arranged through
using the VAX--VAX computer that places a file into a
file drawer on the Xerox network, and we can access
that from the work stations.
Q. Does that Xerox network have a name?
A. It's the Xerox network. Does it have a
internal name, is that what you're--
Q. Yes.
A. It does, yeah.
Q. What is that name?
A. I'm not sure.
Q. Are you aware of any documentation or
manuals that exist to train or assist in your work on
the Xerox work station?
A. Yes.
Q. What is this documentation or manuals?
A. There is Xerox Systems Administrator's
Library, Xerox Technical Reference Library, there's
Xerox Users's Library.
Q. Are you aware of any manuals that are
internal to the water management district to assist in
utilizing the Xerox work stations?
A. Not manuals, no.
Q. Are there any guidelines or other
directives that are internal to the water management
** 15
district for utilizing the Xerox work station?
A. I think the network, on the network,
there's a file drawer that contains information on
district standards.
Q. Do you know whether that file drawer has a
name?
A. It's either "how to" or "standards,"
something like that.
Q. How would you go about creating a document
utilizing the Xerox work station?
A. Basically the Xerox work station has a
desktop environment to it that blank document is part
of that. You just open up the directory Icon and go
into the basic work station documents, and the blank
document is one of those. You copy that onto the
desktop and open that up and start typing, and that's
your file. You want to give it a name, you close it up
and it's stored on the work station.
Q. How would you then--how would you store
that document that you've created?
A. Well, it's automatically stored on the
work station itself. You could copy it onto a floppy
disk or you can open up the directory and access the
centralized filing system and file it.
Q. And how would you retrieve a document
** 16
previously created?
A. If you created it on your work station,
it's present right on your desktop, so you just open it
up. If it's on a floppy disk, then you take it back
off the floppy.
Q. If you wanted to utilize raw data, how
would you access the raw data?
A. The data would have to be provided in a
file format that's compatible.
Q. And what file format would that have to
be?
A. We can either read dos files,
dos-formatted files, or Xerox formatted files, which
are in file format I think is called copilot. It's
pilot or copilot, I forget.
Q. Do you know whether the computers in the
Environmental Planning Division, whether the data on
the computers is backed up?
A. Basically each person that's running the
computer is responsible for maintaining their own data,
so people back up their data onto floppy drives or--or
whatever they have available for their work station.
Q. Are there any guidelines for backing up
the data?
A. I--I don't know of any that exists as
** 17
formal guidelines, no.
Q. Do you know what data files you have
stored on your Xerox work station?
A. Yes.
Q. What are those files?
A. I don't--I don't know them by name.
Basically you open up your directory Icon on the work
station and it identifies all the files thereon.
There's probably in excess of probably a thousand files
on any given work station. Most of those are internal
to the operation of the work station itself.
Q. You indicated that among your
responsibilities, you were responsible for putting
together information necessary to write the SWIM plans?
A. That's right.
Q. Where did you pull the information from to
do that writing?
A. Most--
MS. STOLLMAN: You're--sorry, are you
referring to what computer did he pull that
information from?
MS. NASH: Yes.
A. Most of the information, most of the
computer information, that we use came from files that
were provided to us by other agencies.
** 18
BY MS. NASH:
Q. What would those agencies be?
A. I think DER was a--was the source of the
majority of those files, then the county, Dade County,
Department of Environmental Regulation Management. I
think we obtained files from Broward County and Palm
Beach County. Plus, there was other data provided to
us by consultants.
Q. And who are those consultants?
A. It was CH--CH2M Hill, Continental Shelf
Associates, I think, Greenhorn and O'Meara.
Q. In what form was the data provided to you
from DER?
A. Let's see. I didn't directly handle that
data myself. Lynn did. And I believe it came to us on
magnetic tapes.
Q. What about the data from Dade county, was
that--
A. I think that was primarily on floppy
disks.
Q. Do you know the nature of the data from
DER?
A. What we'd asked them for was a listing of
their permits that they had within our area.
Q. And what was the nature of the data from
** 19
Dade County?
A. Once again, we were asking for records of
what types of permanent permits they issued.
Q. And what was the form of the data you
received from Broward County?
A. We had asked them for their permit data,
and whether--I don't recall if we received that on
magnetic tapes or floppy disks or how that's received.
Q. What was the nature of the data from Palm
Beach County?
A. That was--that, I think, was on floppy
disks. Once again, we were asking for the data
concerning their permits.
Q. And what was the nature of the data from
CH2M Hill?
A. They provided information that went
directly into our GIS system concerning map files, and
they also provided us with information in a text format
that they compiled that was in IBM. I think those were
the two primary types.
Q. And what was the nature of the data in the
IBM text format received?
A. Let's see. That was the information
concerning the study area, a description of the study
area. See, what else was in there?
** 20
Some review of historical data, study
area, what data they had been able to obtain from
various sources.
Q. What was the nature of the data from
Continental Shelf Associates?
A. They had prepared maps for us in a GIS
format, and they gave us those data on tapes, and they
had also prepared some reports for us, so they gave us
the text information on IBM compatible diskettes.
Q. What was the types of information and the
reports that Continental Shelf Associates prepared for
you?
A. They were similar to the information we
had received from CH2M Hill. It was a description of
the study area and compilation of some of the data they
had--that they had collected, and that was it.
Q. You mentioned another consultant.
A. Greenhorn and O'Meara.
Q. What was the nature of the data?
A. They did some geographic information
system work for us. They--we had some problems with
their maps, and that information wasn't very useful.
They also compiled information in report format,
similar to what we had gotten from the other two
consultants.
** 21
Q. Do you know whether the tapes that were
received from DER are still maintained?
A. I would think they are. I--but I don't
know specifically, no.
Q. Do you know who might know?
A. I would think Lynn probably knows.
Q. Do you know whether the floppy disks from
Dade County are still maintained?
A. Once again, I would assume that they are,
and Lynn would be the person I would ask about that.
Q. What about the data from Broward County?
A. I'm a little bit hesitant about Broward
County because I don't remember specifically seeing
that data and I'm--I'm assuming that we--that we
obtained that. But I have to honestly say that I can't
remember looking at that information. But if it did
exist, Lynn would be the one that would have it.
Q. What about the data from Palm Beach
County?
A. That's basically the same situation as
with Broward County. I don't remember specifically
looking at that information, but Lynn would be the
person that would have that.
Q. That was Lynn Gullick?
A. That's right.
** 22
Q. What about the data that was received from
CH2M Hill, that still maintained?
A. As--I don't--I don't personally know where
it is. The GIS system data was turned over to either
Bob Brown or Brent Moll.
Q. That was turned over--
A. Pardon?
Q. --to who?
A. It was turned over to either Bob Brown or
Brent Moll. And I'm assuming that they would be the
ones that have that information. The text data, I
think Sarah has that in computer format.
Q. And what about the data from Continental
Shelf Associates?
A. Once again, the GIS data was turned over
to our GIS people, and I think Sarah's keeping the
electronic copy of that information.
Q. And the data from Greenhorn?
A. We--the computer data, the GIS computer
data from Greenhorn and O'Meara, I'm not sure if that
was in a usable format or not. We had some problems
with it, and I don't know if those were ever completely
worked out. We received a large amount of paper
material from them, and I think that's still being
kept. I think David Swift has that.
** 23
The computer files, I--I think probably
Dave has those, those, letters.
Q. Did you receive any information from
within the water management district that you utilized
in putting together the SWIM plans?
A. In computer format?
Q. Yes.
A. I think there was water quality data and
hydrologic data that were used for some of the analyses
for the SWIM plan. I wasn't part of that process. I
was involved with the documentation end of it, not the
analysis of data. I don't really know what data were
obtained or how the analysis was conducted.
Q. Do you know who was--who did the analyses
part?
A. I think we relied on the other people in
the water quality division at that time. I think it
was Dave Soballe and Brad Jones. And I think Guy
Germain was responsible for part of that, that
analysis.
Q. What did you say your part of the process
was?
A. Writing up--writing up the report itself,
doing the documentation, word processing.
Q. And you wrote up that documentation using
** 24
the information that you've already described from
outside sources; is that correct?
A. That's right, yes.
Q. Did you utilize any information in writing
up the report that you received from within the water
management district?
A. Well, we used quite a number of different
reports and publications. But there was nothing else
that was--that was in electronic format that I can
think of. I can't remember reading anything.
Q. Do you recall what those reports and
publications were?
A. The--no, they're listed in volumes two and
three of the everglades plan. There's probably several
hundred of them.
(Discussion off the record.)
BY MS. NASH:
Q. So you said there were probably several
hundred--
A. --hundred references and reports.
Q. Did you do your writing on the Xerox work
station?
A. Yes.
Q. Do you maintain copies of what you've
written?
** 25
A. There's a copy of it that's maintained on
the work station.
Q. What did you do with what you wrote once
you finished it?
MS. STOLLMAN: Could you clarify that?
MS. NASH: On the work on the SWIM plan
that he was doing.
A. Once the--once the file is created on the
work station, we just send to it the lazer printer and
it prints out, and we--any further copies of it that we
make, we usually send to the print shop and have them
duplicate that.
BY MS. NASH:
Q. When were you doing this writing of the
SWIM plan documentation?
A. I think we started in about April,
probably March or April of 1988, and we've been writing
ever since.
Q. You worked on the subsequent drafts?
A. Yes.
MS. NASH: Get off the record here for a
moment.
(Discussion off the record.)
MS. NASH: We're gonna break and resume
at--
** 26
MS. STOLLMAN: What time is convenient for
you on Monday morning?
THE WITNESS: I don't care.
MS. STOLLMAN: We've been starting at ten.
If you prefer to start earlier than that, we
could do that.
THE WITNESS: Well, I prefer to start
earlier, if we could do that, yeah.
MS. NASH: 9:30?
THE WITNESS: 9:30, okay.
MR. RICHARDS: That's fine with me.
(Whereupon, the deposition was concluded
at 4:19 p.m.)
